Game 8: Caps Vs Crew

Discussion in 'Vancouver Whitecaps' started by ixadvent, Apr 29, 2012.

  1. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    So alright guys,

    I was so glad that we scraped out a win tonight cause god tonight's game by far is our worst in possession so far!

    The quality of our defense and a little bit of luck had saved us a clean sheet tonight with a BIG away 3 points for our playoff spot hunt this year. The way Demerit battles for the ball defensive must be one of the best in the league. While Bonjour and Davidson gets in the timely challenges and clearance, every time Lee Young Pyo gets in possession, Crew players cannot shake the ball off him nor they don't know how to defend against our right back (lol). Most important of all his consistency and game attitude had paid off with a wonderful free kick that went in favor for the caps.

    But wow we have so much problem in the middle of the park, watson and koffie isn't the type of players that are technically good with the ball. Hence we do not keep the ball in good possession as it was with Davide.

    Hassli was just woeful with his opportunities, just like the pundits say on the radio, he turned into the arms flailing attitude within 15min of the game and isn't helping the situation out at all.

    So what r your thoughts guys?
     
  2. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

    Feb 1, 2008
    My first thought is that this is the kind of game that does a disservice to the league. There has been talk about how this time of year is a great opportunity for the Whitecaps, with the Canucks out early, but games like this will not entice potential Whitecaps fans, or people casually interested in seeing what the MLS is about. I think we can establish at this point that Rennie is a good coach, but he can certainly employ some tactics that lead to near-unwatchable soccer.

    It was a smash and grab for the Whitecaps. They say good teams find a way to win, but really I think there's still a lot of progress to be made still. Having Rochat back (he may play against Edmonton on Wednesday) will help. Harvey is a good substitute/backup, but he's a clear drop-off from Rochat. Despite the scrambling play and the near goals, I thought the rest of the backline played well. Lee, again, was fantastic. I'm not that well-versed with the rest of the MLS to make it a conclusive statement, but I feel that Rochat and Lee is the best fullback combo in this league.

    Our midfield is still the biggest issue. Davidson was fine as a DM, but Watson is just not an MLS-level midfielder, and I think Koffie would be more effective in the DM role. I'm afraid though that people are putting too much faith in Robson when he does arrive here. He'll be a great addition, but I don't know if he can singlehandedly solve the current deficiencies. But one thing that he may solve is the transition to the offence.

    I'm getting concerned about Hassli. This was easily his poorest game this season. In previous games, he's at least created some offence with his teammates and has taken some shots on goal, but in this game he's done neither of those. I don't think he was mad at Rennie for getting subbed off, but rather mad at himself for his performance. To be fair, it's not easy for him to contribute when the quality of our midfield is poor, and maybe he'll find it easier to score goals when Robson joins. I think that he should play both Edmonton games and sit the San Jose game - hopefully against a weaker opponent he'll pot in 1 or 2 and regain his confidence. In regards to the rest of the offence, Salgado and Le Toux were ok, but not great. I wanted to scream at the television on counterattacks when either of these two had the ball in the box, and neither chose to shoot it to try something complicated instead. In a game like this, you have to keep it simple and try your chance on goal.
     
  3. PG Tips

    PG Tips Member

    Oct 5, 2008
    Vancouver
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    Great result obviously but a dreadful game to watch from an entertainment angle. I had recorded it and then scanned through parts of the match and even paused to make dinner.

    Super goal from YPL although unintentional. I'd be curious to know if they will put that up for one of the plays of the week at MLS.com. Davidson looked

    Harvey is crap. Maybe he should actually look to see if he can make a pass to a teammate going forward and have the brains to decide if that pass will make it. If not, hold the ball. Something which the Caps did horribly at last night.

    I can understand the frustration from Hassli as he wants to score and his actions when getting subbed show it. I was like that when I used to play. Some of it out of his hands of course with our deficient midfield, especially the left side.
     
