Need some opinions on why some youth coaches spend their time teaching kick and run only to have the girls they are coaching drop out of soccer when they get to be around 16 years old because they can't play against the girls who were coached to pass and play together from a young age. When you speak to the coaches they say that they are all about development. Really? I would think even if you don't have the most talented girls you would try get them better by coaching them on the things that are going to keep them in the game.
Simply put, some coaches don't know any better. Others simply care about winning and haven't experienced the brick wall that is the older age groups when trying to use a kick and run strategy. They think that if they had better, more athletic players it will work. In reality in some area it works very, very well. Bottom line, not all coaches practice what they preach. Development is the current catch phrase that some coaches use to lure in parents who don't know any better and can't tell the different between actual development and success on the field. Not that they are mutually exclusive, far from it, but at early ages when you're trying to retain players, many parents will look at game results as a large deciding factor on whether to stay with a team or not and some coaches will do "whatever it takes" to make sure they win. Sad but sometime true.
Would you guys consider this as kick and round? Pass long into space instead right to a waiting player. Use up top player movement, and movement from the flank player to an up top inside the field position. Pass long from the back to the far side mid on the far side up top space. Instead of near the keeper. So your pass possession would be in your favor instead of the opponents defense favor. Play back to your support players after a long pass. You don't always have to try and beat the opponents backs over the top. Try to hit the second, and the third diagonal run instead of the first diagonal run. Most passes off diagonal runs are to the first option. Not the trigered 2nd or third option options after that. The back support player of the dribbler is the guy who should get the ball first in order to hit that third triggered option not the dribbler. In every long direct pass you need 2 back options not one. Also those two back options should be further back then the back option would be in a possession game. Do all that with practice direct would be a more possession game
Sounds familiar. Our U10 Coach talked development and actually did focus on basic skills in practice, but as soon as they would get to the games, he would be shouting at the midfielders to stop dribbling and boot up to the striker, or just boot it up period. The starting center midfielder never two-touched the ball -- she would reach out pop it once every time it came to her, never saw her dribble it even a couple of yards. Didn't seem to matter where it went, just as long as she was pushing it forward, he was happy. Very confusing for the girls to hear one thing in practice and something else in the games. I heard several girls say they didn't understand what they were supposed to be doing. It was the pressure to win games, which comes primarily from the parents. The club stated that the focus was to be on development, but the club also wants happy parents, so the coach is in a Catch-22. Its the "now" vs. the future. The coach who coaches U10 won't be working with these girls any longer when they are U16 and hit the brick wall. They will be someone else's problem...
Why is this all on the coaches and parents and not on the players? We're coaching kids who never watch the danged game. We can run all the drills we want to teach them how to dribble and play the beautiful game, and many of them still aren't going to get it. I've practically told my U8s to quit playing defense. They still rush back and clump around at the back. The coaches and parents aren't putting any pressure on them -- quite the opposite -- and they put the pressure on themselves. They're kids. They don't always do what you want.
Because the parents pressure the coaches to win, and so the coaches reward kids who run a lot with playing time and yell at any kid who risks losing possession by trying to make a tough pass or holds the ball too long. The age you're talking about? U-8 kids aren't going to get tactics, IMHO, even if they watch soccer; which, honestly, few of them do. In their minds, the game is wherever the ball is, and they want to play the game. That said--although I've certainly watched plenty of U8 soccer I've never coached it so you likely have some insights I don't.
(Most) Kids over time will try to do what they've been taught, either by their parents or their coach. I can excuse younger kids for playing kick ball, bunch ball, lots of different styles that don't really look like the modern game, because they don't know any better (yet!). What I find very sad is when I get a player who is U14, who has been playing since they were U5 and the only tactic they know defensively is to clear the ball, playing to the keeper is never an option, and god forbid the ball ever goes any other direction other than forward. The player can't dribble properly, let alone get their head up, and doesn't understand how to make a run other than straight ahead. This happens way too often in many rec programs. The kids deserve better.
