Great Generations of Footballers from Countries or Regions

Discussion in 'Players & Legends' started by Tom Stevens, Dec 30, 2014.

  1. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    The (http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads/great-world-cup-teams-that-never-were.2005683/) thread got me thinking about great generations of footballers from countries. Some great generations did not get to play together and prove themselves on an international level for a variety of reasons. England's greatest generation of footballers did not get to play with one of their greatest contemporaries, Duncan Edwards, because of his early passing. Hungary's Golden Team, as powerful as its front line was, did not have all of its top attacking players available for selection because players abroad (Kubala, Nyers) were not included in the national team. Similar things occurred in Argentina in the 50s. I want to measure the quality of a generation by the total achievements of all the players in it, not just how well they performed together for the national team. For example the generation of English players in their primes in the late 1970s were major underachievers with the national team, but were major parts of English clubs dominating European Football.

    My goal here is to simply define a generation as a group of players born in the same country in a certain time period. The time period took a little tinkering. I first looked at players born within 5 years of one another but this was too small a time period, as my goal was to grab a group of players who played together or could have played together because of their similar ages. With a 5 year time period players like Hidegkuti and Puskas, who clearly were part of the same generation and played together for much of their career could not be in one generation (Hidegkuti born in 1922, Puskas born in 1927). I then moved the time period to 10 years which seemed a little to big and players who were not associated with one another or careers did not really overlap in a meaningful way could be grouped in one generation (Domingos da Guia 1912 and Zizinho 1921). I settled on 8 years as the time period to use and in general it works relatively well with the reality of players careers. Usually on one team an 8 year gap between players ages in the maximum you see unless one player is very young and the other as unusual longevity.

    I decided to strictly limit players to the country they were born in to limit confusion and grey areas. In theory we are looking for the best generations of players produced by a country or region. In some situations you have players move to a country at a very young age and you could still argue they were "produced" by the country they played for. Lillian Thruman moved to France at the age of 9 and most if not all of his football education and career was in France. Players like Eusebio or Coluna developed the early part of their careers abroad before moving to the country they were associated with in their late teens. They clearly were not developed in Portugal in my opinion. To eliminate grey areas like Lillian Thurman, and arguments about ethnicity (which by my definition has nothing to do with who produced a player, Thierry Henry and William Gallas were born in France so they were available for French generations) I simply used where the player was born to determine eligibility. This interpretation hurts a number of excellent footballing generations, largely the two mention earlier. France's World Cup winning generation loses Thruman, Desailly, Viera etc and Portugal's generation of the 60s loses Eusebio and Coluna.

    To make things simple for comparing generations of players across different time periods I have defined players by their roles not positions (http://forums.bigsoccer.com/threads...-function-not-position.2009089/#post-30813593).

    I have gone through each country and tried to identify their best generations. Then once that is complete it would be interesting to try to define the best generations among all countries.
     
  2. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    #2 Tom Stevens, Dec 30, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2014
    To start off I will tackle one of the all time great footballing countries Brazil.

    The first generation of players I wanted to capture was a generation built around Leonidas and Domingo da Guia. Going any earlier in time to players like Friedenreich does not make sense to me as there are not enough top players around Friedenreich to create a strong generation.

    I will list players in relative order for their importance/achievement/talent for each "role".

    Leonidas/Domingo da Guia generation stretches from 1910 to 1917. This was the generation of footballers that were in their primes for the 1938 World Cup that Brazil preformed well at.

    Finishers
    Leônidas da Silva (Leonidas)
    Waldemar de Brito
    Carvalho Leite
    José Perácio
    Leonídio Fantoni (Niginho)
    Sylvio Pirillo
    Uriel Fernandes (Teleco)

    Chance Creators

    Rodolpho Barteczko (Patesko)
    Hércules de Miranda (Hércules)
    Elba de Pádua Lima (Tim)
    Luís Mesquita de Oliveira (Luisinho)
    Romeu Pellicciari (Romeu)

    Controllers
    José Augusto Brandão
    Zezé Procópio
    Aarón Wergifker
    Afonso Guimarães da Silva (Afonsinho)
    Martín Mercío Silveyra

    Defenders
    Domingos da Guia
    Jose de Oliveira Junqueira

    Goalkeepers
    Algisto Lorenzato (Batatais)

    The strength of this generation is in the finishers and chance creators. There were enough excellent strikers, inside forwards, and wingers that many excellent players had difficulty getting into the national team. A player like Teleco is considered one of the greatest Cornthians players ever. He was top scorer in the Paulista 5 times (a record) and won four Paulista titles but to my knowledge never got capped due to the presence Leonidas and Carvalho Leite among others.

    The weakness of this generation is among the controllers, defenders, and goalkeeper. There is decent depth at controller but none of the players were really considered the top halfbacks of their time in South America compared to contemporaries from Argentina (Ernesto Lazzatti, Jorge Alberti) and Uruguay (Obdulio Varela, Michele Andreolo). There is major lack of depth at defender with da Guia being an all time great but not much after that.

    Zizinho/Ademir generation is from 1920 to 1927. This is generation of Brazilians that built strength through the 40s culminating in the 1949 South American Championship win and the 1950 World Cup final appearance. This generation also includes players who went on to be important veterans in the 1954 World Cup. I would say this is the generation that really elevated Brazil's status to a world power.

    Finishers
    Ademir Marques de Menezes (Ademir)
    Heleno de Freitas
    Albino Friaça Cardoso (Friaca)
    Oswaldo da Silva (Baltazar)
    Carlos Alberto Zolim Filho (Carlitos)
    Adão Nunes Dornelles (Adãozinho)

    Chance Creators

    Thomaz Soares da Silva (Zizinho)
    Jair Rosa Pinto (Jair)
    Osmar Fortes Barcellos (Tesourinha)
    Cláudio Christovam de Pinho (Cláudio)
    Francisco Aramburu (Chico)
    Francisco Rodrigues
    José Lázaro Robles (Pinga)
    Yeso Amalfi
    Pedro de Araújo Simão (Simao)
    Elísio dos Santos Teixeira (Teixerinha)
    Manuel Marinho Alves (Maneca)

    Controllers
    Danilo Alvim
    Jose Carlos Bauer
    Rui Campos
    Antenor Lucas (Brandãozinho)
    Moacir Lamb (Biguá)
    Ely do Amparo (Ely)
    João Ferreira (Bigode)
    Jaime de Almeida
    Waldemar Fiume

    Defenders
    Nilton Santos
    Augusto da Costa
    Juvenal Amarijo (Juvenal)
    Olavo Rodrigues Barbosa (Nena)