  4. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    Man you are definitely spot on. Rennie does try to do what ever it takes to win and thats understandable. But some decision is just horrendous to kill the game off when there r still chances for us. Subbing Thorrington on to the pitch to kill the game off is the best way to see it last night. And what happen to Nanchoff? Perhaps if Nanchoff coming on for Salgado would make much more sense, but the way thorrington plays is to disrupt the flow of the game in BOTH direction.

    Koffie has great potential but at the moment he is still learning a more advanced role compare to the DM where he is most comfortable at which i don't mind. But Watson was almost non-existent and I dont like how he plays at all. He is litterally physical and with NO skill at all, he goes into a player to win balls and hopefully it goes his way. But after that he doesn't know what to do and loses the ball again. Lol.

    Lastly Harvey is complete shit playing in the LB position right now. Every team we've played against kept exploiting his side cus he is incompetent in his role. He drifts away from his position and most of the time Demerit shifts to the left to fill in while davidson and bonjour in the middle. Its almost as if he pushed to the left wing position where become useless. Poor passing and poor possession. Just cannot wait for Rochat to come back.
     
  5. canuck51

    canuck51 Member

    Jan 15, 2007
    Vancouver
    I think that's one of the reason's Hassli's struggling/getting frustrated. He's just not getting any support behind him. I love Koffie and agree he's got so much potential but he's much more defensive minded at the moment. As for Watson, you pretty much summed him up. He's a hard worker, but let's just say I can't wait for Robson to come and see what he can do in that spot.

    No one's really mentioned Le Toux yet... I thought he was pretty invisible yesterday.

    Lee was easily MOTM even before his goal.
     
  6. sportie1

    sportie1 Member

    Sep 4, 2008
    i think there is so much more to hassli's increasingly poor performances-- quality players- of which hassli is supposed to be and he does make the top salary-- always find their way to make an impact; for people to blame the mf, while partly true, does not account for mr eric's disasterous play-- good players rise above and lead by example and hassli is incapable of doing that... he's not willing to pay the price, especially inside the box

    what's interesting to me is that he and chiumiento are best friends off the field and davide has tanked and is riding the pine-- something else is going on with the 2 of them and its all or a lot to do with off-the-field adventures IMO

    it wouldn't surprise me to see this all coming to a head in the near future-- rennie does not strike me as a coach that will let this continue... we all know how the jarju crap was finally handled
     
  7. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    The situation is that Rennie is employing a really defensive strategy to "solidify" our defense with all players defending in the box while we hope for a lucky ball to be lobbed behind opponent defense and sad thing is Le Toux is pretty much the only player with pace to break through for us. Its the type of un-watchable soccer that nobody likes. Even as a caps fan to me thats unacceptable.

    The formation and positioning of our players when the opponent have possession is practically everyone in the penalty area defending. Everytime we boot a ball out of the area, it lands to the opposition because we have no midfielders to battle for the ball. So therefore the opponent basically wait for us to boot the ball to them and they can gather their attack again as this will repeat itself over and over and over throughout the game.

    This hurts the attacking talent we have in the squad. Specially Davide because he is easily one of the best attacking midfielder in the league. But his spot is being taken by Watson and Thorrington who doesn't keep possession well but TRIES to work hard to get in tackles (wasn't effective at all). LeToux is being dropped back too deep to make any offensive impact and thats why he was invincible the whole game.

    Hassli as actually been helpful for clearly several corners against the crew. however that contribution does not benefit Eric as a forward as he is missing out chances to attack. Then again he was very wasteful with possession last night.
     
  8. FlashMan

    FlashMan Member

    Jan 6, 2000
    'diego
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    First off, I only saw about 35-40 minutes of the game, but I did bring some luck as I was watching when Lee's goal semi-miraculously flew into the goal.

    Second, I've been one to defend Hassli's performance in the past. He's been a solid link up player so far this year, has worked his tail off, and taken some decent shots that just didn't get him a goal. That game, however, from what I saw, he was terrible. Poor first touches, poor second touches, bad passes, bad reads....the works. Just an out and out bad game. My only defense - as has been noted previously - is he was getting almost zero help. Le Toux in particular makes awkward runs and also has a terrible touch - the two don't work well together for the most part (except for the San Jose game where they were excellent). Salgado wasn't bad, from what I saw, but disappeared for long stretches.

