strongest/best all time team

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by tony-soprano37, Oct 15, 2014.

  1. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    ofcourse its jsut gessing and nothign else but supposse there was a competition with a home and away game between lets say 12 nations all tiem teams. so at the end who would coem out on top ?

    argentina, brazil, uruguay, holland, germany, france, italy, hungary, spain, portugal, england, scotland..

    those 12 nations imo can bring on the strongest squads. maybe (former) yugoslavia and russia (former soviet union) should also be included ?? so either 12 or 14 nations..

    feel free to add russia/soviet union or yugoslavia if you feel like..

    lets say all teams have a 18 man selection because in a competition ofcourse soem get injured, receive red and yellow cards etc etc.

    i would favor my own nation (holland) in a 1 one 1 vs most of these nations but in certain positions the depth of quality isn't big enough especially our rightback position.. our starting 11 are capable of winning agaisnt each and everyone of the other nations but for exampel loosing defenders like suurbier or krol due to suspencions or injury leaves us with not the same quality.. so holland will probably end up amongst the best 4 but not as nr. 1

    for the same reason i don't see brazil winnign it.. just to few atg defensive players....especially central defense and DM.. there attackign players ofcourse are plenty to chooce from zico, pele, garincha, ronaldo, rivelino, romario

    hungary ?? an atg attack line (kubala, puskas, kocsic, czibor, hidegkuti) they can come up with yet their troubles are also in defense..

    england and scotland ? quite comparable imo.. (charlton, moore, banks, finney, matthews for england...dalglish, mcgrain, hansen, souness, johnstone for scotland) yet i feel still a level below some of the other nations. they will not end up in the top 5

    uruguay is probably the opposite of hungary.... enough quality in defense.. andrade and andrade, varela, nazassi, santamaria.. but only schiaffino and maybe francescoli are atg offensive players for them..

    spain ??? gento, luis suarez miramontes and besides them ? great attackers they had but none atg level.. their defense though is quite good.. quincoces, hierro, camacho, either zamorra or casillas in goal..

    portugal the opposite of spain.. offensive.. figo, christiano ronaldo, eusebio, coluna, rui costa... but portugese defenders just very good not atg (maybe germano the exception)

    that leaves us with argentina, france, germany and italy....

    italy has for each defensive position 2 or 3 players from atg level and quality.. zoff, buffon, baresi, nesta, cannavaro, scirea, bergomi, gentile, maldini, fachetti thats some richness to chooce from..
    midfield also enough good players to chooce from.. but imo italy lacks a few atg finishers..
    still italy is a contender to win...

    germany... probably same as italy.. enough defenders and midfielders to chooce from.. maier, beckenbauer, kaltz, vogts, kohler, schnellinger, breitner, netzer, overath, matthaus, sammer..
    but no real atg wingers and as for strikers besides muller and rummenigge maybe uwe seeler..
    but germany is germany ..great fighting mentality to the end

    next is france...france has one great striker henry (dominique rochetau was borderline great to much injured etc etc).. still platini, zidane, kopa thats enough attackign qualities..
    defensively also enough to chooce from tigana, vieira, desailly, tresor, lizerazu, thuram, amoros.
    yet france lacks and atg goalkeeper their goalkeepers have always been average...

    finally argentina...fillol, carizzo, passarella, rugerri, marzolini, zanetti, rossi, monti, redondo thats solid enough maybe the depth in other backs is slightly not as good s some other nations.
    attackingly its phenomenal.. moreno, messi, maradona, di stefano, orsi, sivori..



    conclusion... in a competition of the all tiem teams of the best nations in the world probably argentina would come out as the winner............

    give me you're thoughts though..
     
  2. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    I believe Italy and Brazil are equal.

    Phenomenon-Meazza, All-Time Serie A goalscorer Piola, All-Time Azzurri goalscorer Riva, supremely talented-Baggio and the supporting cast of Boniperti, Del Piero, Vieri, Bettega, Totti... is a match for most 'All-Time Great' rosters.

    Alongside your #9, you could play either a free-scoring seconda punta like Riva, a goalscoring trequartista/inside-forward like Sandro and Valentino Mazzola AND/OR a creative fantasista like Rivera, Antognoni, Baggio or Totti - the end result would be Goooolaçoooo! Stop the opponent from scoring, counter when they are weak, then the tears of joy will roll.