    Goalkeepers
    Moacir Barbosa Nascimento (Barbosa)
    Carlos José Castilho (Castilho)

    This generation sports excellent depth at all positions. Finishers is headed up by an all time great and has good depth with very well thought of players in Heleno de Freitas, Fricia, and Baltazar behind for depth plus two all time great goal scorers from the Campeonato Gaucho in Carlitos and Adãozinho. The chance creator group is fantastic with amazing depth. Claudio is considered by many the greatest player in his clubs history (Corinthians) and led a signature club of the time to multiple championships but he could never get major playing time at inside forward because of Jair and Zizinho. Teixerinha is in a similar situation as one of the great Sao Paulo's sides top attackers but few caps to show. The group of wingers also has great depth but not quite the star power of the inside forwards. The controllers are deep with Alvim and Bauer heading up the group. The defenders are the weak spot of the team with one all time great players who came in at the tail end of this generation, but outside of that the players involved are not considered the best at their position outside of Brazil. The two goalkeepers are solid but not spectacular.

    Didi/Garrincha generation is from 1928 to 1935. This is in contention for the greatest generation in football history. Pele was not born until 1940 so he is difficult to join with this group of players. Despite Pele's absence I believe this group has more overall quality than any generation that can be made with Pele in it.

    Finishers
    Waldir Cardoso Lebrêgo (Quarentinha)
    Edvaldo Izídio Neto (Vava)
    Evaristo de Macedo Filho (Evaristo)
    Paulo Valentim
    Waldo Machado da Silva (Waldo)
    Aluísio Francisco da Luz (Índio)

    Chance Creators

    Manuel Francisco dos Santos (Garrincha)
    Waldyr Pereira (Didi)
    Júlio Botelho (Julinho)
    José Macia (Pepe)
    José Ribamar de Oliveira (Canhoteiro)
    Mario Zagallo
    Dorval Rodrigues (Dorval)
    Sidney Colônia Cunha (Chinesinho)
    Joel Antônio Martins
    Edvaldo Alves de Santa Rosa (Dida)
    Vladem Lázaro Ruiz Quevedo (Delém)
    Luíz Trochillo (Luizinho)
    Paulo César Araújo (Pagão)

    Controllers
    José Ely de Miranda (Zito)
    Dino Sani
    Roberto Belangero
    José Ferreira Franco (Zequinha)
    José Mendonça dos Santos (Dequinha)
    Mílton Alves da Silva

    Defenders
    Djalma Santos
    Mauro Ramos de Oliveira (Mauro Ramos)
    Orlando Peçanha de Carvalho (Orlando)
    Hilderaldo Bellini
    Nílton de Sordi
    Zózimo Alves Calazães (Zózimo)
    Valdemar Rodrigues Martíns (Oreco)
    Dalmo Gaspar
    João Carlos Batista Pinheiro (Pinheiro)
    Jordan da Costa

    Goalkeepers
    Gylmar dos Santos Neves (Gilmar)
    Félix Miélli Venerando (Félix)

    Finishers lack an all time great superstar but has a number of excellent high quality players. The chance creator group is likely the best group of chance creators ever produced by a generation in or outside Brazil. The log jam of great wingers for example is amazing with Garrincha, Julinho, and Dorval all competing for caps on the right and Pepe, Canhoteiro, and Mario Zagallo all competing on the left. The controllers are strong behind to greats in Zito and Dino Sani. Unlike the previous Brazilian generations there is depth and quality in defense as well as two solid goalkeepers.

    Pele/Altafini generation from 1937 to 1944 and the Pele/Tostao generation from 1940 to 1947. These are in my opinion the two best ways to build a generation around Pele. It is possible to stretch from 1933 to 1940 and get Pele (1940) and Garrincha (1933) in one generation but that does not have the overall quality that these two choices have in my eyes.

    1937 to 1944

    Finishers
    Edson Arantes do Nascimento (Pelé)
    Jose Altafini
    Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório (Coutinho)
    Toninho Guerreiro
    Procópio Cardoso
    Servílio de Jesus Filho (Servílio)
    Flávio Almeida da Fonseca (Flávio Minuano)
    Roberto Lopes de Miranda (Roberto Miranda)

    Chance Creators

    Jair Ventura Filho (Jairzinho)
    Ademir da Guia
    Gérson de Oliveira Nunes (Gerson)
    Jair da Costa
    Amarildo Tavares da Silveira (Amarildo)
    Mengálvio Pedro Figueiró (Mengálvio)


    Controllers
    Wilson da Silva Piazza
    Antônio Lima dos Santos (Lima)
    Olegário Tolóí de Oliveira (Dudu)
    Denílson Custódio Machado (Denílson)

    Defenders
    Carlos Alberto Torres
    Everaldo Marques da Silva (Everaldo)
    Rildo da Costa Menezes (Rildo)
    Roberto Dias
    Djalma Pereira Dias Júnior (Djalma Dias)
    Hércules de Brito Ruas (Brito)
    Altair Gomes de Figueiredo (Altair)

    Goalkeepers
    Haílton Corrêa de Arruda (Manga)
    Raul Plassmann

    1940 to 1947

    Finishers
    Edson Arantes do Nascimento (Pelé)
    Eduardo Gonçalves de Andrade (Tostao)
    Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório (Coutinho)
    Dario José dos Santos (Dadá Maravilha)
    Toninho Guerreiro
    Flávio Almeida da Fonseca (Flávio Minuano)
    Roberto Lopes de Miranda (Roberto Miranda)


    Chance Creators

    Jair Ventura Filho (Jairzinho)
    Ademir da Guia
    Gérson de Oliveira Nunes (Gerson)
    Dirceu Lopes
    Jair da Costa
    Valdomiro Vaz Franco (Valdomiro)
    Natal de Carvalho Baroni (Natal)

    Controllers
    Wilson da Silva Piazza
    Antônio Lima dos Santos (Lima)
    Denílson Custódio Machado (Denílson)
    Alcindo Martha de Freitas (Alcindo)

    Defenders
    Carlos Alberto Torres
    Everaldo Marques da Silva (Everaldo)
    Rildo da Costa Menezes (Rildo)
    Roberto Dias
    Joel Camargo
    Mário Peres Ulibarri (Marinho Peres)

    Goalkeepers
    Raul Plassmann

    I bolded the major names unique to each generation. The core of Pele's generation remains mostly the same with either group (Pele, Coutinho, Jairzinho, Ademir da Guia, Gerson, Jair da Costa, Piazza, and Carlos Alberto Torres). The major additions for the 37-44 group is Altafini, Amarildo, Mengalvio, and Manga and the 40-47 group is Tostao, Direcu Lopez, and Dadá Maravilha. Not sure which one I prefer. Overall the Pele generations have just as much top quality as the Garrincha/Didi generation but lack the depth of quality it had, especially at controller and defender. Pele's generation is probably ahead at finishers and close behind at chance creator despite the lack of depth comparatively since the top quality is so good for Pele's generation (Jairzinho, Ademir da Guia, Gerson, Jair da Costa, and Direcu Lopez/Amarildo and Mengalvio).