    It's pretty amazing the boys could play such an overall poor game and come away with 3 points. If I was a member of the Crew or one of their fans, I'd be perplexed, pissed, frustrated, angry, in despair. The Soccer Gods weren't on their side on Saturday, and most definitely on the Whitecaps'. They probably have some karma coming though. Last year the Whitecaps were terrible, but got almost zero breaks during the course of the season. Bounces never seemed to go their way. So they will take it, and why not.

    Rennie has to fix the offense, however. I don't have the answers, but they're not going to get lucky every week.
     
  9. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    Seems to me that they don't practice offense at all during training. They do seem to solidify the defensive performance, but like flashman said, Letoux's run and touch was completely off and the two frenchmen were not in sync at all.

    And all our possession play in transition to attack was too one dimensional, which led to the opponent closing our players down much too easily. The only exception was when Lee was comfortably breaking through the right flank. Other than him i don't see anyone else breaking through. Though Omar did it like once last night. Hope to see more from the lad.
     
  10. TheCopperSheik

    May 18, 2011
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    All you Hassli apologists are fools.. The guy is a lazy bum.
     
  11. FlashMan

    FlashMan Member

    Jan 6, 2000
    'diego
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think Hassli's been playing lazy at all, just the opposite.

    He did get frustrated on Saturday though, but all the offensive players looked discouraged midway through that game.

    One should note that Hassli earned the foul that led to the free kick which led to the goal, so he that going for him in the plus column on the day.
     
  12. *Injektilo

    *Injektilo Member

    Feb 1, 2008
    Quick, who said this?

    "I think he did excellent on Saturday. He was playing up there on his own. He worked really hard and kept the ball for us, was a focus point and between him and Atiba they got the job done."
     
  13. sportie1

    sportie1 Member

    Sep 4, 2008
    hassli's MAIN function should be inside the 18 yard box... and this is where i take exception to him-- he is TOTALLY ineffective for a big man inside the box-- no header goals in 2 seasons tells you all that you need to know about his lack of conviction and courage inside the box

    for whatever reason, hassli is reluctant/hesitant to go into the box with drive and verve-- hence no goals in 17 games and counting

    he was signed to score goals, not only to be a target man well outside the box- there are a lot of players in the world that would play for much less money for being just a target man outside the box-- there is something wrong and i can only guess what it is- i might be wrong as to the reason, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know something bigger than bad luck and weak mf play is happening

    coach rennie knows what it is and he, of course, is trying to keep the heat off of mr eric-- good coaches cover for their players-- its time for eric to step up to the plate and dedicate himself to the Caps and to his soccer career... or i think he will be gone b4 the end of the season along with davide, his best friend

    at this point of the season, Copper Sheik has it right
     
  14. TheCopperSheik

    May 18, 2011
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Glad we finally agree. Eric has a rep for the nightlife and the ladies; not sure if this is connected to his disinterest in doing what he is paid to do. I can only speculate.
     
  15. dehun

    dehun Member

    Oct 19, 2011
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Evidence, Sheik?
     
  16. JohnnyRanger

    JohnnyRanger Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jul 30, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Scotland
    There is no evidence of this, to say as much is akin to libel and slander.

    You could say "I wonder if Eric has an interest in the nightlife and ladies and this was affecting his play, as it clearly isn't now.
     
  17. TheCopperSheik

    May 18, 2011
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Well, he certainly is scoring so things are all good for ERic now.
     
  18. sportie1

    sportie1 Member

    Sep 4, 2008
    wont last-- eric is not a consistent type of player and he has huge mood swings, even during the game-- not the type of striker i would want on my team-- good luck to rennie and all his psychological bending he will continue to try on mr. eric-- hope i am wrong and he ends up with 15 or more goals
     
  19. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    Kinda worry for the big guy there, he was interviewed by tyler green (i think) after today's training and expressing the frustration with other defenders and refs in the league. To a point where he needs to see a sports psychologist, things are not looking bright.

