MLS Territorial Rights and What They Mean for SRFC - Evan Ream

Discussion in 'Sacramento Republic FC' started by Knave, Sep 15, 2015.

  1. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    #1 Knave, Sep 15, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2015
    So, yeah, go read this ...

    MLS Territorial Rights and What They Mean for Sacramento Republic FC

    We've had a number of discussions on this board about the 75 mile radius.

    If (and I emphasize if) the Quakes actually now have (or have always had) 100 miles -- well, that's a wrinkle.

    --

    I don't think this is anything that will really upset SRFC's MLS bid. But San Jose might have to be compensated more greatly than we were assuming. Then again, if MLS wants SRFC (and I think they do), MLS will find a way to make it work, and San Jose will have to accept that. It's not like this hasn't been an issue before. MLS has already brought two teams into existing MLS markets.

    Heck, maybe you let San Jose keep the 100 mile radius (perhaps only carving out Sacramento's city limits), but you give SRFC 100 miles as well, which lets them encroach upon San Jose's territory. Indeed, I like that idea quite a bit. Make the teams compete for youth talent.
     
  2. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    It looks like there may be some confusion between territorial (media/marketing) rights and homegrown territorial rights.

    I think we've known that San Jose claims Sacramento as part of their territorial rights. They've stated this directly.

    But within very recent days MLS has also confirmed that San Jose's homegrown territory remains a 75 mile radius from their stadium.

    Hence, yes the Quakes objected to the Galaxy making moves into their territory, but no that had nothing to do with San Jose's homegrown territory. That was about the Galaxy extending their "brand" into Sacramento.

    Or to put it differently, San Jose's territorial claims for marketing purposes extend beyond their 75 mile homegrown rights. They "claim" all of Northern California - for whatever that's worth, and whatever that really means. But that's been known forever, and hasn't really been an issue for SRFC's MLS bid.

    I think Evan may have goofed here. I don't think this is an issue.

    --

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  3. 30King

    30King Member+

    Jul 22, 2013
    Rocklin, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Media/marketing territorial rights and homegrown player rights are completely different, but I think there is enough homogeny that the Quakes made a valid homegrown territory claim against the Gals affiliation with the Blues. MLS I'm sure recognized the Gals encroaching way too far out of their area, and right in the Quakes backyard, > 75 miles or not. I think the same would be true if the Quakes tried to establish an affiliation just outside the 75 mile radius out in Riverside or San Bernardino counties. Just bad form, and what Knave said below regarding "brand extension"

    _________

    The Quakes territorial rights is defacto Northern California. SRFC have stated as much. NorCal is large enough that SRFC has legitimate grounds to buyout the Quakes for the Sacramento part of the market (and probably the entire valley). Negotiations are ongoing and sound productive. WS told me as much at the Open Cup game at Avaya. A Sacramento MLS team prevents any future franchise challenges in the Bay area- the Quakes recognize that. Its highly unlikely the Quakes kicking out the Gals has any impact on SRFC's MLS territory buyout negotiations.
     
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  4. SierraSpartan

    SierraSpartan Member+

    Jan 25, 2007
    Placer County, CA
    Club:
    Sacramento Republic FC
    Imma jus' leave this here right now...

    [​IMG]

    In all likelihood, SRFC has made further inroads into Sierra, Butte and Plumas, and quite possibly into Alpine, Tuolumne and Stanislaus as well.

    It would be interesting to see how that map above would change with SRFC actually being in MLS, and also with LAFC coming into the league. Also, WTF Madera and Kings counties? Still following the Undead Corpse of Chivas?
     
  5. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    I still think that map is rubbish.
     
  6. QuietType

    QuietType Member+

    Jun 6, 2009
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't understand why California isn't just divided in half, north and south. Seems silly when compared to the "territories" of other teams.
     
  7. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    I know exactly how to divide it too ...

    Safeway = Quakes & SRFC Territory
    Vons = Galaxy & LAFC Territory
     
  8. SierraSpartan

    SierraSpartan Member+

    Jan 25, 2007
    Placer County, CA
    Club:
    Sacramento Republic FC
    yeah, but it's kinda fun to point out how SRFC has put a major dent in SJE's territorial support in just the space of two years.

    If SJ is going to try to assert a territorial claim to Sacto, or try to extort money as a price for SRFC's entrance into MLS, then eff them with a rusty rake. Prior to SRFC coming on the scene, the only marketing SJE did was via commercials during A's games on Clowncast.
     
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  9. 30King

    30King Member+

    Jul 22, 2013
    Rocklin, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    #9 30King, Sep 16, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2015
    There wasn't much of a dent in the first place. It's no secret that the Quakes have largely ignored the valley.

