Post-match: Thank You Greg Berhalter

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by FoxBoro 143, Dec 3, 2022.

  1. eagercolin

    eagercolin Member

    Metro
    United States
    Aug 25, 2017
    Buffalo
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes -- let's have a manager who can look at the pool with fresh eyes and is more focused on tactics (and tactical flexibility) than culture, which can be handled by a group of increasingly experienced and bonded players.
     
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  2. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Member+

    Nov 10, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    I think he did some good rebuilding the team and I think his calmer personality helped a younger team. Gregg won two trophies many didn't think we would win.

    Frustrating game at times but I think it's best for both parties to move on
     
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  3. olephill2

    olephill2 Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Club:
    Watford FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Solid thread and lots of good sentiments here. I think Gregg Berhalter has been a solid coach and I appreciate how we've played in this World Cup. He deserves a lot of credit for that. I have mixed feelings about bringing him back for another cycle. I think Berhalter's record is solid and he deserves a lot of credit, but we know we've had poor outcomes with coaches who stick around for two cycles. To me, the only American coach who would be a clear upgrade is Jesse Marsch. We have a wonderful opportunity to make a deep run in 2026, so if Berhalter does leave, it's critical that we don't screw up the next coaching hire.

    I'd probably give Berhalter a B+ overall for the cycle.

    The Good:
    • He integrated a lot of young players mostly beginning in 2020. Berhalter wasn't afraid to play young guys in big matches, and he deserves a lot of credit for going young and building for the long-term.
    • He recognized that team spirit and culture were missing during the 2018 cycle and job #1 was to build a team of brothers who'd be wiling to fight for each other. He brought back the American spirit we hadn't really seen in earnest since 2010. A+ result here.
    • He was an outstanding recruiter. Yunus Musah and Sergino Dest were huge "gets" for our program. Ricardo Pepi and Malik Tillman have a lot of promise -- Pepi already was instrumental in our WCQ campaign. We lost Jonathan Gonzalez, David Ochoa and Efrain Alvarez to Mexico, but the jury is still out on whether any of those guys will be greatly missed by our program.
    • Winning the 2021 Nations League final against Mexico + the 2021 Gold Cup. Berhalter swung the axis of power in the US-Mexico rivalry back to us, after Mexico had largely been the superior team since 2011 (with the exception of the 2014 WCQ competition).
    • He brought a vision and tactical identity to the squad that had been lacking in previous cycles, particularly under Jurgen Klinsmann.
    • He brought a lot of defensive solidity to the squad in 2021-2022. Our defensive performance in the Group Stage was magnificent and unprecedented in US World Cup history. We were stout defensively throughout the 2021 Gold Cup and WCQ, despite completely turning over our backline from the previous cycle save for DeAndre Yedlin.
    • His player selections after 2019 were mostly pretty good. There were rarely any screams for players who were criminally ignored. There were no Landon Donovan 2014 omissions or Sacha Kljestan/Benny Feilhaber/Lee Nguyen 2015-2016 omissions. I do think he made a few mistakes filling out the back-end of his roster for the World Cup as I posted here earlier today and he showed a bit too much loyalty at times to guys like Gyasi Zardes and Cristian Roldan, but his player selections typically weren't bad. John Brooks, Alan Sonora and Djordje Mihailovic are probably the only guys who can have a legitimate gripe with their love from Gregg this cycle.
    The Bad:
    • I do think 2019 was a poor year for Berhalter. His player selections were extremely puzzling and concerning (Daniel Lovitz, Nick Lima, Jonathan Lewis, etc.) and his tactics were all over the map. 2019 would have been a great year to start integrating more of the youngsters in earnest.
    • Our attack struggled at times throughout the cycle, particularly when teams would bunker on us or cede possession and force us to break them down. With our player pool, I think we should have committed more fully to be a high-pressing, high-energy (against weaker opposition) and counter-attacking (against superior opposition) team. Our transition game under Gregg was not as good as it was under Bob Bradley or Bruce Arena.
    • We probably don't know the full story, but I think Gregg made a mistake banishing John Brooks from the program. Brooks was prone to boneheaded mistakes in WCQ matches, but was generally an excellent tournament player for us (2014 World Cup, 2016 Copa America). I realize he has been out of form due to going without a club over the summer and into the early fall, so maybe it's a moot point. But the way we played at this World Cup would have minimized Brooks' weaknesses.
    • While goal #1 in 2021 was to qualify for the World Cup, I don't think we should feel thrilled about finishing tied for 3rd in the Octagonal. We should aspire to be better than that. That said, Gregg did need to manage through a barrage of injuries throughout the Ocho -- that bad luck would have doomed US teams in previous cycles, IMO.
     