    I will continue the Brazil generations post Pele in another post.
     
    Pipiolo and msioux75 repped this.
  3. babaorum

    babaorum Member+

    Aug 20, 2005
    Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Lilian Thuram was born in France mate. Guadeloupe is part of France juste like -let's say- Hawaï is part of the US.
     
    Tom Stevens repped this.
  4. babaorum

    babaorum Member+

    Aug 20, 2005
    Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Just Fontaine could be an issue for you too. He was born in Morocco -which was a French colony back then- from French parents. He should be included definitely.
    Anyway, to be honest I don't really understand your criteria of selecting players based on their birth location. Leaving out players like Luis Fernandez, Jean Tigana, Marcel Desailly or Patrick Vieira looks... weird to me to say the least :).
     
  5. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    It is strange but then you get into a lot of grey areas with players like Kubala, should he count as part of the Spanish generation or Hungarian generation or both? What about Josef Bican, same issue.

    I guess an easy way to get Tigana and Fontaine in is that they were born in French colonies (at the time of their birth). What would be their citizenship status? Same with Gérard Janvion, Christian Lopez, Christian Karembeu etc.

    Fernandez, Desailly, and Viera are harder to make a case for.
     
  6. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    The first post Pele generation is one of the deepest generations ever. Seeing it makes me wonder how Brazil did not perform better in the 1974 or 78 world cups, especially 1978 when most of this generation was at its peak.

    The Rivellino/Zico generation stretches from 1949 to 1956.

    Finishers
    Carlos Roberto de Oliveira (Roberto Dinamite)
    Sérgio Bernardino (Serginho Chulapa)
    Gilberto Alves
    Vanderlei Eustáquio de Oliveira (Palhinha)

    Chance Creators
    Arthur Antunes Coimbra (Zico)
    Roberto Rivellino
    Sócrates Brasileiro Sampaio de Souza Vieira de Oliveira (Socrates)
    Dirceu José Guimarães (Dirceu)
    Paulo Cesar Lima (Caju)
    Jonas Eduardo Américo (Edu)
    João Leiva Campos Filho (Leivinha)
    João Soares Almeida Filho (Joãozinho)
    Paulo Isidoro de Jesus (Paulo Isidoro)
    Jair Gonçalves Prates
    Mário Sérgio Pontes de Paiva (Mário Sérgio)

    Controllers
    Paulo Roberto Falcao
    Leovegildo Lins da Gama Júnior (Junior)
    Antônio Carlos Cerezo (Toninho Cerezo)
    Clodoaldo Tavares de Santana (Clodoaldo)
    Paulo César Carpegiani (Carpegiani)
    Francisco das Chagas Marinho (Marinho Chagas)
    Manoel Rezende de Mattos Cabral (Nelinho)
    João Batista da Silva (Batista)
    Zenon de Souza Farias (Zenon)
    Adílio de Oliveira Gonçalves (Adílio)

    Defenders
    Luís Edmundo Pereira (Luis Pereira)
    Edino Nazareth Filho (Edinho)
    Marco Antônio Feliciano
    Wladimir Rodrigues dos Santos (Wladimir)
    José Oscar Bernardi (Oscar)
    José Maria Rodrigues Alves (Ze Maria)
    José Rodrigues Neto (Turibio)
    Celso Dias dos Santos (Celso)

    Goalkeepers
    Émerson Leão
    Waldir Peres de Arruda (Waldir Peres)
    João Leite da Silva Neto (João Leite)

    The depth and quality of chance creators, controllers and defenders is outstanding. But as apparent in the 1982 squad there is a severe lack of finishers. Roberto Dinamite is the only one really worthy of mention, the others listed are borderline for even being part of the generation at all as they are average players. Two players usually associated with this generation are Eder and Reinaldo, they were both born in 1957. Moving the generation a year younger would lose 1949 one of the most productive single years I have yet to see, producing Clodoaldo, Émerson Leão, Leivinha, Edu, Ze Maria, Luis Pereira, Carpegiani, Caju, and Rivellino. Another option for this generation is moving it two years older to pick up Tostao in 1947. This would lose Toninho Cerezo, Edinho, and Celso. It might be a bit better that way and would be more representative of the teams possibilities in the 70s if Tostao had stayed healthy, which would have filled one of the teams biggest needs.

    The Tostao/Zico generation would stretch from 1947 to 1954.

    Finishers
    Eduardo Gonçalves de Andrade (Tostao)
    Carlos Roberto de Oliveira (Roberto Dinamite)
    Sérgio Bernardino (Serginho Chulapa)
    Gilberto Alves
    Vanderlei Eustáquio de Oliveira (Palhinha)

    Chance Creators
    Arthur Antunes Coimbra (Zico)
    Roberto Rivellino
    Sócrates Brasileiro Sampaio de Souza Vieira de Oliveira (Socrates)
    Dirceu José Guimarães (Dirceu)
    Paulo Cesar Lima (Caju)
    Jonas Eduardo Américo (Edu)
    João Leiva Campos Filho (Leivinha)
    João Soares Almeida Filho (Joãozinho)
    Paulo Isidoro de Jesus (Paulo Isidoro)
    Jair Gonçalves Prates
    Mário Sérgio Pontes de Paiva (Mário Sérgio)

    Controllers
    Paulo Roberto Falcao
    Leovegildo Lins da Gama Júnior (Junior)
    Clodoaldo Tavares de Santana (Clodoaldo)
    Paulo César Carpegiani (Carpegiani)
    Francisco das Chagas Marinho (Marinho Chagas)
    Manoel Rezende de Mattos Cabral (Nelinho)
    João Batista da Silva (Batista)
    Zenon de Souza Farias (Zenon)

    Defenders
    Luís Edmundo Pereira (Luis Pereira)
    Marco Antônio Feliciano
    Wladimir Rodrigues dos Santos (Wladimir)
    José Oscar Bernardi (Oscar)
    José Maria Rodrigues Alves (Ze Maria)
    José Rodrigues Neto (Turibio)
    Humberto Monteiro
    Mário Peres Ulibarri (Marinho Peres)

    Goalkeepers
    Émerson Leão
    Waldir Peres de Arruda (Waldir Peres)
     
  7. babaorum

    babaorum Member+

    Aug 20, 2005
    Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    France
    Kubala and Bican effectively played for more than one country so yes, there is an issue with them. But with Fernandez, Desailly and Vieira we're talking about players who played for only one country, who came to live in France while they where children (respectively at 9, 3 and 8) and more importantly whose citizenship was never questioned when they played with France. Just my two cents.
     
    condor11 repped this.
  8. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    From this point on the Brazilian generations lack the depth of the predecessors but still have some excellent quality.