    SRFC filled a void more so than ran the Quakes out of town. That map was based on Facebook likes if I'm not mistaken. Many areas that are SRFC would have been nothing without them. And one Facebook like captured the entire county. YMMV
     
  10. 30King

    30King Member+

    Jul 22, 2013
    Rocklin, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I'm not sure where this "extortion" idea is coming from (not just you, from lots of posters).

    The SRFC currently resides in Earthquake marketing territory. Warren had said so. This requires compensation from an expansion club. Good thing is, Norcal is large enough for two teams. I've spoken to WS about the Quakes. He said in so many words that the Quakes want compensation, but it's not a problem.
    I haven't seen any numbers or info to indicate any extortion occurring. Do you have any insider knowledge? Maybe @blueballs69 has some info? (He seems to have a line into Quakes/league info).

    In so far as the Quakes suddenly making a territorial push into Sac, I haven't seen it. If they truly wanted to exert territorial control over a section of their market (Sac), that had a future competitor setting up shop (SRFC), they've done a shitty job, and they are two years too late.

    If you want to see the Quakes protecting their turf, wait till an NASL team tries to land in the Bay. You'll see a full court press. And then you'll see that the Quakes haven't really pushed back on Sac.

    Point being, don't confuse the Quakes kicking out the Galaxy as something more than it is. I'm pretty sure SRFC is in the know, and may have helped it along. This was more about the Gals encroaching in NorCal.
     
  11. mangerson

    mangerson Member+

    Sacramento Republic, San Jose Earthquakes
    Jan 8, 2008
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm just frustrated that the 'Quakes seem to have taken the region for granted, not invested time or money into it, and now they seem to feel they are owed something. On paper, sure. Crappy PR though.
     
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  12. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    I'm not frustrated that they took the region for granted. That opened the door for SRFC, which is great. Their loss will be our -- and MLS's -- gain.

    Granted, that is the perspective of someone who is not and has never been a Quakes supporter. I'm happy they were so inept, and did so little to expand their reach beyond San Jose and the South Bay.

    I expect the folks at SRFC HQ are pretty happy about that too. If the Quakes feel owed something now, whatever. It's not a big deal. It really isn't.
     
  13. fortunesfool223

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Dec 26, 2013
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Interesting take, Knave.......
     
  14. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    Maybe it's just different.

    I know a lot of SRFC supporters on this board are and remain Quakes supporters. So they've had all these years watching the Quakes act like a small market team in what should be one of MLS's glamour markets. I can understand how years of watching that neglect can piss people off and it can even feel a little personal. I see the same thing with Fire fans. That should also be a big market team, but their FO cheaps out and fumbles everything.

    So now after all these years of neglect, the Quakes turn around and demand their pound of flesh before SRFC can enter MLS. It's unseemly. And to those who have been supporting the Quakes and lamenting their neglect of the region at large, it's galling -- and even personally so.

    Well, I don't have those hangups. As fate had it, though a Bay Area native, I didn't relate to San Jose and had no interest in supporting the Clash when MLS started up. Plus, I was living in Alexandria, VA back then and it was pretty easy to get hooked on DCU. I can look at SRFC as my MLS homecoming. That's a luxury a lot of you don't have.

    You Quakes supporters are looking at this like it's -- oh, I don't know -- maybe like it's a divorce, and she's making petty demands before she'll sign the papers. She had no interest in your prized Latin jazz vinyl collection when you were married, but now she wants half of it!?! The nerve!

    But you know what: the thing will get settled, everything will be done. SRFC will be in MLS. You'll all defect (just like me), and everything will be cool.
     
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  15. QuietType

    QuietType Member+

    Jun 6, 2009
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's all true, except the fact that it's "personal." It's just hugely disappointing. If I had to sum up the Quakes' presence to capture NorCal I would have to use that word - disappointing. As the saying goes over on the Quakes forum, we are "a small team" (words out of John Doyle's mouth). President Kaval worked in minor league baseball before joining the Quakes. And the Quakes ownership runs things the same way they run the A's - cheaply and often doing the bare minimum and showing no ambition.

    I wish the Quakes would do more to market up here. I wish I would see a billboard on I-80 or Hwy 99 or see ads in papers or hear them on TV or radio. But nothing. Instead, the Quakes FO think its better marketing to put billboards up in Seattle or in London. I'm just tired of them failing to market outside of Silicon Valley, and when they do its not even to their region of potential fans.

    I love the Quakes and they've been my MLS team for years, but they have not done anything outside of an exhibition game or two to even let Sacramentans and people outside Silicon Valley know they exist.