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  4. Grumpy in LA

    Grumpy in LA Bringing It Since 1807™

    Sep 10, 2007
    Chicago
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yep. He did a lot of things right and was a class act while doing it. He’s set us up well so that a better coach can step in and help the team to the next level.

    Now my worry is whether we’ll actually get a better coach. There are some out there. But there aren’t nearly as many as some of our more, um, insistent fans think, especially not ones who are both available and genuinely interested.
     
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  5. Guinho

    Guinho Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes, bless their hearts
    Estonia
    May 27, 2001
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    well, perhaps for people who are 20 years old and don’t remember anything before 2018, awesome. Some of us are old enough to remember the many many times do United States has made it to the round of 16. This is no different than five of the last eight tournaments. Berhalter didn’t deliver any results that weren’t exactly the most common result for the US since 1994. Frankly, 2002 was the best result ever, and arguably the YEs had a better performance on 2010 and 2014, getting at least into extra time. So, of the last 8 results, this came in fourth or fifth overall.
     
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  6. Guinho

    Guinho Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes, bless their hearts
    Estonia
    May 27, 2001
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    And we ignore 1994, 2002, 2010, and 2014 in order to pretend that Berhalter is somehow some miraculous coach? That’s absurd.
     
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  7. Guinho

    Guinho Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes, bless their hearts
    Estonia
    May 27, 2001
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Sure thing. Always happy to reflect, you know, actual reality.
     
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  8. spot

    spot Member+

    Nov 29, 1999
    Centennial
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, we were pretty sure we saw the 2006 roster after 2002. We kind of did and it should have been refreshed.
     
  9. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I just wanna say that "automatically negative" is simply untrue.

    negative as a result of errors/gaffes/mistakes/inaccuracies/inadequacies etc is how it feels for me/....

    Louis Van Gall is a great coach.
     
  10. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    I think Jesse would be an upgrade if we're going to stick with a gegenpressing style. He manages that style very well, better than Berhalter, but he is rather dogmatic about it. Culturally, he's a perfect fit, even more so than Berhalter himself. But if you want a manager that prefers the press but is flexible enough to win other ways, then Marsch might not so easily be the one best choice.

    I'm putting his name in the hat in any case. Right now, I think we ARE best-suited to the gegenpressing style. I just don't know that we will be in 4 years.
     
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  11. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
     
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  12. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    Absolutely. A number of people in this group have screamed and hollered for Martino, for Herdman ffs, for Roberto Martinez...
     
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  13. Grumpy in LA

    Grumpy in LA Bringing It Since 1807™

    Sep 10, 2007
    Chicago
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, give credit where credit is due. As Dan Loney just pointed out in another thread, Tata Martino finally managed to break Mexico’s streak of getting eliminated in the Round of 16.

    And Herdman has never been eliminated during the Round of 16.
     
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  14. The Clientele

    The Clientele Member+

    Portland Timbers
    Jun 25, 2005
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was reading through the England National team forum. The comment was made that our pressing style suited our young players right now. But will it suit them as they age a bit was the question?

    I like Jesse but he does seem doctrinaire with one style of play. I do think we need some tactical flexibility moving forward…
     
  15. ChambersWI

    ChambersWI Member+

    Nov 10, 2010
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Having followed Martinez the common trend of any team he has had is they start strong and then taper off very quickly. Happened with Everton and Wigan as well (though he did win an FA Cup against a lackadaisical Man City).

