Other Teams News Part II [R]

Discussion in 'Borussia Dortmund' started by ForeverRed, Jan 12, 2011.

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  1. Spanky144

    Spanky144 Member

    Jun 30, 2014
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    I know youre not askimg me but ill give my take...


    Its deservedly so Gotze is riding pine, whenever he plays hes one of the worste players on the pitch. Schurrle has been an absolute BEAST.

    I think if Gotze was still in BVB he'd probably be playing much better.

    Even though i support all German players, hopefully Gotze' career with Germany remains as it is, bench player 3rd option sub. F you Gotze. Ya im a sour puss after his departure.
     
  2. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Hehehe, I asked him because he's a Bayern fan, mature and likely to take a more objective view. But you are absolutely right. His performance for Bayern declined over the course of the season.

    I can't help but find it preposterous that they are (considering) selling Kroos, one of the best performers in the world cup, and that too for a paltry 20M while Gotze stays out of the rain in Brasil. Nothing would make me more happy than to see this bite them in the ass next year....to our benefit of course.
     
  3. nekkibasara

    nekkibasara Member+

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Virginia
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I'm actually more worried about what it means for Germany. Kroos is a key player for this team now, and I have a feeling his development will regress at Real.
     
  4. Spanky144

    Spanky144 Member

    Jun 30, 2014
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Wow only 20m!? With the going rate of players nowadays Madrid got a bargain!
     
  5. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You guys are funny! Wait until everything shakes out.......
     
  6. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Kroos is already developed.
     
  7. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Yep. He's not getting much better than this.
     
  8. footyfan1

    footyfan1 BigSoccer Supporter

    Oct 20, 2003
    San Antonio, Texas
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #6058 footyfan1, Jul 10, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2014
    I guess I should have been clearer about the situation. It was not a blanket statement. I meant guys who Bayern get rid of to make room for others or who Bayern simply has no use for anymore. Did I really have to say this?? Why do you think I only mentioned Gomez and Mandzukic??

    But since I did not say this, I apologize for not having been clear enough. I will remember the next time.

    Let's tackle Kroos first. Bayern isn't potentially selling Kroos to make room for anyone else or because they have no use for him. Bayern is potentially selling Kroos because Kroos has them right where he wants them. Kroos is in position to dictate to Bayern because he can leave on a free after the coming season. Sure, Bayern can afford to not sell and allow Kroos to leave on this free after the coming season. But what "purpose" will this serve? Again, my claim is that Bayern makes these sales with a purpose. However, when it comes to Kroos, Bayern just does not have control as in the other situations such as Gomez and Mandzukic.

    BTW, I am certain these 20M Euro figures will wind up being wrong as I believe Kroos' agent when he says anything happening will be finalized after the World Cup.

    However, I still laugh at people bemoaning that 20M Euro figure because even if Bayern sells for 20M, it might not be what Kroos is currently worth, but guess what? When it comes to Kroos, Bayern will still make 22.5M in transfer and loan fees over Kroos' time.

    Bayern paid 2.5M to Rostock for Kroos when Kroos was a kid. Bayern got 5M from Leverkusen when Kroos was loaned there. 20M might seem low because of what Kroos is doing now, but it is still outstanding business on Bayern's part. Bayern isn't desperate for money and neither are they concerned with the vanity of some fans.


    Now let's move to Hargreaves. Hargreaves was a simple case of Bayern receiving an offer it could not refuse for a player who was damaged goods. Hargreaves was begging to go to Manchester United and Bayern got more from Manchester United than anyone had any business paying for Hargreaves at that time. Would you have paid 25M for a guy who made all of 9 appearances for his club the season before?? I wouldn't have. And of course, at Manchester United, Hargreaves made 23 appearances and was a factor in their CL victory in his first season. After this, he made a total of 4 appearances in the next three seasons. After that first season in Manchester, Owen Hargreaves was on the injury list for the rest of his career. Do you think Bayern somehow did not make this move knowing Hargreaves would not ever come back around to hurt them? As I remember, KHR said he was surprised SAF wanted to pay that much money for Hargreaves knowing what they knew about Hargreaves' health.

    Bayern made 25M on a guy who was held together by bandages. You don't see the purpose in that? LOL!!!
     
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  9. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Kroos is turning out to be like Andrea Pirlo. In his 20's people only realized Pirlo's value when he wasn't on the pitch. In his 30's people finally realized what an incredible player he really is. I also don't think that Kroos doesn't want to leave Bayern if they paid him what he was worth.
     
  10. Raumdeuter

    Raumdeuter Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    Texas
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    ^^What do you think Kroos is worth?
     
  11. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Fabregas is a similar type of player. He underperformed (according to some) and went to Chelsea for ~30M. Kroos has performed extremely well in 2 years, won the CL (Fabregas hasn't) and is 3 years younger. Shouldn't he be worth around 40M?