Well said. They do deserve better, especially in the older age groups. Thanks for all the answers. Parents must always seek out the right environment for their player to grow in but unfortunately many really don't know what to look for.
All those years of U-Little matches are meaningless. I don't have a problem with kids coming into U14 and not knowing team tactics. U14 is where they are supposed to learn team tactics. I do agree that U14 players lacking fundamental skills is a problem. But developing fundamental skills requires a little coaching and a lot of practice, just like learning a musical instrument. All the lessons in the world won't help if players don't practice. And most players don't practice. Feels better to blame the coaches when the players don't practice. Don't get me wrong. I don't blame kids for not practicing. If they really wanted to learn to play, they would practice. This issue is really about family values and lifestyle choices. Not the coach'es business.
Amen. I saw a really good team this fall, and I have no idea how much it reflects on the coach. You could just tell from watching them play that they GET soccer. They watch it. They play and practice on their own. The other coaches can do all they want, but they won't catch up with that team unless their players do the same.
If a team is told to play kick and run, then they will do it and the individual players will never learn to play any other way. It's as simple as that. I'm currently coaching a number of teams, but one of them is a U6 team playing walled indoor on a field that's about 30x20 yards. We play 5v5 with no keepers. Except all of the other teams in the league station one player to stand in front of their goal all game long, one player to stand in front of my goal all game long, and they tell all their players to kick it as hard as they can down the field every time they get it. Kickoffs are indirect, but the other coaches still simply instruct their players to shoot on goal at every kick off. They know that the kids aren't savvy enough to get out of the way and let the ball roll into the net. Instead, the ball either defelcts off one of my players and into the goal, or it ends up in a dangerous spot for their on-rushing players to knock it into the goal. In contrast, my team does not play with kids stationed in any particular spot. They all just run all over the field trying to get the ball. I don't ask a player to hang back and defend. I don't ask a player to poach and wait for the ball to spring loose in front of the goal. We play a short pass on every kick off. Players are told to attempt to dribble into space everytime they get the ball. Guess what? We have zero wins, one tie and four losses. We've scored 48 goals compared to 125 for our opponents. But my team is learning how to play the game correctly. The other teams are learning absolutely nothing other than the notion that kicking and running works. Of course it stops working at about U12, but they don't know that and don't care. Their coaches and parents laugh and celebrate all game long as they score rubbish goal after rubbish goal. My team wins the ball, dribbles to goal and gets clobbered by their handless goalkeeper who just boots it up field to their poacher who kicks it in the net. This happens all game long, but I refuse to change tactics because the way the other teams play is crap. The way they play doesn't resemble anything that happens in a "real soccer game." So why bother playing that way? Crazy thing is that some of the other coaches are legit soccer players. One coach played D1 college soccer. He screams at his players all game long "kick it and run after it!!!!" Then he does a little dance everytime they score, even when it's like 30-5 in his favor. Why does he do this? He does it because he likes to win. He does it because the team parents high five him. He does it because he thinks it's ALL about him and his ego. He has never stopped to think what he's teaching the kids or how their style of play will translate to a larger field. This is not an isolated problem. Kick and run works at the U5-U9 level if your goal is to win games, which is the goal of most coaches. It even works to some degree at the U10-U11 level, though at that point it can be pretty soundly defeated by a good team playing the right way. But big punts over the back line still work pretty well. Big clearances over the back line still work pretty well. When I say "works" I mean "works to win games". It doesn't work to create better soccer players.
I don't think that I would call any tactic in 5v5 soccer kick and run, but I agree with your underlying point. Kids at U6 need to learn to play a dribbling game before they learn to play a passing game. It is a safe assumption that the kids on the "kick and run" teams haven't mastered dribbling yet (or they would be playing U8) and are still going to need to learn dribbling when your kids are ready to start to learn a passing game 2-3 years down the road. Unfortunately many will not even then. When I play adult 5v5 we pretty much play like your kick and run teams, because there is no offsides rule. Everyone plays someone up high, and everyone keeps someone back to guard against a quick counter. Works for adult soccer, but doesn't work well for developing U6 players. The former D1 player is coaching U6's like adults. That is unfortunately a common mistake.