    The Careca/Romario generation is from 1960 to 1967.

    Finishers
    Romário de Souza Faria (Romario)
    Antônio de Oliveira Filho (Careca)
    Wálter Casagrande

    Chance Creators
    José Roberto Gama de Oliveira (Bebeto)
    Raí Souza Vieira de Oliveira (Rai)
    Renato Portaluppi (Renato Gaucho)
    Crizam César de Oliveira Filho (Zinho)
    Jorge de Amorim Campos (Jorginho)
    Luís Antônio Corrêa da Costa (Müller)
    Paulo Silas do Prado Pereira (Silas)
    José Ferreira Neto (Neto)

    Controllers
    Carlos Caetano Bledorn Verri (Dunga)
    Ricardo Rogério de Brito (Alemão)
    Cláudio Ibrahim Vaz Leal (Branco)
    Geovani Faria da Silva (Geovani Silva)
    Iomar do Nascimento (Mazinho)

    Defenders
    Aldair Nascimento dos Santos (Aldair)
    Júlio César da Silva (Julio Cesar)
    Ricardo Roberto Barreto da Rocha (Ricardo Rocha)
    Mauro Galvão
    Josimar Higino Pereira (Josimar)
    José Carlos Nepomuceno Mozer (Mozer)
    Ricardo Gomes Raimundo (Ricardo Gomes)
    Ronaldo Rodrigues de Jesus (Ronaldão)

    Goalkeepers
    Cláudio Taffarel
    Armelino Donizetti Quagliato (Zetti)

    This generation has the two great strikers the previous one needed. It also has a very deep group of defenders, probably Brazils deepest ever, and rivals the Garrincha/Didi generation for the best group of defenders produced. The chance creators are deep but there is only one truly great players there.

    There are two ways to create a generation around Ronaldo. One is to with players born before him most importantly Rivaldo, Cafu, and Roberto Carlos.

    The Rivaldo/Ronaldo generation is from 1970 to 1977.

    Finishers
    Ronaldo Luís Nazário de Lima (Ronaldo)
    Rivaldo Vítor Borba Ferreira (Rivaldo)
    Élber de Souza (Giovane Élber)
    Mário Jardel de Almeida Ribeiro (Mário Jardel)

    Chance Creators
    Antônio Augusto Ribeiro Reis Jr (Juninho Pernambucano)
    Anderson Luís de Souza (Deco)
    Edmundo Alves de Souza Neto (Edmundo)
    Alexsandro de Souza (Alex)
    Osvaldo Giroldo Júnior (Juninho Paulista)
    Djalma Feitosa Dias (Djalminha)
    Marcelinho Carioca
    Giovanni Silva de Oliveira (Giovanni)
    Márcio Amoroso dos Santos (Márcio Amoroso)
    Denílson de Oliveira (Denílson)

    Controllers
    Roberto Carlos da Silva Rocha (Roberto Carlos)
    Marcos Evangelista de Morais (Cafu)
    José Roberto da Silva Júnior (Ze Roberto)
    Émerson Ferreira da Rosa (Emerson)
    Gilberto Aparecido da Silva (Gilberto Silva)
    Marcos Antônio Senna da Silva (Marcos Senna)
    Sérgio Cláudio dos Santos (Serginho)
    Marcos André Batista dos Santos (Vampeta)
    Carlos Luciano da Silva (Mineiro)
    Gilberto da Silva Melo (Gilberto)
    Juliano Belletti
    Flávio Conceição

    Defenders
    Júnior Baiano

    Goalkeepers
    Marcos Roberto Silveira Reis (Marcos)
    Nélson de Jesus Silva (Dida)
    Rogério Mücke Ceni (Rogério Ceni)
    Carlos Germano Schwambach Neto (Carlos Germano)

    This generations stregths are the two all time great finishers and the massive number and high quality controllers made up of wingbacks and defensive midfielders. The clear weakness is at defender with all the high quality defenders were older ones from previous generation or younger ones that are in the next Ronaldo generation.

    The second Ronaldo generation would be to get players younger than Ronaldo, mainly Ronaldinho and Kaka.

    The Ronaldo/Ronaldinho generation is from 1974 to 1982.

    Finishers
    Ronaldo Luís Nazário de Lima (Ronaldo)
    Adriano Leite Ribeiro (Adriano)
    Luís Fabiano Clemente (Luís Fabiano)

    Chance Creators
    Ronaldo de Assis Moreira (Ronaldinho)
    Ricardo Izecson dos Santos Leite (Kaká)
    Antônio Augusto Ribeiro Reis Jr (Juninho Pernambucano)
    Anderson Luís de Souza (Deco)
    Alexsandro de Souza (Alex)
    Márcio Amoroso dos Santos (Márcio Amoroso)
    Denílson de Oliveira (Denílson)

    Controllers
    José Roberto da Silva Júnior (Ze Roberto)
    Émerson Ferreira da Rosa (Emerson)
    Gilberto Aparecido da Silva (Gilberto Silva)
    Maicon Douglas Sisenando (Maicon)
    Júlio César Clemente Baptista (Júlio Baptista)
    Marcos Antônio Senna da Silva (Marcos Senna)
    Marcos André Batista dos Santos (Vampeta)
    Flávio Conceição
    Carlos Luciano da Silva (Mineiro)
    Gilberto da Silva Melo (Gilberto)
    Juliano Belletti
    Josué Anunciado de Oliveira (Josué)
    Elano Blumer (Elano)

    Defenders
    Lucimar Ferreira da Silva (Lucio)
    Juan Silveira dos Santos (Juan)
    Ânderson Luís da Silva (Luisão)

    Goalkeepers
    Júlio César Soares de Espíndola (Júlio César)

    Overall I would say this generation is a little better than the first with the big boost to the chance creators and a few more good defenders.
     
