SEPTA roll call for Saturday

Discussion in 'The River End' started by G-Ho Blue, Mar 22, 2011.

  1. hykos1045

    hykos1045 Member

    May 10, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  2. MyCynideCathrsis

    Feb 20, 2008
    The River End
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lamokin Station is only 0.2 miles closer to PPL Park than Highland Ave station. I doubt SEPTA will want to reopen Lamokin on the grounds that its closer to PPL when a station already exists that is about the same distance away.

    I always take the train to Highland Ave when I go down on SEPTA. The conductors always ask, "Did you miss your stop or something?" and I just tell them its a mile closer to PPL than Chester TC. It's even better for me because I meet people up to tailgate in Lot C so its only like a half mile walk from Highland to there.

    Building an entirely new station on Flower St. would be pretty nice though. But I doubt it would happen anytime soon.
     
  3. sccaflagger74

    sccaflagger74 Member

    Apr 24, 2005
    Media, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lamokin will never be reopened unless someone besides SEPTA foots the bill. Any new station must be ADA complaint which is a pricy proposition. It's not just a matter of repaving the platform and turning on the lights. Spending millions on a station that will be used by a few hundred people 20 times a year is a poor use of meager transit funds.

    A more pragmatic and realistic goal would be to propose a better routing for the shuttle buses to get them onto 291 more quickly (I've never taken them so don't have any suggestions).
     
  4. G-Ho Blue

    G-Ho Blue Member

    Feb 21, 2008
    Philadelphia
    You're right about the shuttles, but it would be encouraging if there was something in the works for the long term. How much money does it cost to rent 4 full-size buses for 5 hours? Multiply that by 18 games a year, and eventually it might be in their interest to pony up some money. Personally, I'm pulling for PPL to chip in, a la AT&T station.
     
  5. unholyunion

    unholyunion Member

    Jan 21, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yea... the conductors say it best - you shouldn't be there..obviously. Also, it doesn't help that they tell you the stop to take is CTC when people would probably rather go to the next one... lack of communication there since many people don't take the R2 normally (if at all)...

    Also, i'd rather a middle of nowhere station than one that is in the middle of something you don't feel safe at (highland and CTC)
     
  6. MyCynideCathrsis

    Feb 20, 2008
    The River End
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've never felt unsafe walking from Highland to Lot C, though. You have to walk down Highland Ave for only 5 small streets before getting onto 291. It really isn't a bad walk at all. I think it also helps in terms of "feeling safe" that both streets are not that narrow, Highland being a 2 lane street and 291 being a 4 lane highway.
     
  7. UnionFreak1

    UnionFreak1 Member+

    Oct 14, 2009
    Tucson, Baja AZ
    Club:
    FC Tucson
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well can't wait to see the pics.
    On a random note, does anybody have pictures of the subway stations inside the Ben Franklin Bridge. I can't seem to find them anywhere. Thanks.
     
  8. MyCynideCathrsis

    Feb 20, 2008
    The River End
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The old Franklin Square station on the PATCO line?
     
  9. UnionFreak1

    UnionFreak1 Member+

    Oct 14, 2009
    Tucson, Baja AZ
    Club:
    FC Tucson
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  10. MyCynideCathrsis

    Feb 20, 2008
    The River End
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  11. UnionFreak1

    UnionFreak1 Member+

    Oct 14, 2009
    Tucson, Baja AZ
    Club:
    FC Tucson
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  12. metsox

    metsox Member

    Jun 11, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    So who is looking forward to waiting for 11.24 for the train following the 8pm game on saturday and missing their connections?
     
  13. unholyunion

    unholyunion Member

    Jan 21, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hopefully septa isn't because every person needs to give them an earful for that.
     
  14. Pelti

    Pelti Member

    Feb 26, 2008
    Philadelphia, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=qn...2177&dir=174.41266307345774&sty=b&form=LMLTCC

    Lamokin station barely exists anymore. As stated earlier, a big part of the reason septa stations are terrible is because they're not allowed to rebuild them without making them handicapped accessible, because of the ADA, which is expensive.

