2020 MLS Playoffs Play-In and Round 1

Discussion in 'MLS Referee Forum' started by rh89, Nov 20, 2020.

  1. rh89

    rh89 Member

    Sep 29, 2015
    OR
    11/20/20
    New England Revolution vs Montreal Impact
    Gillette Stadium (6:30PM ET)
    REF: Jair Marrufo
    AR1: Corey Rockwell
    AR2: Jose Da Silva
    4TH: Rubiel Vazquez
    VAR: Alan Kelly
    AVAR: Tom Supple

    Nashville vs Inter Miami
    Nissan Stadium (9PM ET)
    REF: Ismail Elfath
    AR1: Corey Parker
    AR2: Kyle Atkins
    4TH: Dave Gantar
    VAR: Daniel Radford
    AVAR: Fabio Tovar
     
  2. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Twellman's giving me a headache.
     
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  3. JasonMa

    JasonMa Member+

    Mar 20, 2000
    Arvada, CO
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Evergreen post
     
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  4. rh89

    rh89 Member

    Sep 29, 2015
    OR
    "This should be offsides!" "The referee needs to get control of this game."
     
  5. sulfur

    sulfur Member+

    Oct 22, 2007
    Ontario, Canada
    I think my favourite was when a Nashville player was maybe 5-8m in an offside position... the Miami player cut out the pass and it went toward the sideline and as the ball was going out of play, one of the other Nashville players was fouled.

    "That foul should never have been given, that play has to be called offside! What does this referee think he's doing? He's made three calls that have drastically changed the game now!"
     
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  6. MetroFever

    MetroFever Member+

    Jun 3, 2001
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    Croatia
    The PK that led to the second Nashville goal was a dive.
     
  7. rh89

    rh89 Member

    Sep 29, 2015
    OR
    11/21/20
    Orlando City vs New York City FC
    Exploria Stadium (12PM ET)
    REF: Allen Chapman
    AR1: Logan Brown
    AR2: Nick Uranga
    4TH: Marcos DeOliveira
    VAR: Guido Gonzales Jr
    AVAR: Jozef Batko

    Columbus Crew vs New York Red Bulls
    MAPFRE Stadium (3PM ET)
    REF: Alex Chilowicz
    AR1: Brian Poeschel
    AR2: Eric Weisbrod
    4TH: Fotis Bazakos
    VAR: Edvin Jurisevic
    AVAR: Gjovalin Bori
     
  8. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This?

    https://matchcenter.mlssoccer.com/m...lle-sc-vs-inter-miami-cf/details/video/249516

    The slo-mo sequence at 0:31-0:36 on the video shows the contact pretty clearly. The goalkeeper's hits the outside of the attacker's right leg, about halfway between knee and ankle. That's a foul. If you want to say the attacker goes down easy... well, maybe. But he's also beaten two defenders to win the ball and put it past the goalkeeper who comes nowhere close to it and makes contact. That has to be a penalty.
     
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  9. GlennAA11

    GlennAA11 Member+

    Jun 12, 2001
    Arlington, VA
    #9 GlennAA11, Nov 21, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2020
    seemed like he was already falling before contact.

    I'm more interested in this brutal foul in the NYC v ORL game. Defender leaves his feet and launches his shoulder into the head of his opponent eyes clearly on his target nowhere near playing the ball. Excessive force for sure.
    https://matchcenter.mlssoccer.com/m...y-sc-vs-new-york-city-fc/details/video/249590

    finally gets his send off 5 minutes later - not a very bright player
    https://matchcenter.mlssoccer.com/m...y-sc-vs-new-york-city-fc/details/video/249594
     
  10. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I DON'T think it has to be a penalty. That's 10% foul, 90% dive. I also seriously question whether or not he was going to be able to retrieve the ball. Which, while technically isn't relevant, we all know that matters.

    I do agree that once the CR calls it that way, VAR shouldn't overturn.
     