    If/when we move on for Gregg I THINK the top 3 MLS candidates are Cherundolo, Wolff, and Curtain... all of whom have connections to Earnie Stewart. If we don't go the MLS route I, somewhat ironically, expect us to pursue a Dutch coach
     
  16. The Clientele

    The Clientele Member+

    Portland Timbers
    Jun 25, 2005
    Portland, Oregon
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He really is. I think his game plan today was spot on.
     
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  17. Marko72

    Marko72 Member+

    Aug 30, 2005
    New York
    I've been thinking the same thing. All three of those guys are athletic beasts, and there's a decent chance that they'll still be athletic beasts in 4 years, but maybe not to the same degree. It's a matter open to debate, and at this point there's not a clearly correct answer. Which is why I think we need a guy who likes the press but isn't ideologically married to it.
     
  18. bakerkdb

    bakerkdb Member

    Sep 6, 2010
    Club:
    Norwich City FC
    Van Gaal must have giggled when he realized Berhalters plan was exactly what he was hoping for. The Dutch have been quite happy to cede possession and clinically counter throughout the tournament. We just went merrily figure skating into a ice hockey game. I fully understand the whole “ establishing a style” thing but this is the freaking World Cup, you do what you need to do to progress.
    Berhalter took over after 2018 debacle but he also inherited the Most talented generation of players the US has ever produced and didn’t really get any better results. Let’s get someone new in. Thanks Gregg
     
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  19. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    Your assumptions are wrong. Did you think that the other "5 out of 8" times that we advanced felt sustainable? That's as ridiculous as your assumption that I haven't been involved with the game for longer than you based on BS join dates.

    1994 was great, but it was new ground. 1998 was us crashing back to reality. 2002 was amazing and seemed like something that was the start of something. 2006 was a huge disappointment. 2010 was almost disastrous but was rescued by a miracle. 2014 was meh, but we kinda got the job done. Then the disastrous 2018. Our recent history has been a roller coaster of decent highs and piss poor lows.

    We are finally at a point where we can have expectations for what we can accomplish on the world's stage. We were much better in this World Cup than in any other, save maybe 2002. 2002 would get more credit if it had not been followed up in 2006 by disappointment. Looking back on the 2002 and 2006 teams, we can see that we were not able to sustain any sort of success. That was actually evident in the way we played back then.

    This is a completely new era. We might not have gotten to the quarters, but we also didn't have the fortune of playing Mexico in the round of 16. This team is way ahead of where we were in 2002. We should expect better in 2026.
     
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  20. Guinho

    Guinho Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes, bless their hearts
    Estonia
    May 27, 2001
    San Francisco, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    When I started following this, the internet didn’t exist yet.
    If you had been watching all this time you’d know this team isn’t ahead of 2002 at all. The actually pushing forward and put three goals past Portugal, bossed Mexico on neutral ground and went toe to toe with Germany. This team was lucky to get past Iran and escape the group. Yes, they stymied England for 90 minutes and then got shredded by Holland. Even 2014 performed better. This was very comparable to 2010 where we got lucky after a nervy second half.

    sorry, but no. This team is just another iteration of the same old USMNT we have known for years. I expect 2026 will be better since we are at home and get pot 1 seeding. That’s it.
     
  21. Master O

    Master O Member+

    Jul 7, 2006
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Knowing USSF, they'll probably pick another idiot as coach.
     
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  22. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    If you look at the player pools and actually understand how player development has evolved in this country over the decades, you would understand that we are very far ahead of where we were in 2002. That team was good, but it's success was not sustainable. What we have now is simply a foundation that we can actually build off of. It's not only sustainable, it's the ground floor.
     
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  23. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Didn't 2014 break all sorts of statistical records for how other teams dominated the US?
     
  24. nbarbour

    nbarbour Member+

    Jun 19, 2006
    Washington DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thank you Gregg for getting us to the World Cup and out of the group. I hope you do well in your next role.
     
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  25. dlokteff

    dlokteff Member+

    Jan 22, 2002
    San Francisco, CA
    @Guinho. Which is, it? You say here we haven't progressed since 2002. Yet, you've been spouting all the last 2 weeks how your expectations are so high since you've been following so long and we are so much better than then. Incongruous.
     

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