    I find it bizarre when people say that Bayern don't need the money. WTF! Madrid don't need the money either and even they cashed in on Ozil and Higuain. Not to mention Madrid beat Bayern by 80M in turnover as of last year.
     
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  12. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    Huh?

    Bayern has the most liquid assists of any football team on the planet. Real is leveraged to their eyeballs and can only afford to pay these fees due to constant borrowing at favorable interest rates given to them through pressure by the Spanish government.

    Real most definitely needs the money for debt servicing. Of course, if they ever came close to defaulting the Spanish government would do what they did in 2002 and force all debtors to forgive their debts so Real would not go bankrupt. But if they were run like a business Real would be in such debt that they'd need to count every damn penny...while Bayern have hundreds of millions in investments they could liquidate at any time. HUGE difference.
     
  13. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    This is amazingly expensive...

     
  14. Raumdeuter

    Raumdeuter Member+

    Jan 14, 2009
    Texas
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    You realize kroos would be able to sign for Free in 6months time?
     
  15. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    That's a big if. So my statement stands. I knew somebody would bring up their bottom line since I mentioned their top line. Real will never ever be challenged in their country.
     
  16. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Yes. But you asked me how much he's worth so I am telling you. I purposely brought up Fabregas because he was deadset on leaving and leaving ONLY for Barcelona and Arsenal still got 35M for him.
     
  17. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    I am not saying they will be challenged in their country.

    I said they actually need the money in strict financial terms. Under FFP there is a very good chance that UEFA may not allow them to get another bail out like they did earlier. We shall see how the whole Barca and PSG issues shake out and their aftermath.

    But fact remains Real has a very high debt to equity ratio and is nearly unable to service their debt....so they certainly need money (of some kind) more than Bayern. Now, they will likely get it from banks (again), but they need the cash from somewhere, whereas Bayern don't.
     
  18. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    Under FFP? ROFL. You actually think Real would be held in contempt of FFP? That would be the day. Yes I am aware that Real need to service their debt and they are doing that. But they don't see that as a threat to their business model or going concern, do they? I mean why are the debt ridden clubs like Real, United and Barca making the biggest splashes in the transfermarket? Why does Bayern, who are swimming in cash not splurging 50M on players? Don't tell me they don't need to. They have a coach with rather expensive tastes.
     
  19. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    PSG said the same thing. I don't hold out any false hopes that FFP will be all that stringent, but on bankruptcy and corrupt loan practices they do have some very tough rules.

    They didn't LAST TIME either. They may never see it as a problem, but that does not take away from the fact that if they end up back there again there are fewer and fewer lenders willing to give them money for nothing. And if they did UEFA would be all over them.

    Wow, if you have to ask that question you do not understand the Bundesliga and Bayern's player management or financial management practices. Not trying to sound pedantic, but it is very well known that Bayern will NEVER splash cash for ANY player they don't think is worth it. That's exactly why they have the cash they do.

    As for those other clubs, you will notice they have had increasingly difficult times getting low-cost loans to finance their spending over the last four years....and that will only get tougher as the return on footballing investments in not as great as with regular companies. As soon as the economy starts to recover the marginal amounts of venture capital will go to those companies giving a higher rate of return....not to football clubs.
     
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  20. Zarastro

    Zarastro Member

    Mar 30, 2012
    Germany
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I really hope the German NT wins today. Not because I am a big fan of the German NT which I am not. But because of Hummels. He deserves every trophy he can win.
     
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  21. Nermin Kolašinac

    Jun 5, 2013
    Lahmfan's crib
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Bosnia-Herzegovina
    Why does espeacially Hummels deserve every thophy?
     
  22. MatthausSammer

    MatthausSammer Moderator
    Staff Member

    Dec 9, 2012
    Canada
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Why is Kolasinac so great in the eyes of your Bosnian compatriots? Because he chose a lesser team when he could've easily played for a better one with more prestige, and absolutely no one would've blamed him.
     
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  23. Nermin Kolašinac

    Jun 5, 2013
    Lahmfan's crib
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Bosnia-Herzegovina
    That's one very, very weird comparision, sir.

    Kolasinac doesen't deserve any titler more than for example Spahic just because he chose to play for Bosnia and not Germany. I just found it weird why Hummels deserve the title the trophy more than others but I assume that's becasue he's still playing in Dortmund or am I wrong?
     
  24. Spanky144

    Spanky144 Member

    Jun 30, 2014
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Lol as a Hummels fan thats hilarious. Germany deserves the title because theyve made semis the past 8 consecutive times?

    Hummels had nothing to do with it.
    At this point Germany as a nation and their footy federation deserves every title they can get.
     
    Boandlkramer repped this.
  25. bvbSlash

    bvbSlash Member+

    Jan 7, 2014
    Berlin
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    I am fully behind Argentina in this finals as I was throughout the tournament. If they win, he deserves it. I simply don't want anybody else in that squad who plays for Bayern lifting that title.
     

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