Coaching Philosophies and the Gregg Berhalter System

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by Susaeta, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    We had 9’s?
     
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  2. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    I think it's fair to say that Berhalter kind of made a hash of the weakest position in our pool. But even if he'd picked 'em as well as Pep, the difference likely wouldn't have been transformative, maybe not even that significant. The bigger problem wasn't Berhalter picking the wrong guys so much as our lack of the right guy or guys to pick.
     
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  3. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    Point taken -- it's funny to think how everything looked as the beginning of Gregg's tenure...

    Here are each of the 9s that Berhalter played during his tenure, and what their prospects were from the early days of Berhalter's time:

    - Altidore actually looked pretty lively early on, even though it was pretty well understood that he wasn't the future.
    - Zardes was one of the most experienced options available.
    - Sargent was tearing up youth ranks looking like the potential answer at the position.
    - Pepi and Gio Reyna didn't have a professional minute to their name, but they were hopefuls.
    - Pefok was firmly hoping to play for France.
    - Ferreira was not a US citizen.
    - Vasquez was a squad player, at best.
    - Wright was playing youth games at Schalke.
    - Hoppe was a player nobody had heard of.
    - Dike was playing in college and not really scoring a ton of goals there.
    - Ebobisse was early in his gen adidas contract.
    - Akinola was mocked even on his performance as a youth player.
    - Gioacchini was a complete unknown.
    - Ramirez was a known but unimpressive commodity.
    - Soto was a typical overrated youth player.

    Certainly not a whole lot to work with there, but the thing is that it is still a very young group.
     
  4. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Gregg System: don't score goals

     
  5. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #8480 xbhaskarx, Feb 6, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2023
    Two new coaching vacancies at clubs in top five leagues, and Americans are among the names linked to both of them... could it be coaching genius Gregg Berhalter and his vaunted Gregg System? No, it's Chris Armas* (Leeds) and Pellegrino Matarazzo (Hoffenheim)...
    Has Gregg been linked to ANY coaching positions (besides Earnie Stewart saying he's in consideration to return as USMNT coach) since he entered the job market? Do Euro clubs not realize what high esteem Gregg is held in by most around here??







    *interim
     
  6. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hard to believe Tedesco would get another shot with anyone.
     
  7. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Pickings are a lot more slim when you are looking to hire a coach for a national team.
     
  8. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Remember this when we pick someone underwhelming. I mean Belgium needs to turn everything over now and we may actually have better talent but I'm guessing most Euro coaches would much rather stay in Europe than go to America. We need one of those adventurous types that welcome a big change and want to leave their mark in history by taking a team farther than it's ever gone. I know bit pep and Klopp aren't realistic but the way there seasons and teams are headed it does seem a bit more of a chance than even a month ago.
     
  9. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The most realistic European name I’ve heard is Joachim Low and that’s mostly because he’s said he wants to coach and he doesn’t seem to have a ton of interest in Europe at currently.

    Any European coach we going to get is going to be someone who is either older or burned out from the club game, and looking to get away from the day to day of club soccer. Even then it’d probably be someone who has some specific interest in coaching in the US.
     
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  10. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not sure why? He is a very young coach who has already taken 2 German Clubs to the Champions League and gave RBL its first major trophy. His 2 years at Spartek was also considered successful.

    Tedesco is considered one of the brightest young tactical nerds in the game. If that is what a club is looking for then he fits the bill. For folks who like Berhalter because they believe he is "tactical", they will love Tedesco.
     
  11. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    I'm filing Tedesco under "Coaching Philosophies and the Berhalter system".
     
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  12. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Last cycle had interest from coaches who weren't old or burned out. If the US want to get a good coach, it can. But the good old boys network is strong.
     
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  13. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I still remember him at Schalke where he looked good for one year and then the rest of the league figured him out and he started being the nerd that tries so hard to be cute but nothing worked.
     
  14. Ball Chucking Hack

    Jan 21, 2005
    Raleigh, NC
    I'm just curious. I heard the Tata and Lopetegui stories. Were there more?
    (Honest question. Not disputing the basic premise that the last search was not particularly far or wide.)
     
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  15. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I also heard Pareja got a phone interview but no official has ever added more to the rumors that have been discussed here. Stewart seems like a very tight lipped person though so who knows what went on behind the scenes or for that matter what is and will be going on now. Probably a good idea to not be known as a federation that leaks details of discussions as that could really keep some coaches from even stating theoretical interest.
     
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  16. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tata Martino definitely wanted the job but he was MLS based at the time. There was some talk of Lopetegui interest but its unclear if that would have progressed to him actually being willing to take the job once he'd had a conversation about what the job entailed and how much it would pay.

