So......... Who do you think is the best to ever do it between these 2??? lol Who's the better player??? During the euros, i knew some people who argued that Pirlo had "always" been better than Xavi, so what's your opinion on that??? IMO, Pirlo's game is even more comparable to Xabi Alonso's game than to Xavi's, but since Alonso's name is almost never in the discussion, i decided that the thread should have Xavi & Pirlo as it's primary focus. But the way i see it, it's Xavi>>Pirlo>=Alonso What about you???
Mods, pls is it possible to move this thread to the "BigSoccer Polls" forum??? i think it will be better over there...
To start with (the bold) your view of Pirlo was already DISTORTED ==> so wrongly judged! Pirlo was always a "deep lying playmaker" in Milan 4 4 2 diamond formation and Gatuuso was more of a Xabi in term of defense and some holding! Pirlo bossed the midfield and provide some playmaking from deep position. NOTE that was from 2004-09 and he did the same with Juve now. Xavi in the otehr hands STARTS out as a center MF (box to box) and just became "playmaker" from 2007 onward ... (thanks to the release of Ronaldinho) . ================================================= Now , who is better? is always a hard question (unless it's obvious like Maradona/Socrates vs Xavi/Pirlo ...) It's a very close call between Xavi and Pirlo. (depending on your taste and team Squad, formation, tactics ...) IMO, Pirlo provides a better PASSING RANGES than Xavi could have (long, short, crossing, thruballs) but Xavi got a bit better in short passing (in number and %) and especially thruballs. Pirlos is also better than Xavi in defesive skills like tackling, re-possession ... I prefer Pirlo since he could play virtually for ANY teams (attacking to defensive styles) Xavi could (only) excel (more so than Pirlo) in an ATTACKING team or with a team who got a solid DM (to cover Xavi's back) !
agreed. The most important factor is they are both so good in their role. Any half decent team with a decent support cast will benefit from these two "playmakers", and vice versa. The thing about these players is that if the team is not capable, then they can't really function 100% of their potential.
And the same goes for Xabi Alonso Xavi happens to have only played for Barca so we can't tell how he would have faired on another team or system, and Pirlo never changed his style of play for every club he has played for (which has worked successfully well for him) so i can also "assume" that Xavi with his style of play and intelligence would have faired well in any other team or system. As Pirlo being a better defender, i don't see how you come up with that also. Pirlo just like Xavi & Alonso & even Modric in tottenham has always played along side a more defensive player (sometimes 2 in the case of Alonso and Pirlo) who does more of the dirty work.
Xabi was always a DM and a box midfielder. Again, only in later stage of his career he showed good glimse of good passes (with vision) Pirlo was proven well at Milan, Juve and at NT in WC06 and in last Euro12 as different teams. Xavi was very good with the BArca core and also played well with the same Spanish NT team mates since 08. You HOPE he will adapt well in another team ... and ... yes ASK Messi (in Argentina), and ask Torres (in Chelsea) if they agree to that!!!
That's your "opinion" which many don't seem to share (regarding Alonso's vision for good passes). And no Alonso has never been a pure DM, he has always played along side another true DM player. And are you saying that Alonso hasn't been tried and tested in liverpool, Madrid and Spanish NT??? Why will i "hope"??? every knows about Xavi's intelligence in reading the game, we could only guess and assume that he would have faired well in another team. But i guess we'll never know... Torres was already bad 2 years before going to Chelsea, his decline didn't start in Chelsea. Messi doesn't plays a different role in Argentina. And even with that, he still plays the same way for them that he plays for barca (his dribbles, his runs,his passes,etc...) but offcourse he doesn't score as much (or wasn't scoring as much since that seems to be changing now) which had a lot to do with his role in the team imo.
All I was sying is that Xabi is a very good center MF - half way between Keane and Vieira. He NEVER was a playmaker in ANY team period HOPE- in the sense that we won't able to see Xavi playing for another team (in his best form) Last bold= THANKS that you have confirmed my points - ADAPTING to new team- meaning when a great player playing for new team, he should NOT expect to play the same role, and get the same services he has at club or other team! Messi only played less than 10games as a true center playmaker under Maradona time. The rest (of 50games) he played vastly as wide forward (his original role) and sometimes as 2nd forward. Lately he was tested (successfully) in a "false 9" role with Argentina. Torres was a DISASTER in Chelsea ... making him look like a "FLOP" a la Sheva in 2007 , especially with such a pricetag! His excuse was: "i am no Drogba" to excel in such role ... LOL. So that's ALSO confirmed he FAILED to ADAPT
Xabi has always been a deep lying playmaker, i don't even see why you're trying to say the opposite when almost everyone agrees he is. Ok When a great player is playing for a new team, he shouldn't except to play the same role which is true to an extent... but Pirlo has always played the same role for every club he has played for and even NT (the same goes for Alonso by the way), atleast Xavi plays a slightly different role for Spain than he does for Barca. As for Messi, "he only played less than 10 games as a true center playmaker"??? are you serious??? That has been his role in the team since 2010. I never said Torres wasn't a flop, i said his decline started way before going to Chelsea, 2 years before. So the failed to adapt thing doesn't work with me because he was already on the decline while in Liverpool before going to Chelsea.