    Then they pull this territorial stuff, trying to keep their wide net to rope in players from the area. They just want to have their cake and eat it too, and it's insulting to fans like me who have been long time passionate fans tuning into every game from up here and often making the long drive down to attend games in person, to see them not care about us until it means they can't use the area as a farm for the next Tommy Thompson. They have a wealth of resources and are mismanaging most everything because of the "small team" mentality, it's hugely frustrating because as you said, they should be one of the most lucrative markets/biggest teams in the league.
     
  16. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    Which is exactly what I meant by personal.
     
  17. QuietType

    QuietType Member+

    Jun 6, 2009
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I see what you mean, for lack of better terms. It's insulting but I don't take it personally, if that makes sense. It's simply incompetence and thinking small from an organization that gets by doing the bare minimum and wanting the maximum return out of it. Typical real estate investor mentality.
     
  18. SierraSpartan

    SierraSpartan Member+

    Jan 25, 2007
    Placer County, CA
    Club:
    Sacramento Republic FC
    I come at it from a somewhat oblique angle.

    As you might be able to guess from my handle and my avatar, I'm kinda big on SJSU. Grew up in SJ, got East Side in my veins. I was going to Quakes games in the NASL days beginning in 1974, was a STH until I went to college and got poor. I joined up with Clash when MLS started up, and I was geeked when the name change came along, even though that was somewhat moderated by the color selection. When the MLS Quakes 1.0 moved to Houston, I was gutted - especially when they traded one (what they claimed to be) substandard college foobaw stadium for an even worse one there. But no worries, MLS will come to its senses, yes?

    So along comes Quakes 2.0, and where do they play? Shaw...for six long years, while a significant chunk of their fanbase here on BS went out of its way to castigate SJSU in general, and Spartan Stadium in particular, after Lew Wolff tried to rent/lease/purchase/steal the SJSU South Campus as the price for constructing a multiuse 18K stadium that would house both the Quakes 2.0 and SJSU athletics (a/k/a "The Project"), but things didn't work out because SJSU was rude enough to ask for actual Fair Market Value for their land. From that point, I watched Q2.0, but was not a fan. I continue to this day to watch, but I'm not a fan.

    To be fair, in the interim SJSU had ripped out the grass at Spartan and put in rug, but also made a lot of improvements to the stadium itself (painting, new 'tron, removal of the M*A*S*H speakers) that probably would have been a much better fit for the team (not to mention a much better look on TV) than Shaw, were it not for the football lines and the giant Spartan head at the center of the field and the MW logos and the bright blue end zones and the....okay, I get it.

    So along comes SRFC, and in a similar vein to what Wolff and his crew did with The Project at SJSU, the Earthquakes are apparently demanding tribute that they have not earned and do not deserve IMHO. The Quakes have dome precisely dick in terms of marketing up here, so why would they even care about another team coming in, unless...what?

    Sorry, bud. You can't let land lay fallow and then claim your neighbor's garden as partly your own. SRFC coming into MLS sooner rather than later will only be a Good Thing for the Earthquakes if they market it correctly down there (because you can bet your bottom dollar it WILL be marketed up here correctly). The folks down at Avaya saw what happened with our crew at the US Open Cup game - so why not do that three times a year from now on?
     
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  19. fortunesfool223

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Dec 26, 2013
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm a bit slow.......just realized what a roadblock the "marketing territorial rights" and "homegrown territorial rights" are to the relegation issue. Can you imagine the mess if a USL or NASL team promoted to MLS and was within either territories of an existing MLS team? Looks to me that MLS's territorial rights clause = attorney full employment act.
     
  20. SierraSpartan

    SierraSpartan Member+

    Jan 25, 2007
    Placer County, CA
    Club:
    Sacramento Republic FC
    Exhibits #A and #B of that scenario are NY Cosmos and the Fort Lauderdale Strikers. What happens if the Pro-Rel gods come down from on high, and those two teams go on a tear and get promoted to MLS? Will the Cosmos still be playing at Hofstra, or will they move in with the Wilpons at NuShea? Will the Strikers move to SunLife and bunk in with the 'Fins and Canes, or will they stay at Lockhart?

    If this territorial rights thing continues, then Pro-Rel is deader than dogcrap for the foreseeable future; the only way to resurrect it would be to completely rebuild the Soccer Pyramid from the ground up.
     
  21. ThreeApples

    ThreeApples Member+

    Jul 28, 1999
    Smurf Village
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    All indications from both San Jose and Sacramento are that there will be some kind of compensation, but nothing that is obstructionist to SRFC's goal to move up. The Galaxy Blues thing is about branding/marketing encroachment into what is still Quakes territory (though not HGP territory) for MLS purposes and what will be SRFC territory once they move up. The stated goal of the Galaxy Blues affiliation was to make the foothill suburbs "LA Galaxy country", and I don't imagine SRFC would like that to happen any more than the Quakes do.
     

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