Knock, knock, knocking on Berhalter’s Door: Guys on the Fringe

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by Eleven Bravo, Jul 2, 2021.

  1. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    every coach in the history of the world has had players that were his guys its not new and you can't rotate 10 new players in every window.
     
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  2. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    He better be if he wants to make it. Sands is mainly a defensive presence. Cappis is more of a 2-way midfielder.
     
  3. manfromgallifrey91

    Swansea City
    United States
    Jul 24, 2015
    Wyoming, USA
    Club:
    Southampton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gooch has the most chances created per 90, 3rd most key passes and most chance creating carries from a wing spot. Worse league than MLS but not by a lot. Seems as though he could be Arriola with a finishing touch.
     
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  4. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    he is in league one lol, its a much worse league then mls and he just isn't good enough.
     
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  5. manfromgallifrey91

    Swansea City
    United States
    Jul 24, 2015
    Wyoming, USA
    Club:
    Southampton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's your opinion. I disagree. Mls is probably a top 20 league while League one is around 30. Top end of the League one would be comparable to low MLS teams. As far as good enough, nearly anyone is good enough if Lewis can start a competitive game.
     
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  6. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It’s harsh. But I’d have a hard pass on him until he improves his league. I understand that League One is better than the USL, but it’s nowhere near the level we want him to be at.
     
  7. manfromgallifrey91

    Swansea City
    United States
    Jul 24, 2015
    Wyoming, USA
    Club:
    Southampton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not harsh, I'm not really someone who puts a lot of stock into league strength. I see qualities of a player outside of competition. Technically you can be worse against better players. But if you have a good first touch, contribute dangerous passes with vision, and positionally are sound those carry over. I dont think I rate him as a top player. But I would definitely take him over Arriola and Lewis. Maybe even konrad (I just don't care much for Konrads game right now, it's potential but it's not there). Dudes played on crap fields and against hacking teams, would be ideal for a spot start or sub minutes down in Honduras, Panama, El Salvador, etc.
     
  8. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I don't have an issue with Gooch, I just can't justify calling him up to the USMNT over others.

    There are a bunch of MLSers excelling that I'd even call up ahead of him right now. Jesus Ferreira and that crowd. Jesus can play as a winger, a #10, and as a #9.

    What's in a player like Gooch's favor? There were a bunch of U20 American attackers that were knocking on the door that seem to have hit the proverbial wall. Caden Clark, Cade Cowell, and that crowd. Exploded onto the scene, and have fizzled recently.
     
  9. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    But no one liked Lewis starting? I'm not sure "he's as good as Jonathon Lewis" is a rallying cry.

    I'm all for giving guys a shot, so you won't hear me object ... winger just happens to be pretty darn deep right now.
     
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  10. manfromgallifrey91

    Swansea City
    United States
    Jul 24, 2015
    Wyoming, USA
    Club:
    Southampton FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It is deep, I just mentioned Lewis to say that if we are scrapping that low, seems like a player like Gooch (who is miles ahead of Lewis) would get a call. I'm not advocating for a start or even minutes, but I do believe with our winger pool, what they lack and what Gregg asks for, he could be a 25th-30th player fringe guy which is why I brought him up here.
     
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  11. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Lynden Gooch has 0 goals and 1 assists in 629 minutes of action. He's not even Paul Arriola at that level.
     
  12. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    #187 IndividualEleven, Oct 23, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
    Jesus Ferreira: 6 goals and 5 assists in his last 15 matches. Already has NT experience. Can play striker the way GGG wants it played. Zardes is injured. Hoppe didn't make today's gameday roster.

    Scally: has been locked in as a starter for Gladbach. Has been playing well.

    Miazga: Was it the recent marriage? Was it that his contract was going into its last year? Was it just maturity? Whatever it was, he has seemingly turned his European career around. McKenzie has been some kind of rotational starter with Genk. Brooks went off with knock in today's match.

    Vines: I don't have a preference between him and Bello. But Vines would be solid pick.

    Sargent: Zardes is injured. Pulisic is out. Pefok hasn't been scoring. Hoppe hasn't been getting minutes

    Brian White: has been scoring, but his style is anti-GGG. Best to wait until January Camp.

    Mihailovic: Reyna is out. Busio got injured, today. Acosta and Sands aren't 8s or 8/10s. Don't be stupid to bring up the Olympic Qualifying.

    Aaron Herrera: can play rb and rcb. Has been having an outstanding season.

    Fafa Picault: 11g 5a. he has done so on a weak team. Looks to have the physicality and athleticism to immediately fit in.
     
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  13. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would prefer Sabbi over Picault.
     
  14. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Sabbi's numbers don't merit him consideration.
     
  15. rgli13

    rgli13 Member+

    Mar 23, 2005
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    can we bring up that hes never been good at any intl level? or that its taken him like 5 years to be even vaguely consistent in mls (which i only mention because thats where he plays)?

    i mean, hes clearly having his best season as a pro and whenever we have a chance to bring some new guys in (absolutely not a qualifier) i dont care if hes one of them- but hes roughly kelyn rowe to me.

    you dont get to pick and choose whats relevant.
     