  9. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I struggled with the points you are bringing up especially with them coming to the country so young all their footballing education takes place in France so they really were produced by the French football system.

    Also I guess that Eusebio and Coluna were from Mozambique when is was still a Portuguese colony.
     
  10. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I guess my new policy will be that players who moved to a new country and were capped in that country once their football careers were ongoing will be part of generations for their original country. So Deco and Marcos Senna will be part of Brazilian generations (they were capped by European countries because they could not get into the Brazil side so it makes sense that Brazil's depth should be reflected with them as part of the generation) and Kubala and Bican will be Hungarian and Austrian respectively etc.
     
    babaorum repped this.
  11. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
  12. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    One thing to consider is that goalies used to reach their primes later than field players (let's said 4 years later).
    So, is common to see into the same generation on into their primes to "field players" with 21 y.o. and goalies with 34 y.o.

    But, I understand if you want to stay things simple.
     
  13. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Good thread. Yours is more based on results with the national team. A results analysis also is based on who is playing together at the time. Mine like you said is a more total depth of players from one country in a time period and not based on when players are performing with the national team. So England's generation in the 70s will still make a good generation of players in my analysis because of their club success and overall quality but looking at the results of the national team, failing to qualify for two world cups would make it a poor generation.

    I am not really building the generation around two all time great players, but trying to build the best generations possible overall. Just using two of the key players to name them because the years players are born is kind of abstract, Brazil's 1928-1935 generation does not really mean anything but the Didi/Garrincha generation does.
     
    msioux75 repped this.
  14. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    My analysis also takes into account players not in the national team. This will be more relevant for nationals like Uruguay and Hungary who would lose players abroad that would then be capped for other countries.
     
  15. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Ranking the generations by role:

    Finishers

    1) Pele/Tostao or Altafini
    2) Ademir/Zizinho
    3) Didi/Garrincha
    4) Leonidas/da Guia
    5) Ronaldo/Rivaldo
    6) Romario/Careca
    7) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    8) Zico/Rivellino

    Chance Creators

    1) Didi/Garrincha
    2) Zico/Rivellino
    3) Pele/Tostao or Altafini
    4) Zizinho/Ademir
    5) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    6) Romario/Careca
    7) Ronaldo/Rivaldo
    8) Leonidas/da Guia

    Controllers

    1) Zico/Rivellino
    2) Ronaldo/Rivaldo
    3) Romario/Careca (both Josimar and Jorginho should be controllers)
    4) Didi/Garrincha
    5) Zizinho/Ademir
    6) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    7) Pele
    8) Leonidas/da Guia

    Defenders

    1) Didi/Garrincha
    2) Zico/Rivellino
    3) Romario/Careca
    4) Pele
    5) Zizinho/Ademor
    6) Leonidas/da Guia
    7) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    8) Ronaldo/Rivaldo

    Goalkeepers

    1) Zico/Rivellino
    2) Didi/Garrincha
    3) Zizinho/Ademor
    4) Romario/Careca
    5) Ronaldo/Rivaldo
    6) Pele
    7) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    8) Leonidas/da Guia

    Overall

    1) Didi/Garrincha
    2) Zico/Rivellino
    3) Zizinho/Ademir
    4) Pele/Altafini
    5) Romario/Careca
    6) Ronaldo/Rivaldo
    7) Ronaldo/Ronaldinho
    8) Leonidas/ da Guia

    For me Didi/Garrincha is clearly the best followed by Zico/Rivellino clearly second. Then the Zizinho, Pele, and Romario generations are all neck and neck. The last three are a way behind.
     
  16. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    England makes my top-5 in the 1970 and 1974 lists. Very close in 1978.
     
  17. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Looking at the generations around Pele and immediately after Pele there seems to be slightly better way to arrange the generations that makes sense to me.

    First I think the best Pele generation is the one with the older Players and Altafini. More depth is picked up overall that way picking up Manga, Amarildo, and Mengalvio as well.

    So Pele/Altafini from 1937 to 1944. Then the Zico/Rivellino splits two ways. Both Generations will still have the Zico/Falcao core from 1950-1953 as the players who should have peaked around 1978. The first generation would be the generation peaking around 1974 the Tostao/Rivellino generation from 1946-1953. Then the Zico/Socrates generation from 1950-1957 that would peak around the 1982 WC.

    Tostao/Rivellino 1946 to 1953

    Finishers
    Eduardo Gonçalves de Andrade (Tostao)
    Dario José dos Santos (Dadá Maravilha)
    Sérgio Bernardino (Serginho Chulapa)
    Gilberto Alves
    Vanderlei Eustáquio de Oliveira (Palhinha)

    Chance Creators
    Arthur Antunes Coimbra (Zico)
    Roberto Rivellino
    Dirceu José Guimarães (Dirceu)
    Dirceu Lopes
    Paulo Cesar Lima (Caju)
    Jonas Eduardo Américo (Edu)
    João Leiva Campos Filho (Leivinha)
    Paulo Isidoro de Jesus (Paulo Isidoro)
    Valdomiro Vaz Franco (Valdomiro)
    Jair Gonçalves Prates

    Controllers
    Paulo Roberto Falcao
    Clodoaldo Tavares de Santana (Clodoaldo)
    Paulo César Carpegiani (Carpegiani)
    Francisco das Chagas Marinho (Marinho Chagas)
    Manoel Rezende de Mattos Cabral (Nelinho)
    João Batista da Silva (Batista)

    Defenders
    Luís Edmundo Pereira (Luis Pereira)
    Marco Antônio Feliciano
    José Maria Rodrigues Alves (Ze Maria)
    José Rodrigues Neto (Turibio)
    Humberto Monteiro
    Joel Camargo
    Mário Peres Ulibarri (Marinho Peres)

    Goalkeepers
    Émerson Leão
    Waldir Peres de Arruda (Waldir Peres)

    Zico/Socrates 1950-1957

    Finishers
    Carlos Roberto de Oliveira (Roberto Dinamite)
    José Reinaldo de Lima (Reinaldo)
    Sérgio Bernardino (Serginho Chulapa)
    Gilberto Alves

    Chance Creators
    Arthur Antunes Coimbra (Zico)
    Sócrates Brasileiro Sampaio de Souza Vieira de Oliveira (Socrates)
    Dirceu José Guimarães (Dirceu)
    Éder Aleixo de Assis (Eder)
    Paulo Isidoro de Jesus (Paulo Isidoro)
    João Soares Almeida Filho (Joãozinho)
    Jair Gonçalves Prates