    In defence we have a rich plethora of legendary options that elevate the starting XI to 'All-Time Best', equal to Brazil.
    The midfield options are bountiful too with players who know what it takes to win. The lack of 'All-Time Great' wingers is balanced by the strength of the system.
     
  3. Excape Goat

    Excape Goat Member+

    Mar 18, 1999
    Club:
    Real Madrid
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  4. J'can

    J'can Member+

    Jul 3, 2007
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    you are such a self promoting troll. this is not the draft thread you wanker.
     
  5. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    From a pre-1970's perspective, a British XI would be a contender...
     
  6. schwuppe

    schwuppe Member+

    Sep 17, 2009
    Club:
    FC Kryvbas Kryvyi Rih
    In a single elimation format I would give Italy more chances that a in league format.
     
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  7. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    oh i am not denying italy had great players but boniperti, del piero, vieri, totti, bettega are not comparbale to the attack line of brazil, argentina and some other nations..
    point is italy is used to a certian playign style they not gonna play with 3 or 4 all out attackers thats not italy..
    italy would probably play hghly defensive wich is their strong point and wait for the counter but in a competition like this they paly agaisnt natiosn who also have superb defenders and also atg attackers

    i agree and already said italy are a good contender and have a chance of winning but imo they lack just the extra bit..

    as talented as rivera, mazzola and baggio, riva, meazza where they are jsut a class below the likes of for example pele, cruyff, messi, di stefano, maradona, zico, platini, gullit, ronaldo, van basten
     
  8. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    conternder fro a top 5 spot yes.. for winnign the competition ??? hmm not to sure about that.. a pre 1970's brazil still would include garincha, didi, pele, djalma and nilton, da guia..

    maybe if it would be a totally united kingdom team then yes then it would include also scotlands and northern ireland and wales..

    that would be somethign like this..

    goal..................................banks
    leftback............................hapgood
    rightback.........................mcgrain
    sweeper...........................hansen
    central defender..............moore
    left midfield....................robson
    central midfield..............charlton
    rightmidfield..................souness
    leftwing...........................best (switching with rightwinger from time to time)
    rightwing.........................finney swithcign with leftwinger from time to time)
    striker..............................dalglish

    now this team would be a real contender
     
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  9. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    What country contains all those names...?

    Plus, no All Time Best team will be fielding four or five #10's.
     
  10. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    WC70 Brazil team with 4,5 #10 (Pele Rivelino Gerson Tostrao and Jiarzinho)
    WC82 Brazil had 3 #10 (Zico, Socrates and arguably Falcao/Cerezo)
    WC2006 Brazil had 3 #10 (Ronaldinho, Kaka and Juninho Pernambucano)

    Euro 2012, Spain had 3,4 #10 : Xavi, Iniesta, Silva and Cecs
     
  11. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    mmm
    History said Italy tend to lose most the time to Brazil from (1-4 ) WC70 - to latest (1-4) Confedcup 2013
     
  12. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    You're confusing 'a player who can make play' with a #10.

    They all had different roles/positions.
     
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  13. Pipiolo

    Pipiolo Member+

    Jul 19, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    I think Argentina would win it:

    Fillol
    Zanetti-Mascherano-Passarella-Marzolini
    Redondo-Ardiles-Bochini-Maradona
    Messi-DiStefano
     
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  14. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    i ment that italys attacking players are not of the same level as for example brazil, argentina and holland..

    for example an attacking line up like this..(just an example mate)
    -----riva---------meazza-------
    ---------baggio-----rivera-----

    just isn't as good as for example a dutch attacking line up

    rensenbrink-----van basten------gullit
    ----------------cruyff---------------------

    or a brazilian......

    --------------ronaldo----------garincha
    rivelino------pele-----zico------------

    or an argentinian
    with guys like di stefano, maradona and messi

    italy has had great strikers and attackign players just not of the same level as soem of the other teams..
     
