Best 11 Right Now

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by LuckofLichaj, Oct 19, 2018.

  1. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    I don't understand. What do you mean by "dribbling and receiving are too slow?"

    Are you saying that you prefer a direct form of attack? There are some who believe the best thing to do is to get the ball as far forward as quickly as you can. Is that the type of attack you prefer?

    My preference is that a team controls the ball through possession and ball circulation. That team dictates where and when they attack based on an advantage that they have created through movement of the ball and attacking players. This type of play takes 11 players who have skill. It is more difficult to implement, but I think the rewards are greater and that it is more aesthetically pleasing for the spectators.

    Dribbling is not about a one man show kind of thing. Dribbling is a means for keeping possession, for creating an advantage, or it is a biproduct of good passing as it can create opportunities for attackers in space after good ball movement. Receiving is absolutely critical as it keeps the defenders honest. Players with a good first touch will have more time and space for two reasons: 1. the can use their touch to put them in the best position possible, and 2. the defenders have to respect that fact.

    Attacking is all about creating an advantage. That takes patience, intelligence, and skill. That is how I view that phase of the game, at least.
     
  2. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    Responding to your edit: Where is the contradiction?

    Berhalter is referring to the speed of moving the ball through vertical and horizontal parts of the field. He is talking about things like switching the point of attack, speed of play through one touch passing and combination plays. In terms of skill and player characteristics needed to perform these actions, he is talking specifically about their ball playing and receiving ability. Dribbling is still crucial to this style of play, also. It is not necessary to play with this high speed of play 100% of the time, but it is necessary to always be looking for opportunities to take advantage of opportunities where this speed of play will lead to an attacking advantage. Dribbling is necessary sometimes to get the ball out of trouble in order to maintain possession, to simply move the ball until an opportunity to play comes along, or to break down a defense that is vulnerable.

    The idea of "speed of play" does not contradict the necessity of skill; rather, it further demands it. The other thing that it demands is intelligent players who have an understanding of how they are to play together.
     
  3. Patrick167

    Patrick167 Member+

    Dortmund
    United States
    May 4, 2017
    No, I don't agree. Strangely, I've blocked out any memory of that game. Since it was Sarachan, I can imagine it was Trapp as a lone 6 and McKennie, Pulisic, Weah, and Green collapsed back to help. I can't imagine Villafana did much to help the situation.

    I know people don't rate him, but 2017 was a lot of hard lonely work for Bobby Wood and he never complained.
     
  4. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Everything starts with the defense.

    If your defense is so weak you have to pull back the midfield to help cover them, you isolate your forwards. Sarachan's 4-1-4-1 was a product of that lack of a good defense against strong opposition.

    We cannot say anything about these last two games because the rivals let us play. The moment we play someone who comes out pressing and hounding our defenders, then we can start drawing conclusions.
     
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  5. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    Here's a better thread for you to take your opinion. Baby steps and all.

    https://www.bigsoccer.com/threads/be...an-help-us-that-hasnt-been-looked-at.2095208/
     
  6. grandinquisitor28

    Feb 11, 2002
    Nevada
    I think he could be a lot more useful than Jozy if players like Sargent, Pulisic, Weah, Adams and friends really continue, and in Pulisic's case, return to developing at such a rapid pace. Wood's a fighter, quick, aggressive, clever, a junkyard dog in the box etc. Like Jozy, and most forwards, he feeds off confidence, so having a ghastly year in '17-'18 probably did him no favors. But if we really see these midfielders and Sargent continue to develop a pace, while he's no superstar, we could begin to see Wood be incredibly useful.

    With Altidore, despite his seeming utility, watching what has happened since the bright start to his career has been massively disappointing. As mentioned previously, he's missed the two biggest tournaments we've played in since WC '10 (WC '14, and the Copa Centenario) with those hammy injuries that are a perpetual deep tissue issue with him, and he was just the worst version of the "only good against the cupcakes at home" during the '18 World Cup cycle, scoring in only one match in 9 appearances in the hex, struggling to accomplish anything even on the road in the semifinal stage. I just am ready to turn the page with that period. Wood wasn't much better but he did have an impact on multiple games despite playing a chunk of that hex during his lost '17-'18 season including temporarily saving the campaign until we flushed it at T&T w/that last minute (5 minutes) goal in a scramble off a corner at Honduras and scoring the equalizer against Mexico before we threw away the draw in the closing minutes via a Marquez Header. I just think Wood could be useful. I know Altidore can be highly productive when he's really comfortable and on his game and healthy, but so many boxes need to be checked that I'd rather just move on from that, and find the next answers. Sargent seems like one, I hope we can grab Siebatcheu though it still seems like a pipe dream (has he ever expressed interest? I haven't seen it. Maybe he gives a full scale turn about when/if France drops him entirely from any equation and he understands that.), but right now, other than Wood, I am a believe in Sargent and Weah, and other than that, keeping an eye on Nova and waiting for the kids that are 3+ years away on the youth squads.
     