Put it this way ... Xabi was "hired" to play as MF - NOT as Playmaker (deep or advance no matter what) eventhough he got somewhat vision to do so. Pirlo was famous in that position, so every team would (did) use him as such! No question asked! Xavi in the other hand (of Xabi Alonso) was a better and more versatile player. In Spain he did play some games in higher position more advance (especially Euro08 with both Xabi and Senna as DM)Most often he played as CM (or Right MF) in 4 3 3 formation. Right after WC10 failure, and with a new coach, Messi was playing as FORWARD since (go back and watch again the formation (copa11 for example) In last few friendlies 2012, Messi was back to his favorite FALSE 9 and shone bright there with many goals scored! (example ... Argentina vs Portugal: Batista Picks 4-3-3 Formation To Play Portugal Angela Asante, February 9 2011, 1 Comment Argentina’s squad for the Portugal friendly match is not the strongest. Sergio Batista’s men will play a 4-3-3 formation with Lionel Messi playing as a number 9 to break down Cristiano Ronaldo’s Portugal. I would not call Torres "declined" - but he was "caught" in weak adaptation and then CONFUSED ... between Spain NT and new style in EPL = That's ALL. He was still a very good forward when in form (rarely lately and unfortunately)
I used to say Xavi, but after the last Euro, I'll now give a slight edge to Pirlo. His dominance of England was epic.
As was Xavi's dominance in the final against Italy. And Xavi's been more dominant in past world cup and euros too, as well as for his club.
You're joking right? The fact that you said the Euro 2012 was what made you decide that Pirlo was the better player contradicts this post too.
No it doesn't. I rated Xavi slightly above, despite Pirlo's WC06 performance, taking into account their NT and club careers. After the recent Euro, I have to favor Pirlo for his overall play during the tournamentj, although Xavi played a great final match after a string of average performances the whole tournament.
I have exactly the same feeling ... even we don;t discuss (in details) of the QUALITY of their team mates that ignites their task easier (like Spain squad >> Italy squad at least in names)
Offcourse i, like most people i believe, think that Pirlo had a better euro 2012 than Xavi (except for the finals obviously and the 2nd half of their 1st match where Xaviesta dominated). But judging their careers, Xavi's the better player for me. I understand that you might prefer Pirlo though.
Xavi mother********errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrs That horseface Queerlo doesnt deserve to be in this Poll
I voted for Pirlo. Xavi will probably be rated higher in most all-time lists but he plays for the greatest Barca team ever and the greatest Spanish NT side of all-time. He has had a vital part in that success and he was arguably the best player in the Euro 2008 and WC 2010 wins. In terms of playing style, Xavi is more simple and effective than Pirlo. He can play long passes but he seldom does it. Aside from bias, I voted for Pirlo because I think that he has more technique and vision. He can do back-heels, short passes, long passes, lobbed passes and he takes great corner kicks. He doesn't dribble a lot but when he does, he's very good. He can twist and turn or just walk past defenders. His lack of pace has usually counted against him but he has always used his technique to compensate for that. His Milan career might be the thing that really counts against because he wasn't always consistent and needed Gattuso to "carry the water". For Juve, he has been a much more mobile player, even in his 30s. His contribution will likely be the main reason for rating him on all-time lists. He was the most important offensive player for Italy at WC 2006 and Euro 2012. Even at Euro 2008 and WC 2010, anything good Italy did was because of Pirlo. At Euro 2008, he played a top game against France and in the quarter-final, Italy looked lost without Pirlo. At WC 2010, Pirlo wasn't fit but he came on against Slovakia and Italy had a chance to get a point. Before he came on, Italy couldn't put one pass together!
Even though I said I prefer Pirlo style, but if I have to rank them over whole career, Xavi would be higher than Pirlo for his longevity and success at clubs and NT. hereis an example of XaBi in Liverpool shirt: he was clearly a DM there...
I'll put it like this, Pirlo has had a longer run in terms of form and playing in high level, but Xavi at his peak was greater than Pirlo ever was IMO. And i don't know about Pirlo versatility when he's basically played the same role for most of his career...