  11. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And honestly, I just came here after ET of the Orlando/NYC game so I could say REDUCE TO EQUATE!!!
     
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  12. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I’m shocked by the issues with this call. The goalkeeper takes a risk, doesn’t get the ball at all, and challenges an opponent who has gone round him, making contact. That’s always a penalty if seen correctly.

    If the attacker threw himself to the ground or truly was going down well prior to contact, I’d get it. But we are talking milliseconds. If there’s embellishment it’s run-of-the-mill. I strongly disagree with the 90-10 dive formulation and quite frankly would reverse that assessment. But if people see it the other way, I don’t think me repeating myself will change minds.
     
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  13. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    VAR just killing the game. Goal keepers can't even celebrate a save on a penalty kick anymore. Orlando keeper getting his second caution on a pk save due to VAR.

    Can't wait when this happens at a World Cup or Euros.
     
  14. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    Only VAR can make a penalty shootout un-exciting. Killing the tension and drama of it. Just a farce.
     
  15. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    While I agree generally on the VAR aspect, I will never understand why this still needs to be a caution. The penalty gets restored. The delay is minor compared to VAR checks and reviews themselves. This still needs to be misconduct at a time when the laws say to no longer caution SPA (deliberate misconduct) if advantage is applied and realized? It makes no sense.

    So while VAR doesn’t help, I think the Laws themselves are the fundamental problem here.
     
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  16. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What the hell? Can they substitute the back-up keeper on, or not?
     
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  17. RedStar91

    RedStar91 Member+

    Sep 7, 2011
    Club:
    FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd
    This is a really bad look for the referees and the league. Amateur hour. What a fiasco.
     
  18. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If Orlando goes down to nine, do NYC have to reduce to equate again?
     
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  19. MassachusettsRef

    MassachusettsRef Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 30, 2001
    Washington, DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #19 MassachusettsRef, Nov 21, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
    No. Reduce only applies at the beginning of the kicks phase.

    But the rest of this is a disaster.

    EDIT I was wrong. See below.
     
  20. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Now Orlando's lost track of the score!!!
     
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  21. rh89

    rh89 Member

    Sep 29, 2015
    OR
    Holy shit Chapman whistled end of KFTM before there was a winner. WTF?!?!?!?!1
     
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  22. LampLighter

    LampLighter Red Card

    Bugeaters FC
    Apr 13, 2019
    This is a playoff game.
     
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  23. KCbus

    KCbus Moderator
    Staff Member

    United States
    Nov 26, 2000
    Reynoldsburg, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Did he? I saw Orlando going crazy, but I didn’t hear the whistles.
     
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  24. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh, he did. Definitely heard it.


    But the thing about the Gallese encroachment is that I don't think that was a VAR call. Chapman never went to the monitor that I've seen. Looks like the call was made on the field, and he waited for the VAR to complete the check before showing the requisite yellow card (and then red for the second caution). And of course, next season it A) wouldn't have been a yellow card on the first offense and B) wouldn't have accumulated with the caution from the 120 minutes.
     
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  25. allan_park

    allan_park Member

    May 15, 2000
    Firstly, a "disclaimer" to start with - I haven't seen this yet. However, ....

    are we saying a keeper has been cautioned for moving early and saving a PK shoot-out, and since it's his second caution, he was sent off?

    If that is the case, I have to ask a silly question, which I HONESTLY don't know - did MLS not implement this year's Law Changes yet?

    Because, as of this season (2020-2021), cautions during the game are "erased" before the shoot-out, so the goalkeeper would not be "on a yellow" to start with. Then, as per the new Law Changes, the first time he "goes early" and saves a kick, he is ONLY warned, and NOT CAUTIONED. Only subsequent transgressions would be subject to caution.

    Apologies if MLS has not implemented these Law Changes this year - I thought they had - but if they haven't then at least MassRef you can be assured that the CURRENT Laws don't "force" a caution for this as you feared above.
     

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