    Controllers
    Paulo Roberto Falcao
    Antônio Carlos Cerezo ( Toninho Cerezo)
    Leovegildo Lins da Gama Júnior (Junior)
    Francisco das Chagas Marinho (Marinho Chagas)
    Manoel Rezende de Mattos Cabral (Nelinho)
    João Batista da Silva (Batista)
    Zenon de Souza Farias (Zenon)
    Adílio de Oliveira Gonçalves (Adílio)
    José Sérgio Presti (Zé Sérgio)
    Mário Sérgio Pontes de Paiva (Mário Sérgio)
    Jorge Luís Andrade da Silva (Andrade)

    Defenders
    Edino Nazareth Filho (Edinho)
    Marco Antônio Feliciano
    Wladimir Rodrigues dos Santos (Wladimir)
    José Oscar Bernardi (Oscar)
    Celso Dias dos Santos (Celso)

    Goalkeepers
    Waldir Peres de Arruda (Waldir Peres)
    João Leite da Silva Neto (João Leite)
     
    JamesBH11 repped this.
  18. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    On to Italy.

    The first major group of footballers is comprised of a few generations of inter-war players who had strong performances for the national team winning two World Cups and two Central European Cups between 1927 and 1938. Because the birth dates of signature Italian players of the time stretch from 1900 to 1916 multiple "generations" were needed to capture them all. These generations have less depth than other generations because of my exclusion of Oriundo, South American players who were purchased near the peaks of their careers by Italian clubs and then given prominent places in the national team. In this era more than any other, Oriundo had vital parts of the Italian national team, most notably Miguel Andreolo, Enrique Guaita, Julio Libonatti, Luis Monti, and Raimundo Orsi. These generations are especially short of chance creators because not only did the national team employ many Oriundo at these positions, many club team did as well with players like Raimundo Orsi, Enrique Guaita, Renato Cesarini, Francisco Fedullo, Arturo Chini Ludueña, Attilio Demaría, Francisco Frione, Niginho, Filo, Nininho, Roberto Porta, Attila Sallustro, Raffaele Sansone, Alejandro Scopelli, and Pedro Sernagiotto all taking starting positions in creative,attacking positions for prominent club team.

    Combi/Ferrari generation is from 1900 to 1907.

    Finishers
    Angelo Schiavio
    Gino Rossetti
    Virgilio Levratto
    Mario Magnozzi
    Leopoldo Conti

    Chance Creators
    Giovanni Ferrari

    Controllers
    Luigi Bertolini
    Attilio Ferraris
    Antonio Janni
    Fulvio Bernardini
    Pietro Serantoni
    Alfredo Pitto
    Armando Castellazzi

    Defenders
    Virginio Rosetta
    Luigi Allemandi
    Umberto Caligaris
    Eraldo Monzeglio
    Felice Gasperi

    Goalkeepers
    Giampiero Combi
    Giovanni De Pra
    Mario Gianni

    This generation is very deep with players at controller, defender, and goalkeeper with lots of top talent as well. Players like Combi, Rosetta, Allemandi, Caligaris, Monzeglio, Bertolini, and Ferraris were all thought of as some of the best European players of their time at their positions. There is decent depth at finisher but a lack of star talent. Only one chance creator is present but he was great.

    The nest generations moves three years younger to capture Meazza but in turn losses some of the top talent at defender and goalkeeper the previous generation had.

    Allemandi/Meazza generation is from 1903 to 1910.

    Finishers
    Giuseppe Meazza
    Angelo Schiavio
    Gino Rossetti
    Virgilio Levratto
    Pietro Pastore

    Chance Creators
    Giovanni Ferrari
    Carlo Reguzzoni

    Controllers
    Luigi Bertolini
    Attilio Ferraris
    Antonio Janni
    Fulvio Bernardini
    Pietro Serantoni
    Mario Pizziolo
    Alfredo Pitto
    Armando Castellazzi
    Mario Montesanto

    Defenders
    Luigi Allemandi
    Eraldo Monzeglio
    Felice Gasperi

    Goalkeepers
    Aldo Olivieri
    Carlo Ceresoli

    I big step forward at finisher is taken by adding the best Italian player of the time. More depth is added to the creator and controller roles as well but major top end talent is lost at defender and goalkeeper.

    The final generation of this group moves even younger to combine with Meazza the other top Italian attacking talents of the time and acquires a mostly new group of controllers and defenders.

    Meazza/Piola generation is from 1909 to 1916

    Finishers
    Giuseppe Meazza
    Silvio Piola
    Guglielmo Gabetto
    Aldo Boffi
    Felice Borel
    Pietro Ferraris

    Chance Creators
    Gino Colaussi
    Amedeo Biavati

    Controllers
    Ugo Locatelli
    Mario Perazzolo
    Mario Pizziolo
    Mario Montesanto

    Defenders
    Pietro Rava
    Alfredo Foni

    Goalkeepers
    Aldo Olivieri
    Carlo Ceresoli

    The finishers position takes a huge step forward and is one of the strongest finisher groups of Italians ever with two all time great players and excellent depth. The chance creator position losses Ferrari but gains Colaussi, a relatively even trade. The depth at controller and defender is not present as it was in the earlier generations but the top talent is present in Locatelli, Rava, and Foni.
     
  19. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    There is a relatively large time gap to the next major generation of players in my view with Italy having a down period after WWII (major set back with the air crash killing the majority of the national team) until the arrival of the great teams of the 60s the won four European Cups, a European Championship, and made a World Cup final.

    Facchetti/Rivera generation is from 1939 to 1946

    Finishers
    Luigi Riva
    Roberto Boninsegna
    Pierino Prati
    Sergio Gori

    Chance Creators
    Gianni Rivera
    Sandro Mazzola
    Mario Corso
    Gigi Meroni
    Angelo Domenghini

    Controllers
    Romeo Benetti
    Giacomo Bulgarelli
    Giancarlo De Sisti
    Giuseppe Furino
    Giovanni Trapattoni
    Giorgio Ferrini
    Gianfranco Bedin
    Fabio Capello
    Mario Bertini
    Antonio Juliano
    Giovanni Lodetti

    Defenders
    Giacinto Facchetti
    Tarcisio Burgnich
    Sandro Salvadore
    Giuseppe Wilson
    Roberto Rosato
    Pierluigi Cera

    Goalkeeper
    Dino Zoff
    Enrico Albertosi
    Luciano Castellini

    This generation is in clear contention for the best Italian generation even in my opinion. They have possibly the greatest Italian striker ever backed up by another excellent finisher. Two of the greatest number 10s Italy ever produced plus some very talented wingers at chance creator. An extremely deep group of defensive midfielders at controller. The group of defenders is somewhat lacking compared to younger generations but it still contains two all time great players. The goalkeeper group is also fantastic.