    Highland Ave is already one of Septa's worst performing stations, fewer than 100 people a day use the station. Septa simply doesn't have the funds for this, the only way it gets done is if the team does it on their own.

    As far as the question about the ben franklin bridge stations, the video there is actually the unfinished trolley terminal under the philadelphia plaza. There's also an abandonded PATCO station under franklin square, and each bridge footing has trolley stops. That same video that was linked also had a segment in the bridge stops. If you're ever driving across the bridge in the right lane either way, you can see a small platform and staircase that leads down to a waiting room. It's a lot easier to see if you ride a bus across, su
     
  15. MyCynideCathrsis

    Feb 20, 2008
    The River End
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    On PATCO you can actually see the Franklin Square station pretty well while passing through it. And I always wondered what those stairs were at the footings. I figured it was just for service access.
     
  16. G-Ho Blue

    G-Ho Blue Member

    Feb 21, 2008
    Philadelphia
    Holy crap Bing has hi-res maps. The first time I tried to map Lamokin Station, it came up as significantly closer than Highland Ave, which is what got me excited. However, Pernell St. (which looks like the old entrance) seems to be almost as long as a walk. If we can somehow get the team to pony up the money, they'd be better off building something under the Commodore Barry Bridge. Plenty of empty spaces near that area, too.
     
  17. unholyunion

    unholyunion Member

    Jan 21, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Various reasons for not building a station:

    Amtrak owns the rails (septa owns shit), "Financial issues", it's SEPTA, they see no point...etc...

    I'm gonna just periodically request some sort of EFFICIENT service until i get a restraining order.
     
  18. hykos1045

    hykos1045 Member

    May 10, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Fixed your post. Efficient implies using two shuttle busses for over 200 people rather than risk having an empty seat if you order another bus. I am still appalled that many people who had considered lost causes for the 10:04 train after a 7:30 game actually had to take it upon themselves to run 2 miles through after-curfew Chester to get there in time to get that train.

    SEPTA does have something at stake in terms of ridership, but I think the attention they've given (leaving the station open, holding trains, adding cars, adding new trips to Delaware that almost three people from PPL seems to use anyway, etc.) has been more than I would have expected from the service, given my experience. Anything more in the way of soccer express service could be over the top, but SEPTA has got its mediocre reputation to "up-hold". The only thing they haven't done to promote ridership is maybe given out pamphlets at the stadium with a schedule & system map (latitude, longitude, mapp mapp mapp) or bought out an ad in the union gameday program. It appears their role has been cooperative but not competitive. Hardly ANY one (less than 1.5% of the attendees a sold out game, when the alternative to park costs $20 plus gas!) will hasten to use SEPTA, but since there is not an effort to make anyone use it, that IS efficient in their opinion.
     
  19. metsox

    metsox Member

    Jun 11, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    I tend to agree with you Hykos, although a soccer express back to CC when you have an hour and a half between game end and the next train seems smart, especially for helping those who need to make connections. It's also got to be a major liability to have all those (intoxicated) people on the platform at Chester for over an hour after 10pm at night. Septa knows that they'll be there, and they should take action to cover their own asses if nothing else. After talking to my ticket rep (who talked to the stadium ops staff) it sounds like SEPTA is not intent on helping out Union fans in this case. I was told that fans need to contact septa, pretty much telling me that theyve stopped taking request from stadium ops.

    Normally I'm fine w septa service (exception, not holding the SB train last game and stranding ppl) for the games, but these 8pm Saturday games need an assist from the folks over there.
     
  20. hykos1045

    hykos1045 Member

    May 10, 2010
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    As 1 or 2% or less of the attending fans are taking SEPTA currently, of course SEPTA's stance could be that they are providing as much of a service as the demand warrants. If we push it to 4% or 5% or close to 10% of the game's attendees, at that point a special express run service would maybe be put on the table for consideration, in which case the whole trip becomes actually much more marketable in the way of attracting more new riders to the system.