Not sure how you would define "kick and run," but what's happening in my U6 league constitutes kick and run under any conceivable definition. As soon as any player gets the ball, they hoof it upfield aimlessly. They're not shooting on goal and they are not pasing. They're simply kicking the ball as hard as they can and then running after it. If that's not "kick and run," then nothing is. The clearest example is the kick offs, where they simply run up and kick the ball forward and then all charge after it. No, he's not coaching them like adults. Adults would not blast the ball at the goal on a kick off. Adults would dribble, pass and shoot. They wouldn't kick the ball forward and then run after it. Unless you are saying that he's coaching them like adults who have no idea how to play soccer. Then I guess I agree, but I'm not sure why it's useful to use the word "adult."
The whole idea of SSGs is too change the youth game so that space and sides are reduced so you don't have a bunch of players wasting their time kicking long and chasing the ball around a large field. From what you said about the other teams, the teams' maintain a lot of depth all the time with only 3 players closing down the ball. Because of the depth, they are not kicking past their forward. You say they aren't passing the ball to the forward when they kick it forward. You call it what you want, and I will do the same. As for adults not blasting the ball at the goal on a kick off in 5v5, my experience is that even in 11v11 if the adult thinks no one is paying attention they will take a crack at it. I don't remember any goals scored on a kickoff, but I do remember a 40+ and 50+ yard goal scored during run of play.
I say that they are not passing the ball to the "forward" because they clearly are not doing it. I'm watching it with my eye balls. They blast it up field without any regard for where the "forward" is. They don't even know that he's there. They never look. They see the ball, they kick the ball. It's not a pass. It's a clearance. There's a massive difference between those two things. The "handless goal keeper" runs out and kicks the ball as if he/she is playing kick ball. It's a clearance, not a pass. 9 times out of 10 these clearances don't reach the "forward." They simply advance the ball up field some and then they charge the ball and do it again. The poacher in front of goal really doesn't do much of anything. He'll kick the ball in if it doesn't have enough power to make it in without his help or if it hits the wall instead of the target. But mostly he just stands there and does nothing. Actually, my team benefits from the use of the poacher by other teams. It's the handless goal keeper that really ruins the game. We are playing in a no-goalkeeper format, so why anyone thinks it's OK to have a kid stand on the goal line and kick the ball away everytime it comes to them is baffling to me. Why do you think the league plays in a no-goalkeeper format in the first place? It's because it's incredibly hard for a 4-5 year old to score on a goalkeeper, even in a 1v1. They lack the close control dribbling skills, partciularly on turf. The ball gets away from them a bit and the handless goalkeeper boots it clear. When other teams disposses my team, and get clear of the last defender, they just dribble the ball into the goal. I'm cool with that. There are supposed to be lots of goals. If they are shooting directly off a kick off, they are mental. A kick off is indirect, so even if it goes in, it doesn't count. The odds of getting a deflection off of a shot like that are zero unless the goalkeeper is equally mental and doesn't understand the rules. I've seen a few goals off of PASSES from the kick off. A kid on my high school team did it in the state champtionship game. The opportunity usually arises right after a goal when the other team is celebrating and not paying attention. That's NOT what's happening in my U6 games. What's going on in my U6 games is absolute crap. Kid stands about 5 yards back from the ball on the kick off and runs up and blasts it at the goal. My kids don't really know what to do with that. The ball often comes screaming at their stomachs. A couple times my kids have been flat taken out by these absurd kick offs. It's a total bastarization of the game. Why are you defending it?
Well, I'll be damned. Still crap soccer though. And it's definitely indirect in our indoor league because all restarts are indirect according to those rules.