    The next generation is also in contention for the best Italian generation ever in my opinion and is centered around the players who performed excellently at the 1978 and 1982 World Cups, winning the later. It can be organized in two ways around the core of player born between 1953 and 1956 (Scirea, Gentile, Antognoni, Tardelli, Conte, and Rossi). The first generation moves back to 1949 to acquire more players associated with 1978 (Causio, Bettega) while the second moves to 1960 for younger players who were emerging in the 80s (Cabrini, Baresi, Zenga).

    The Bettega/Scirea generation is from 1949 to 1956

    Finishers
    Paolo Rossi
    Roberto Bettega
    Alessandro Altobelli
    Paolo Pulici
    Roberto Pruzzo
    Francesco Graziani
    Giordano Bruno

    Chance Creators
    Giancarlo Antognoni
    Bruno Conti
    Franco Causio
    Evaristo Beccalossi

    Controllers
    Marco Tardelli
    Agostino Di Bartolomei
    Salvatore Bagni
    Gabriele Oriali
    Renato Zaccarelli
    Giampiero Marini

    Defenders
    Gaetano Scirea
    Cladio Gentile
    Antonello Cuccureddu
    Mauro Bellugi
    Luciano Spinosi
    Aldo Maldera

    Goalkeeper
    Ivano Bordon
    Franco Tancredi

    This may be the greatest group of Italian finishers ever depending on whether or not you prefer top end talent (1909-1916) or total depth of strong players (1949-1956). The chance creators are a very strong group by Italian standards and the controllers are solid led by Italy's best Tardelli. The defender group is solid but not great compared to other Italian generation, similar 1939 to 1946 with only a couple of top players. The goalkeeper group is weak. Overall this groups abundance of attacking players was reflected in the team attractive and attacking approach at WC 78.

    Tweaking the generation to younger players changes the overall strengths and weaknesses of the generation.

    The Scirea/Baresi generation is from 1953 to 1960

    Finishers
    Paolo Rossi
    Alessandro Altobelli
    Roberto Pruzzo
    Giordano Bruno
    Aldo Serena

    Chance Creators
    Giancarlo Antognoni
    Bruno Conti
    Evaristo Beccalossi

    Controllers
    Marco Tardelli
    Agostino Di Bartolomei
    Salvatore Bagni
    Giuseppe Dossena
    Carlo Ancelotti
    Antonio di Gennaro

    Defenders
    Franco Baresi
    Gaetano Scirea
    Antonio Cabrini
    Cladio Gentile
    Pietro Vierchowod
    Fulvio Collovati
    Mauro Tassotti
    Roberto Tricella
    Aldo Maldera

    Goalkeeper
    Walter Zenga
    Stefano Tacconi
    Giovanni Galli
    Franco Tancredi

    The finishers or still solid but not nearly as good as the previous group, losing Bettega, Pulici, and Graziani. The chance creators are unchanged except by the important loss of Causio and the controllers are tottaly unchanged. There are major additions to the defenders making this possibly the best generation of Italian defenders ever with Baresi, Cabrini, Vierchowod, Collovatti, and Tassotti adding to Scirea and Gentile. There is also a major upgrade at goalkeeper with an all time great in Zenga and additional depth. This generations strength also reflects the teams approach at WC 82 as oppose to 78, with a more pragmatic style centered around a great defense.
     
  20. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    indeed he has a strange way of reasoning if a sudden aprt of the world was colonized by say france then peopel bornt there are french..

    i mean we dutch owned surniname for a logn logn time it bcame independent in 1975 to me all those born before 1975 are dutch and thsoe born after 1975 like fore xampel seedorf where brought up in holland have a dutch pasport so are dutch people its as simple as that..
     
  21. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

    Jul 19, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Argentina in the 30s (Orsi, Monti, Stabile), 40s (Moreno, Pedernera, Lostau), 50s (DiStefano, Sivori, Maschio), and 70s, which had this kind of depth:

    Goalkeepers: Fillol, Gatti, Lavolpe, D'Alessandro, Pumpido
    Fullbacks: Wolff, Olguin, Tarantini
    Centerbacks: Passarella, Galvan, Trossero, Mouzo
    Centermids: Gallego, Ardiles, Lopes, Villa, Marangoni
    Playmakers: Bochini, Alonso, Valencia, Brindisi
    Wingers: Bertoni, Houseman, Ortiz
    Forwards: Kempes, Babington, Scotta
    Strikers: Bianchi, Luque, Valdano
     
    JamesBH11 repped this.
  22. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    yes from 70s to 80s
     
  23. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

    Jul 19, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    All of the players I mentioned were of age to play at WC78, aside Gatti, the oldest were Luque and Galvan at 29 and the youngest Pumpido and Valdano at 21.
     
  24. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    The next Italian generation Stretches from Baresi and Zenga in 1960s to capture younger players most importantly Baggio.

    The Baresi/Baggio generation is from 1960 to 1967

    Finishers
    Gianluca Vialli
    Salvatore Schillaci
    Aldo Serena

    Chance Creators
    Roberto Baggio
    Gianfranco Zola
    Roberto Donadoni
    Giuseppe Giannini
    Roberto Mancini
    Angelo Di Livio
    Daniele Massaro

    Controllers
    Fernando de Napoli
    Nicola Berti
    Alberigo Evani

    Defenders
    Franco Baresi
    Giuseppe Bergomi
    Ciro Ferrara
    Riccardo Ferri
    Alessandro Costacurta
    Lorenzo Minotti
    Mauro Tassotti
    Luigi De Agostini
    Roberto Cravero
    Amedeo Carboni
    Giovanni Francini
    Luigi Apolloni

    Goalkeepers
    Walter Zenga
    Gianluca Pagliuca
    Sebastiano Rossi
    Luca Marchegiani

    This generation has one strong player at both finisher and controller but is thin at both positions overall. In contrast it is very deep with top quality and total talent at chance creator and defender. It is also excellent at goalkeeper. Although the defender position is slightly behind the 1953-1960 generations defender group in top talent, it has more depth and may rival it for the overall best generation of Italian defenders.