  15. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    why not ?? it all depends on how good those players where and how versatile...and allround..
    brazil could play with both pele and zico and even rivelino in the role he had in 1970.

    france the same thing...
    ------------henry----------------
    zidane-----platini-------kopa
    ------tigana--------vieira--------

    all three are nr. 10 players.. this is a formation very well and possible.. france did not have so many atg strikers. yet all 3 (platini, zidane and kopa are atg players and should be in an all tiem team)
    kopa was playign from the inside right at real madrid also quite well..

    an all tiem holland team can play with gullit on rightwing.. allthough gullit was a 10 in his clubcareer many years.. cruyff at the nr. 10 spot.. van hanegem at left midfied as he always did in nt yet played nr. 10 spot for his club.

    so its quite well possible that a tem lines up 3 to 4 players who are originally nr. 10 players but due to their all round greatness and/or versatily play on a another position.
     
  16. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Italy would never field all four of those in a line-up. You still need to grasp the importance of balance and the tactical strategy of each unique nation.


    --------------ronaldo----------garincha
    rivelino------pele-----zico------------

    What is that?! Don't tell me, Vava is in goal and Zizinho is playing centre-half?


    Your France XI is arguably more balanced, with the "tigana--------vieira" pivot. I thought you were going to play Cantona and Giresse in there :speechless:


    Looking at squad depth, Italy and Brazil are still the favourites. Germany and Argentina would be the other semi-finalists and top contenders. No one can equal Pelé or Maradona, so stop this "not at the same level" talk - otherwise you've concluded the discussion before it has even begun. It is a team game after-all :ROFLMAO:
     
  17. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    first of you're question i answer..
    that was the frontlines of all tiem brazil.. i will put the whole team if that makes it easier for you..
    --------------------gilmar-------------------------
    djalma------------da guia---------------------nilton
    -----------t. cerezo----------------falcao-----------
    ------------zico----------pele------------rivelino
    garincha----------ronaldo---------------------------

    this would imo be the best brazil with rivelino playing as a false leftwinger commign from midfield. just oen central defender (brazil did not had so many atg central defenders) 2 defensive midfielders cerezo and falcao..

    secodn why would italy not field all of them four in a line up ?? its about making the strongest team.......

    -------------------zoff-----------------
    gentile--------scirea---maldini----------fachetti
    ----------------------tardelli-------------------------
    ------------rivera---------------v. mazzola---------
    ------------------------baggio---------------------------
    --------------meazza------------riva-------------
    this would work quite well 2 forwards and baggio behind them. valentino mazzola was 2 footed so could come from the left and rivera attack right midfield.
    tardelli does the running etc etc he was tireless. he is the box to box. fachetti sometimes go on attack then maldini covers for him..
    in this hypothetical competition italy hs got to play more attacking then they are used to.. they cannot simply defend defend ddfend they will not stop some of the other tems from scoring.
    not with all them great attackers in them other teams.

    as for the france team... no giresse and no cantona......... hell no..

    -------------------barthez------------------ or any other one. french simply don't have atg goalie
    thuram-------desailly-------tresor---------lizerazu
    -------------vieira---------------tigana-------------
    ------kopa---------platini--------------zidane-----------
    ------------------------------henry---------------
    this would be france........ very well balanced.. sad to keep amoros out he could play both leftback and rightback but thuram and lizerazu probably a bit betetr in their position as amoros (one of me favorite players).

    and lookign at squad depth brazil is anythign but a favorite............ if da guia gets suspended or injured what great central defender would they put in ???
    brazil lacks atg level central defenders..

    last but not least please stop with the ridicoulous..........no one can equal pele or maradona......... its liek a child worshipping somebody its sad mate..
    they where not gods.. di stefano and cruyff are from the same level..

    sometiems i really get angry when people act as if pele is god or way abiove everybody else..
    ofcourse he belongs with the absolute best i agree but its not like he is way above everybody else....
    3 wc's.... ok... 1 of them he played just over 1 game so ???
    the other 2 he was surrounded by some of the best players ever.. i mean face it if in 1958 brazil had raul or inzaghi instead of pele they also would have become champs..

    as for the 1000 plus goals ? there are a few more who scored so much.. pepe bican, romario, puskas, muller to name a few...
     
  18. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    #18 La-Máquina, Oct 16, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2014
    This is a monstrosity - please can the forum moderator strip you of all formation-creating privileges. This would not win any All-Time tournament. I could pick a Brazilian XI from players you have not even chosen that would convincingly destroy this imbalanced clusterf##k.


    Your lack of knowledge of Italian football history is truly shining now. You can't just pick the 11 best players like a football game and expect them to be the "strongest".

    Why, are Luís Pereira, Thiago Silva, Lúcio and Mauro Ramos all on holiday?

