The SixtyFive Million Euro Man - The New Welcome Kaka Thread

arun10 · Oct 22, 2009

Eddie said: ↑

CR actually gives a shit about winning, something which Kaka hasn't showed yet, atleast not last night or against Sevilla.

I can't believe you think it would've been the same if we had CR.

The worst thing is it seems we depend so much on him now, i don't like that.
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haha!!a couple of 2-3 bad matches people will be throwing stones at Ronaldo as well!!!If the team is not clicking, why accuse individuals???
let Ronaldo prove that he can carry the team on his shoulder against a worthy opponent like Barca ,MU etc...

Eddie · Oct 22, 2009

arun10 said: ↑

haha!!a couple of 2-3 bad matches people will be throwing stones at Ronaldo as well!!!If the team is not clicking, why accuse individuals???
let Ronaldo prove that he can carry the team on his shoulder against a worthy opponent like Barca ,MU etc...
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No one is saying that the team is clicking and it's only Kaka's fault for the Milan loss. If you read the match thread you'd know how many of the posters here feel about our team balance. But this is the Kaka thread, so we are discussing him and his sucky performance in the last few games.

JG7470 · Oct 22, 2009

"let Ronaldo prove that he can carry the team on his shoulder against a worthy opponent like Barca ,MU etc...

C. Ronaldo...a man always being asked to prove something or other.

celito · Oct 22, 2009

Raul-7 said: ↑

My main problem with him is his poor ball control; he loses the ball too cheaply for a player of his calibre.
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He has always been that way. What set him apart was the moments of brilliance he could create.

celito · Oct 22, 2009

Just a couple of thoughts ... maybe Pellegrini is telling Kaka' to spread the ball around. That's why he is not taking players on as much. It could also be that finally he has some decent players around him and doesn't feel like he has to carry the team on his back like in Milan. He can actually distribute the ball more.

Also remember that Kaka' prefers to take players on the counter attack. He needs space to operate at his best.

Remember that he also did have a couple of nice shots yesterday that he created himself.

arcane · Oct 22, 2009

arun10 said: ↑

why not Ronaldo (for Portugal) and Messi (for Argentina) carry their team!!!!Tell me an instance where they have done that!!!Tell me when kaka has carried Brazil on his shoulders!!!.
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Because there are players who actually perform better for club than country and vice-versa (e.g. Heskey)

P.S. Kaka HAS carried Brazil for a period.

arun10 · Oct 22, 2009

arcane said: ↑

Because there are players who actually perform better for club than country and vice-versa (e.g. Heskey)

P.S. Kaka HAS carried Brazil for a period.
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I don't think Brazil was ever dependent on KAKA , He was an important player for Brazil.That's all he has been...
He had his crappy games and good games with Brazil..
When Dunga started KAKA was not even in the team!!It was the friendly with Italy which cemented his place along with Player's like Diego etc.'s inconsistency with NT.

Barely 10 days ago , he had a good second half against Venezuala with some decent running ,good attaempt on shot and some passing...
But Dunga is not expecting a Zico or Rivaldo out of Kaka....that's the difference..

Frank Smith · Oct 22, 2009

arcane said: ↑

Because there are players who actually perform better for club than country and vice-versa (e.g. Heskey)

P.S. Kaka HAS carried Brazil for a period.
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Since when has Heskey performed good for either?

russian19020 · Oct 22, 2009

arun10 said: ↑

exactly!!1 I don't think with CR in the result would have been any different, if the team is playing like this.....Opposing teams were successfull in containing Robben in the past.They can do the same with Ronaldo..

And Ronaldo once he comes back i have a feeling that he's also not gonna take risks and run at the defenders and get a knock!!!
This is WC year and all established players are playing very carefully!!
Look at Messi's game for the past few weeks...it's very clear that players do not want to get injured!!!
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I think it would have been different. Maybe not a different score but a different performance. Ronaldo can take on the play himself and sometimes carry his team to victory. He has done that many times at Manchester. Sometimes he doesn't win it all himself but sets them on the right track, like by scoring an important equalizer. Plus having ronaldo on the pitch just adds sooo much more attacking power. He has his runs, his shots, his freekicks. Like remember how for two games in a row he scored in the first and then second minute of play? I'm talking about those kinds of runs and shots. And his freekicks need no introduction.