    The next generation is constructed around Baggio and Maldini (Baresi and Maldini, although teammates for a number of years, were born 9 year apart). There are two alternate ways to form a generation around Baggio and Maldini. Both inlove the core of players from 1964 to 1970. The first alternative includes 1963 (Donadoni and Bergomi) and the second includes 1971 (Albertini and Toldo)

    Baggio/Maldini A is from 1963 to 1970 (players unique to each version bolded)

    Finishers
    Gianluca Vialli
    Beppe Signori
    Enrico Chiesa
    Fabrizio Ravanelli
    Salvatore Schillaci
    Pierluigi Casiraghi

    Chance Creators
    Roberto Baggio
    Gianfranco Zola
    Roberto Donadoni
    Giuseppe Giannini
    Roberto Mancini
    Paolo Di Canio
    Gianluigi Lentini
    Angelo Di Livio

    Controllers
    Roberto Di Matteo
    Fernando de Napoli
    Antonio Conte
    Nicola Berti
    Alberigo Evani

    Defenders
    Paolo Maldini
    Giuseppe Bergomi
    Ciro Ferrara
    Riccardo Ferri
    Alessandro Costacurta
    Lorenzo Minotti
    Roberto Cravero
    Amedeo Carboni
    Moreno Torricelli
    Gianluca Pessotto
    Giovanni Francini
    Antonio Benarrivo
    Luigi Apolloni

    Goalkeepers
    Angelo Peruzzi
    Gianluca Pagliuca
    Sebastiano Rossi
    Luca Marchegiani

    Baggio/Maldini B is from 1964 to 1971 (players unique to each version bolded)

    Finishers
    Gianluca Vialli
    Beppe Signori
    Enrico Chiesa
    Fabrizio Ravanelli
    Salvatore Schillaci
    Pierluigi Casiraghi

    Chance Creators
    Roberto Baggio
    Gianfranco Zola
    Giuseppe Giannini
    Roberto Mancini
    Paolo Di Canio
    Gianluigi Lentini
    Angelo Di Livio

    Controllers
    Demetrio Albertini
    Roberto Di Matteo
    Luigi Di Biagio
    Dino Baggio
    Fernando de Napoli
    Antonio Conte
    Nicola Berti


    Defenders
    Paolo Maldini
    Ciro Ferrara
    Alessandro Costacurta
    Lorenzo Minotti
    Roberto Cravero
    Amedeo Carboni
    Moreno Torricelli
    Gianluca Pessotto
    Giuseppe Pancaro
    Antonio Benarrivo
    Luigi Apolloni

    Goalkeepers
    Angelo Peruzzi
    Gianluca Pagliuca
    Francesco Toldo
    Sebastiano Rossi
    Luca Marchegiani

    Both generations are deep at defender, finisher, and chance creator. The major exchange in quality between the two is A has a significantly better group of defenders (rivaling the previous Italian generations for the bets ever) and B has a significantly better controller group, an area where A was deficient. B's group of goalkeepers is one of the best ever with the addition of Toldo.

    The final generation of Italian players is the one based on the group that won the 2006 World Cup.

    The Nesta/Pirlo generation is from 1973 to 1979

    Finishers
    Christian Vieri
    Filippo Inzaghi
    Luca Toni
    Vincenzo Montella
    Antonio Di Natale
    Marco Delvecchio
    Vincenzo Iaquinta

    Chance Creators
    Francesco Totti
    Alessandro Del Piero
    Stefano Fiore

    Controllers
    Andrea Pirlo
    Gennaro Gattuso
    Simone Perrotta

    Defenders
    Alessandro Nesta
    Fabio Cannavaro
    Gianluca Zambrotta
    Christian Panucci
    Marco Materazzi
    Francesco Coco
    Giuseppe Favalli
    Fabio Grosso
    Massimo Oddo
    Mark Iuliano

    Goalkeepers
    Gianluigi Buffon
    Christian Abbiati

    This is a solid generation with at least one top 5 player for Italy all time at each position. Finisher is deep, while chance creator and controller are not despite having some top players. Defender is very deep and goalkeepers has one all time great/
     
  25. Tom Stevens

    Tom Stevens Member+

    Dec 12, 2012
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Position rankings

    Finisher
    1) Meazza/Piola
    2) Bettega/Scirea
    3) Nesta/Pirlo
    4) Facchetti/Rivera
    5) Scirea/Baresi
    6) Baggio/Maldini A/B
    7) Ferrari/Meazza
    8) Combi/Ferrari
    9) Baresi/Baggio

    Chance Creator
    1) Facchetti/Rivera
    2) Baggio/Maldini A
    3) Baresi/Baggio
    4) Bettega/Scirea
    5) Baggio/Maldini B
    6) Nesta/Pirlo
    7) Scirea/Baresi
    8) Ferrari/Meazza
    9) Meazza/Piola
    10) Combi/Ferrari

    Controller
    1) Facchetti/Rivera
    2) Bettega/Scirea
    3) Scirea/Baresi
    4) Baggio/Maldini B
    5) Ferrari/Meazza
    6) Combi/Ferrari
    7) Nesta/Pirlo
    8) Meazza/Piola
    9) Baggio/Maldini A
    10) Baresi/Baggio

    Defender
    1) Scirea/Baresi
    2) Baresi/Baggio
    3) Baggio/Maldini A
    4) Baggio/Maldini B
    5) Combi/Ferrari
    6) Nesta/Pirlo
    7) Facchetti/Rivera
    8) Bettega/Scirea
    9) Ferrari/Meazza
    10) Meazza/Piola

    Goalkeeper
    1) Baggio/Maldini B
    2) Facchetti/Rivera
    3) Baresi/Baggio
    4) Baggio/Maldini A
    5) Scirea/Baresi
    6) Nesta/Pirlo
    7) Combi/Ferrari
    8) Ferrari/Meazza and Meazza/Piola
    9) Bettega/Scirea

    Overall
    1) Facchetti/Rivera
    2) Baggio/Maldini A/B
    3) Scirea/Baresi
    4) Bettega/Scirea
    5) Baresi/Baggio
    6) Nesta/Pirlo
    7) All Pre WWII relatively equal

    I think Facchetti/Rivera at number one makes sense. Although they did not win the WC as the Scirea and Nesta/Pirlo generations did they made the final and won a European Championship. Also the reason Facchetti/Rivera may have underachieved (if you can call it that) internationally is the failure of the coaching staff to integrate their two great attackers, Rivera and Mazzola, into one team, which has nothing to do with a lack of talent. This generation also won four European Cups with teams where many of most important players on the teams were Italians from this generation.
     

Share This Page