My daughters club suffers the opposite problem. She is a U14 and for the last two years all they really practice is possession. Small sided games of keep away in various forms. There is no emphasis on using possession in order to score goals. Just possession for possessions sake. Boy these girls can stand in a circle and play keep away from two girls in the middle. They can play keep away 8 v 8 in a little box of cones. They can pass the ball from the midfielders to the defenders to the goalie and back to the defenders and midfielders during games. The only thing they can't do is turn that possession into scoring chances. The other teams have figured this out and pressure like crazy on the defensive third of the field. Wouldn't i love to see just once a nice ball over the top of those defenders playing at the half line. A through ball. Something. Nope that's kick ball, not allowed. If the team with the most possession was awarded the win my kids team would be undefeated. How bout practicing on a full field with all 11 girls in their normal positions. No that would be crazy. Small sided games are the only thing allowed. Not sure how the girls are suppose to know what to do on a full field. They sure do like to get real close together and try to pass the ball under pressure in games. Its almost like they take what they practice nonstop and do that in games. (sarcasm) The defenders on the other team really appreciate only have to defend small areas of the field. So playing kickball as a rule is bad I agree. Having the ability to play a ball long sure would help relieve some of that pressure from the other team now and then.
If you can't play 4 v 4 correctly you'll never be able to play 11 v 11 correctly....this, and the fact a player gets way more touches in small sided games, means the coach is on the right track. Playing 'through the lines' (from the back to m/f and on to the forward players) is the way to go and the way to keep playing the game....the key is to keep possession until you can get the ball to a midfield player who is facing forward...and is thus able to play a penetrating through ball...
Have to do both, but concentrating on possession and reforming the team's structure is more important than focusing on having to kick and run. Also getting corners and free kicks near the opposing goalie is important, because it messes the other team up mentally. I wonder if the reason defenders seem to have trouble with discipline is due to too much small-sided play, where your mistakes aren't fatal and you can fix them due to the sheer closeness of the field. IMHO, full-sided is the only real soccer, and it is extremely tiring to players and/or forces turnovers if you try to keep possession for too long.
4v4 is not a minature 11v11 game. 4v4 is a good tactical practice for midfield play. You can use a box, diamond, line, T or inverted T shapes, just like the 4-man midfield possibilities. Because there are no keepers and no offsides rule, it doesn't help much with finishing. Because the space is usually relatively small as well as the goals, it doesn't really help teach team defensive tactics either. Like rhrh pointed out, defending in SSGs is comparatively easy because of the small space. But for novices, we use 4v4 as technical training. Not just attacking skills. SSGs are good for teaching man-marking and tackling, if the coach makes than play man-to-man rather than zone defense. For intermediate players, we use 4v4 for a combination of tactical, technical and fitness training. You generally need to add more space, big goals, keepers, and nuetral players when you want to work on finishing and make defense more challenging.
Totally disagree with the above two posts. When playing 4 v 4 if a defensive mistake is made it quickly becomes 4 v 3 and invariably a goal is scored. It is much easier to correct defensive positional mistakes in small sided games....due to the closeness of the players to the coach.....4 v 4 is much more important than 11 v 11 in training...especially for younger players.
I am fortunate enough to live on the property line of a major youth soccer complex here in Raleigh NC. They have several tournamets a year. I get to watch ECNL, Classic, Challenge, and Rec tournaments. For girls, there is a huge difference between Classic and Rec. For the boys, there may be a solid player in Rec that could play in the Classic level. I watched a U18 boys rec team play this weekend. There were a few that could play Challenge and possibly Classic. Much of the ability to do so may be financial reason. It is not cheap. An entire year of Classic comes down to $200 per month not including tournaments. On the girls side, the difference is insane though. My daughter and I watched a U13 girls rec Final on Sunday. There was never a dribble, never a pass, no aggression to go after a ball. It was just a kickball game. Girl 1 kicks it with her toe as hard as she can, the next girl waits for it to come to her, then she kicks it as hard as she can with her toe. The result was which ever team got 4 consecutive kicks on the ball had a chance to score. They were slow, never went after a ball, waited for a ball to come to their feet, would not touch it if they had to move 2 feet to get to it. To answer the original post, kick and run has its place. It is for players that are not competitive, do not care about building a huge repertoire of skill, and just out to play. They will never play after the Rec age level is exceeded. So, let them have fun at their level.