    Without express accommodations and lacking a consistent shuttle service, my only fear is that the less-than-2% of people currently using SEPTA will continue to decline, and more people will just drive it. When $20 parking, $4.19/gal gas, and I-95 is considered more convenient than public transit, that's a pretty poor indicator of how this is working out vs how it could be. I'm often surprised how well packed the train is given these obstacles of taking SEPTA, which in my case are not quite enough of a deterrent- in order to avoid the obstacles of driving.
     
  21. Pelti

    Pelti Member

    Feb 26, 2008
    Philadelphia, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    There are charter rates for trains for film shoots: http://www.film.org/film/shoot_in_philly/trans_parking/septa.cfm.

    "For a 2-car train (includes engineer, conductor, supervisor) $2,640.00 for the first four hours, each additional car is $1,188.00 for the first 3 hours. After the initial 3 hours, each additional hour for a 2-car train is $731.50 and each additional hour (or fraction thereof) for each additional car is charged at a rate of $242.00 per hour or fraction thereof with no mileage charge."

    That might inform on how much it would take for them to run a "soccer express"
     
  22. unholyunion

    unholyunion Member

    Jan 21, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So essentially, as it is... Let's say we have a 2 car train that can fit close to 100 to 150 people comfortably (maybe more..but i like comfort)... 2 cars require 3 people - 2 conductors (or even 1 on late night cases on normal transit) and the engineer driving.

    Let's say they get paid 30 bucks an hour.

    As well, it takes about 30 minutes for an express to go direct to and from PPL (maybe a bit more pending on speed of train).

    Employees rotate, so they would probably already be on shift from else where and are getting paid anyway...so they take someone off of the R5 line out to Paoli..so what...it's overstaffed and over car'd anyway.

    So for one trip that is 90 dollars for their staff. Not to mention electricity, which I have no clue how much that would be, so let's say roughly 200. So that's around 300 dollars per hour to run an express that is only direct PPL and center city.

    Let's say 150 minimum get on the train. Chester is a zone 3, the end of zone 3 as well.

    WEEKEND and EVENING Zone 3 round trip bought at the station and on board is 9.50. This amounts to 1,425 dollars for 150 people. If my guess at electric to run the train, and staff is correct, they're making about 1100 on the trip.

    No matter what, they'll make a profit on this, it's the issue with amtrak they don't want to deal with, or even just being courteous to customers - they figure there's "already a train running within an hour when people arrive, it's okay"... they just need to run another train late at night to accomodate late games... which they don't do.

    Remember, they JUST RECENTLY put in late night rides for trenton line and various others for SATURDAYS... ever wonder why the party scene is much smaller on saturdays than fridays? I'm sure the comment on that was "no demand"... when there was never a supply with an immovable object.
     
  23. Pelti

    Pelti Member

    Feb 26, 2008
    Philadelphia, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Silverliner II, III, and IV seat about 120. Silverliner V seats 110.
     
  24. unholyunion

    unholyunion Member

    Jan 21, 2011
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is that for 1 car or 2 car?
     
  25. bluetooner

    bluetooner Member

    Nov 7, 2008
    Carteret NJ
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    Scotland
    I contacted Septa about this weekend, but doubt i'll get anything worthwhile in reply. I had been told that they couldn't do anything else (through my ticket rep) which sounds off to me. Far more can be done in terms of getting people to take Septa to and from games.

    I also mentioned to my rep (and the other person i talked to) that a possibility in future could be to put on buses into town for nights like this, where the train schedule just doesn't work out.If they charge $5-$10 per person to shuttle us to Center City instead of CTC, i think that would probably not cost the club any more than running shuttles does and will get a lot of interest. I am really not looking forward to waiting around at CTC at 11.15 on Saturday night.
     

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