    A fine team :thumbsup:

    ...thanks for proving my point :thumbsup: Don't put Argentina and Brazil on a pedestal, when on their day, Italy and Germany have been just as lethal (and succesful).
     
  19. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    why is the brazil line up a monstrosity ?? nilton and djalma are their best backs. i never eve rhave been impressed with brazilian centrebacks so better 1 good centrback and 2 very good defensive midfielders before them.. its a balanced team..
    falcao is a atg DM. toninho cerezo was a tireless runner.. it has a great rightwinger.. rivelino as a false leftwinger but also nilton did go on the attack on the leftflank. it has a great striker in ronaldo a great secondstriker behind it name dpele and also zico.. maybe if need be zico can be changed for didi but imo its a balanced team..

    as for luis pereira pfft don't make me laugh he is not worth in an all tiem team same goes for thiago silva..

    the italian team i did not just pick the 11 best i tried to make a balanced team.. a little more attacking then italians normally are but they have to be in a all tiem competition.. instead of just complain tell em what IN YOU'RE OPINION is wrong with my italian line up.. its well balanced.. good all round solid defenders who are amongst the best ever.. tardelli is good as a box to box/DM player.
    and then it has 5 creative attackign players, maybe a bit more then italy normally plays but its a good line up..

    as for you're last setence you probably did not read my openingsstatement good because i did not put brazil on a pedestal i said brazil probably lacks depth in defenders to win an all tiem competition.. a tournament yes a competition with suspences and injuries they will win not..

    argentina is the best contender they have the most depth in defense and offense..

    germany lacks depth in offensive players.. like i said muller and rummenigge (maybe seeler maybe) if one of those is injured or suspended the players to replace them like klinsmann/voller/klose level of players are just not good enough
     
  20. tony-soprano37

    Dec 5, 2008
    Club:
    AFC Ajax
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    i accept you're challenge please pick a brazilian team with none of the players i mentioned.....

    ps and if it includes roberto carlos then i will never ever take you seriously anymore.....
     
  21. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    yeah? like I do not know?

    Didi, Gerson, Rivelino, Tostao Pele Zico Socrates were ALL PLAY MAKERS for their teams in Brazil period
    Falcao, Jairzinho were ... "arguably" case agree
     
  22. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Maybe because the 3-2-5 died out a century ago ;) - and with good reason, keep up. However, your line-up is one or two changes from being a masterpiece.


    This is where your Italian masterplan goes splat like spaghetti on a marble floor - Tardelli as a box to box midfielder with 5 "attacking players" in front of him... I'm all for beautiful attacking football, but the suicidal tactical set-up of this starting XI is abhorantly naive and imbalanced. Look at the midfields the likes of Tardelli and Rivera flourished in - you've missed one vital component.

    Sorry for my misunderstanding.

    Maybe Seeler? A much under-appreciated and underrated figure along with Gerd Müller, Sczepan, Völler, Fischer, Rahn, Hoeneß, Walter, Rummenigge, Klinsmann, Schäfer, Littbarski, Morlock...... no lack in depth there!

    Yes, Argentina are a Top 4 Contender - but who has claimed Monti, Italy or Argentina?
     
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  23. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    Let me start my XI from the front where I can win the game out-right.

    Romário.


    Romário vs your back three:

    djalma------------da guia---------------------nilton


    Romário finds himself one-on-one with Domingos da Guia. What happens next?

    Next, I will introduce you to Danilo Alvim.

    Rivelino and Garrincha won't be tracking back so Jairzinho and Zizinho will have a field day versus your fullbacks.
    Gérson, the genius from Mexico will be the architect in my victory. How dare you mention Roberto Carlos' name in an All-Time Brazil discussion? :confused: My favourite fullback Júnior will play at left back.
     
  24. JamesBH11

    JamesBH11 Member+

    Sep 17, 2004
    my 2 cents ...
    Garrincha will always track back IF (only) he lost the ball from his dribbling vs 1, 2 DF (LOL)
    Rivelino tracked back more then both Zizinho and Jairzinho
     
  25. La-Máquina

    La-Máquina BigSoccer Supporter

    Mar 5, 2013
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Italy
    You can have your "2 cents" back :ROFLMAO:

    Zizinho's complete game should not be rediculed.

    Jairzinho is afforded more freedom as I have four in midfield, and four in defence.
     
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