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  7. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I prefer coaches who aren't locked into one philosophy only. GB seemed to be able to change if needed as he did with RBNY where he did play very direct at times because their high press made it virtually impossible to work out of the back but left open space behind their backs. I don't prefer long ball as a first choice but if that's whats given then take advantage until the opponent adjusts and leaves more room for possession.
     
  8. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    mine
    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    Coaches have to pick specific principles that they value and want to mold their team around. That doesn't mean that the coach is tactically inflexible.
     
  9. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The best XI on 02-08-2019 if we had to win the A team GC2019.

    3-4-1-2
    Wood Altidore
    <-Pulisic->
    Fab Adams McKennie Yedlin
    Ream Brooks Long
    Steffen

    4-3-3
    Weah Altidore Arriola
    McKennie Pulisic
    Adams
    Fab Brooks Long Yedlin
    Steffen
    Bench: Weah, Sargent, Arriola, Robinson, Bradley, Williams, Chandler, Miazga, Zimmerman, Lewis, Guzan, Hammid
     
  10. Suyuntuy

    Suyuntuy Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    Vancouver, Canada
    Fabian's ship has sailed, poor guy can't play more than a few minutes without getting re-injured. Let him be.
     
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  11. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    This goal takes 8 seconds which is faster than Hussein Bolt can run the distance in track shoes on a flat track. Imagine how slow he'd be on the dribble!!! Can't teach speed? Don't be so sure.

     
  12. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Well, I understand Berhalter worships Pep and Pep famously said that his players had to dribble first and foremost.
     
  13. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That goal is all about pure speed. If Arriola is not fast he does not get to that ball with an advantage. Replace Arriola with say Roldan in that same scenario and we likely don't score that goal!

    I picked Roldan because the Lima to Zimmerman goal v Panama showed just how comparatively slow Roldan appears. On the turnover recovery both the Panama player and Long (who started 10 m behind) had passed and were accelerating away from Roldan who appeared stuck in mod!
     
  14. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    @don Lamb , here is a video of Carleton against college players. He looks to have improved and had a couple of nice moments, but still looks to be a bit away from the international game.

     
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  15. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I dont think you are using Altidore right in the 433. I dont recall when he has impressed as a leading striker. He worked well with Wood as he pushed high and Altidore could drop underneath.

    I'd add Wood or Sargent and push Altidore further to the right (not necessarily all the way to the wing). This unbalanced set up would leave space for CP to take up the wide space at times.
     
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  16. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Wrong again. Look closely and you see Arriola slowing down. Do you understand why? b.t.w. the issue was about dribbling being too slow before you barged in here. Arriola doesn't take a single dribble.
     
  17. LuckofLichaj

    LuckofLichaj Member+

    Mar 9, 2012
    I don’t ever want to see Arriola dribble. Yikes.
     
  18. LuckofLichaj

    LuckofLichaj Member+

    Mar 9, 2012
    But back to the topic of Andrew Carleton- I’m not sure why don lamb thinks he can play the wing at an international level. Most wingers- regardless of skill level- actually have to cover ground and do it fairly rapidly. It’s just basic tactics. A winger actually has to threaten runs to parts of the pitch to create space throughout the rest of it. Carleton can’t do that.

    The debate should be Carleton vs. Mihailovic, Lletget and the other 10s.

    I don’t rate Arriola and I think Carleton may have a higher ceiling if he can get stronger (I don’t think he’s going to get faster or quicker) but there’s no way that Carleton could ever be a better wide player than Arriola at the international level.
     
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  19. Golazo69

    Golazo69 Member+

    Aug 2, 2017
    Why does every single thread turn into a discussion about Carleton? I like him, and I’ve got high hopes, but he’s a kid, and nowhere near our best 11. Especially if he isn’t starting at the club or youth international level.
     
  20. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Maybe they want to see him fail.
     
  21. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I was hoping recent video of him would ends this discussion of him. He just put in a mixed performance against college players and looked overwhelmed physically.
     
  22. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    McKennie had minimal involvement in any of the goals. Trapp's weak defending and positioning were on display on the first two goals.
     
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  23. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nonsense. Trapp had no help from Sarachan nor McKennie of whom the Guardian said "The 20-year-old Bundesliga prospect ran his legs off in midfield to little effect." Trapp had no partner. McKennie didn't understand where he had to be.
     
  24. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    overwhelmed physically? He got fouled alot. Is that what you mean. He fell down. He does have some maturing physically to do.
    I thought he looks fine. Nice touch, reads game well. Seemed to mistime some balls. Its preseason. We all know he's not ready for our full team but like Taitague he's showing nice skill and needs to work hard to get minutes on good teams. Atlanta is a good team and I hope he doesn't get frozen out because I do think he's skilled enough to start getting significant sub minutes with Atlanta. Along with Bello too.
     
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  25. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    He went down multiple times where not calling a foul would have been reasonable.

    I agree that he is ready for sub minutes with ATL. that is very different than a starter for the national team.
     
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