    Though I''m glad that he managed to score 3 goals separately in the last 4 games, which also means that his teammates are making plays to pick out Eric to score. That's the only positive we can take out of the situation ATM.

    If other teams tactic to disturb Eric by harassing him, its better for him to come off as a substitute late in game. As it was in the San Jose game, tire out the defenders first, then sub Eric on to make an impact during the last 10-20 min. Like Rennie had said, its a "luxury" for the team to be able to have Hassli coming off the bench. So imo if Hassli is fine with being a sub, then we may be able to see him score more goals compare to him starting for us.
     
  20. JohnnyRanger

    JohnnyRanger Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jul 30, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Scotland
    Hassli's struggles haven't been his own doing imho.

    He has, at times, very little support coming in behind him from the centre of the park to support him in his target man role.

    Yes he's poor with his melon for a man of his size and stature, but his ability to take down a 65 yard ball, in the chest and drop it to his feet with nary a wobble and then hold it up, often times beating back one or two hackjob defenders and then deliver a pass and get himself back on the run into an attacking space is unlike any player in this league. I have a feeling his frustration comes from a mix of lack of true quality at the heart of central midfield (Which could change when Robson shows up) and the poor standard of officiating and the hacking he endures.

    He is too good a player to not deliver results. Him not scoring doesn't necessarily mean he isn't helping the team. Him drawing two defenders means someone on the park is free and unmarked... and Salgado, Camilo, and others have scored and set up goals this year with the Big Man taking two defenders...

    my humble $0.02
     
  21. sportie1

    sportie1 Member

    Sep 4, 2008
    the higher the salary a player earns, the higher the expectations-- he is an underperforming whiner-- good players rise above and continue to perform at a high level, regardless of what happens around them-- his role is simple... and it is what he is getting paid for-- score goals and create havoc inside the 18 yard box so others can score-- on a consistent basis, hassli is incapable of doing that-- and sadly IMHO never will-- the fact he has not scored a goal in 2 seasons with his head tells u a lot about him as a striker- a tall 1 at that!! lacks drive, ambition and courage... and that is why he is in the MLS at this time of his career-- if he has soooooo much talent as others say he has, then why is there such a problem??? methinks it is wasted talent-- molly-coddling him serves no purpose -- after all, this is professional soccer, not a counseling camp-- if he needs psychological help, then he should pay for it himself-- afterall, he is making over $900 000/season-- and i doubt at this rate of return that the Caps will resign him when his contract expires... which i hope is this year-- i would take Le Toux on my team in a heartbeat, and he comes with a lot less money (look what is happening in Phillie since he was given away to the Caps!!!)... but he is scoring goals and he drives for the goal and works his arse off without all the whining and complaining; rennie is expending a lot of time and energy on mr. eric and i doubt it will really pay huge dividends-- he's a 30 minute player, but can u pay him sooo much for that??
     
  22. sportie1

    sportie1 Member

    Sep 4, 2008
    am i'eating some crow'???? mr. eric scores today vs TO-- a spectacular goal-- like to see him get some garbage goals and then i MIGHT humbly submit to being more patient with him :whistling:
    4 goals in the last 5 games-- but he only played 35 minutes!! (see writing above) lets see what happens in the next 5 games-- crow would seem ok with me as long as the Caps are winning and eric is scoring
     
  23. ixadvent

    ixadvent Member

    Dec 8, 2011
    Club:
    Whitecaps
    like i said, he comes on as sub, scores =]
     
  24. JohnnyRanger

    JohnnyRanger Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jul 30, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    Nat'l Team:
    Scotland
    Le Toux vs Hassli? Try comparing Apples to Giraffes whilst you're at it.

    LeToux is a fit runner, a great athlete, but not a gifted technical player.
    Hassli is ill tempered, not perhaps the fittest, but is (along with Rochat and Dede) the or amongst the, best technically gifted players on the team. His first touch is so great, his ability to pass, shoot etc is unreal.

    Just because two guys play the same or similar positions doesn't mean they're similar players... You wouldn't compare YP Lee and Rochat to Harvey and Klazura would you? They are completely different players in style, ability, experience, etc etc etc
     

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