    By all means we should kick the tires on all plausible options in terms of coaches and sound out who may be interested. But also be realistic in terms of the types of coaches who are likely to have interest. Cast a wide net but know that you are going to hear alot of people say no.
     
  17. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Moyes was the other name supposedly interested.

    I'm 95% sure Lopetegui's interest wasn't real, but rather a push / salary move with where he ended up.

    But maybe Moyes was more interested. Or maybe someone took his trip to the US as something more than it was (I think he came to NYC in that time).
     
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  18. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A lot more nuance to Tedesco. He came to Schalke with 8 months of professional managing experience in BL2 where he saved Aue from relegation. Schalke was picked to finish 7th to 12th in the BuLi in '17 to '18 (Weston's first season) and Tedesco wildly exceeded expectations with a 2nd place finish just behind Bayern. Tedesco is a highly respected tactical nerd.

    His 2nd season he lost 4 starters including our best player to transfers, had a ton of injuries and was fired with a month to go and the board worried about relegation. That is life in a top 5 league, managers get fired juas ask Ancelotti at Bayern.

    Tedesco is Berhalter, except with the ability to design tactical schemes that actually make sense and leverage the best players in his roster.
     
  19. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Still to me Belgium should be able to do better than the sort of Euro Berhalter. maybe the pool of coaches sees them going through a down cycle.
     
  20. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    I mean, they are. Or at least that Golden Generation is largely done.
     
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  21. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Moyes seems like someone who interest very much could have been legitimate. At the time his stock in Europe was very much down as well.
     
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  22. gomichigan24

    gomichigan24 Member+

    Jul 15, 2002
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And it's not at all clear whether the next generation is at the same level for them.
     
  23. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    It's funny how that works too. The system for developing kiddos is then celebrated as that golden generation arrives, and then, ummm, what happened to that genius system? Was it never a genius system, and they just were the beneficiaries of randomness? Who knows, but there's plenty of evidence that they're moving back towards some amalgam of 1994-2010 Belgium, rather than 2012-2022 Belgium. Some Belgium of that era was pretty good, but yeah, the '12-'22 was the high water mark for talent for them. In fairness to them, I thought they achieved, for the most part, quite a bit for that golden generation. You compare it to England of the 1998-2010 era which never made it past the quarters and even missed outright at least one Euro if memory serves and its way better than them.

    WC '14 QF's, losing to eventual finalist Argentina.

    WC '18: SF's losing 1-0 to eventual champion France.

    Euro '20: Lost to eventual champion Italy in the Quarterfinals 2-1.

    Honestly, if not for the idiotic 1-3 loss to Wales in the Quarters of Euro '16, it would be hard not to argue that Belgium for the most part maximized their potential. They're 3 tournament losses w/that Golden generation were all to eventual finalists, and 2 of the 3 tournament losses were to tournament champions. They weren't crashing out against meh sides like England had a habit of doing (Germany in '10, Portugal of '06, Portugal of '04, failing to even qualify for Euro '08 finishing behind freaking Russia and Croatia in qualifying) with their last golden generation, other than the '16 pratfall they basically played like a top side in every tournament but we're never quite the top side. France was better in 2018, Argentina was better in 2014, I don't think Italy was better in '20, but with Spinazzola healthy that Italian team played dozens of games in a row without a loss until the wheels fell off in '22.

    I'm not arguing with you btw, just responding to a theme I heard after the Euro's in 2021 when there was a belief that Belgium's golden generation had failed them when honestly, for Belgium to get as far as they did in 3 of the 4 tournaments was quite impressive, especially considering how they were knocked out. Hell even Wales, a fraud in my view, even then, played out of their heads that tourney, and collected plenty of scalps.

    But what happens next is probably a bit of a bummer, they fall into a poor man's Switzerland and below rank of sides that may or may not make the knockouts of major tournaments going forward until they have another bubbling up like this one.
     
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  24. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tedesco's philosophy and approach is similar to Berhalter. as far as tactical focus. Tedesco's management accomplishments far exceeds Berhalter. Tedesco has managed 3 clubs Schalke, Spartek, and Leipzig, including 2 top 4/top 4 clubs to the UCL. That is a very impressive resume for your first 3 jobs as a manager.

    Belgium must believe that they need a young (36yo) manager with a strong tactical and analytics focus for their next generation. One of his strengths is he gets along, communicates, and relates very well with the players.

    IMO, Dolo has a similar profile as far as relating to players.
     
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  25. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    Among the European nations, Germany is probably the most closely aligned to the US from a footballing culture perspective. England seems like the obvious answer, but the English see themselves as far, far superior (they probably are), so there isn't much respect there.

    Low seems like a decent fit and a realistic get.
     
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