  16. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    You can bring up whatever the hell you want to bring up. Who the hell told you you couldn't? What you bring up may constitute a ridiculous argument, but that's cool.
     
  17. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    player of the month for a first division euro club isnt good enough for usmnt?

    he just had the game tying assist in the last minut of his last match

    what more can he do?

    if you think its all about stats....i disagree.
     
  18. adam tash

    adam tash Member+

    Jul 12, 2013
    Barcelona, Spain
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    i agree about gooch...he actually played for the USMNT before and to me he looked like an arriola with touch who can finish....gooch has actually played and played decently in the EPL before...hes good enough for any level.

    the thing about a player's club level is that any individual player cannot play well enough to change what level their club is at...thats not how it works....

    its not like player x is doing well in league one so now all of a sudden he is in the epl....

    its not like gooch could just play better and become an epl player....that doesnt really work that way.

    i would like to see gooch over arriola or lewis as well.
     
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  19. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Players in good form, but may/may not receive a call up...

    • Brad Guzan, Still hot even if he’s been out of the oven
    • Gabriel Slonina, Starting to ignite
    • Joe Scally, Makes hell look cold
    • Aaron Herrera, Hot
    • Kyle Duncan, Very warm
    • Brooks Lennon, Starting to get hot
    • Matt Miazga, Was hot, but cooling off now
    • Cameron Carter-Vickers, Catching Fire
    • DeJuan Jones, Very hot
    • Kevin Paredes, Cooling off some after a very hot season
    • John Tolkin, Cooling off some after a very hot season
    • Christian Cappis, Catching Fire
    • Luca de la Torre, Catching Fire
    • Tanner Tessman, Starting to heat up
    • Konrad de la Fuente, Hot
    • Matthew Hoppe, Cooling off
    • Niko Gioacchini, Lukewarm
    • Julian Green, Someone put back into the freezer
    • Djordje Mihailovic, Hot
    • Alan Sonora, Warm the last time I checked
    • Jesus Ferreira, Scorching
    • Paxton Pomykal, Starting to thaw
    • Richy Ledezma & Jordan Morris, just pulled from the freezer... we don’t know what kind of freezer burn they have.
    • Caden Clark & Cade Cowell, Cooled off after starting off hot... getting warm again
    • Daryl Dike, Catching Fire
    • Josh Sargent, Disappointingly lukewarm
    • Jordan Pefok, Haven’t checked the oven in awhile
     
  20. Eleven Bravo

    Eleven Bravo Member+

    Atlanta United
    United States
    Jul 3, 2004
    SC
    Club:
    Atlanta Silverbacks
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I would say, Besides Scally, the fringe players who are in the best form right now are Christian Cappis, Jesus Ferreira, Aaron Herrera, Daryl Dike, Djordje Mihailovic, Luca de la Torre, Cameron Carter-Vickers, Gabriel Slonina, and DeJuan Jones. Ferreira, Dike, and Cappis are probably too hot to ignore.
     
  21. NietzscheIsDead

    NietzscheIsDead Member+

    NO WAR
    United States
    May 31, 2019
    NO WAR
    I’d like to see Luca DLT, Alan Sonora, Dike, and Jesus Ferreira called in for this one.
     
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  22. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I'm not sure why De la torre is on the list.
    He was on the last WCQing roster, and nothing in his play since suggests he'll be replaced.

    Ferreira and Dike have multiple USMNT caps under Berhalter. So I think both stand a reasonable chance for inclusion.

    Outside of Scally, I don't see any uncapped players being included this time.

    I mean, what is the likelihood of Alan Sonora being called up for a WCQer for his first ever US involvement on any level? I'm not sure he's ever met any other USMNT player. I mean, at least Joe Scally played with Pepi, Busio, Reyna, Bello, etc. at the U17 level. [Which by the way..................was only two years ago at the 2019 U17 World Cup.]
     
  23. LouisZ

    LouisZ Member+

    Oct 14, 2010
    Southern California-USA
    Club:
    FC Barcelona
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was looking forward to that tournament and the boys underperformed.
    back then I didn't think Scally anything special, and look at him now.
     
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  24. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Indeed. As we always say...................a lot of development happens after that U17 level. And of course a large majority of our USMNT never played at the U17 level. Chris Richards, Brenden Aaronson, the list goes on and on. Hell, Clint Dempsey didn't appear for the U17s once.

    I understand why we Americans watch the U17s so carefully. We're searching for the next stars. At the same time we recognize that it isn't really indicative of anything. Andrew Carleton stood out at the U17 level for the US, and he's a bench player on a bad team in Costa Rica right now.
     
  25. ttrevett

    ttrevett Member+

    Apr 2, 2002
    Atlanta, GA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Didn't realize that Carleton is out of the league at this point. What a disastrous MLS career for the kid. Wasn't too long ago that he was being hyped for the USMNT. 80% of the game is half mental. Kid needs a sports shrink.
     

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