The Ouk · Oct 22, 2009

Just having Ronaldo there makes everyone elses job easier, if the defence is constantly freaking out about Ronaldo, then the other players will have more room to move around, even if Ronaldo does nothing of note, his presence is usually enough to open the game up.

I thought Kaka would have kind of the same impact, but so far

raulblanco · Oct 23, 2009

Cristiano is five times better than Kaka. Everybody expected much bigger from Kaka, but he showed so far very little. I was dissapointed with him in the last game.

Chinky24 · Oct 23, 2009

A day later, I think about this in a different light.

We need to give Kaka more time. After all, he wasn't amazing right away at AC Milan either. It came in patches. And we need a coach who is comfortable with big names and star egos if this one doesn't work out.

arun10 · Oct 23, 2009

russian19020 said: ↑

I think it would have been different. Maybe not a different score but a different performance. Ronaldo can take on the play himself and sometimes carry his team to victory. He has done that many times at Manchester. Sometimes he doesn't win it all himself but sets them on the right track, like by scoring an important equalizer. Plus having ronaldo on the pitch just adds sooo much more attacking power. He has his runs, his shots, his freekicks. Like remember how for two games in a row he scored in the first and then second minute of play? I'm talking about those kinds of runs and shots. And his freekicks need no introduction.
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those runs and lucky shots will work with minnows!!not with a tight side like Milan!!!!
my question why can't he carry portugal to victory???
why he couldn't do anything against the same Milan defence in 2007?

arun10 · Oct 23, 2009

a player who carries the team is like Mardonna for aragentina(86),George Hagi for Romania,Hristo Stoichkov for bulgaria ,Rivaldo for Barca and most recently Ibrahamovic for Inter....
I don't think either Kaka or Ronaldo has that capability....they need supporting players.Otherwisw they don't click!!season is still young , Ronaldo can prove me wrong against a big team!!!!!

JG7470 · Oct 23, 2009

"my question why can't he carry portugal to victory???"

Well he played a very important part in Portugal getting to the Euro finals 2004 as an 18 year old and Portugal getting to the semis as a 21 year old.

why he couldn't do anything against the same Milan defence in 2007?

When the Champions League semis came around C. Ronaldo had played a game every 3.5 days(Euro cup qualif, EPL, Carling Cup, EPL Cup). He was spent!!!! That was the year United dethroned Chelsea and he put United on his shoulders to win the league and won EPL player of the year at 21!!! Milan were taking Serie A games off right before Campions league games so as to stay fresh.. They had points docked and were never going to win the league. Milan was fresh and C. Ronaldo was spent.

Then in 2008 United won the Champions league and EPL with him winning WPOTY. Also, last year United made the finals and if Sir ALex had used his head and started Tevez and attacked from the beginning they would have beat Barca too...Sir Alex is no fool he had a gem of a player and he tried his best not to lose him as he seen many a time. That when all seems lost his boy C. Ronaldo would score the winner or salvage a much needed point.

I am convinced that this will happen in Madrid!!!!

arcane · Oct 23, 2009

arun10 said: ↑

those runs and lucky shots will work with minnows!!not with a tight side like Milan!!!!
my question why can't he carry portugal to victory???
why he couldn't do anything against the same Milan defence in 2007?
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Your over exagerrating that Ronaldo is just "lucky". Only that one free kick was "lucky". CR9 has mad skills you know

Why are you so angry? !!! !!! !!!

No one is saying that he'll "Maradonna" Real Madrid to CL glory. But he will "Ronaldo" Real through some games just like what he did @ ManUnited. Just as Kaka did at Milan.

4x4s · Oct 24, 2009

Chinky24 said: ↑

A day later, I think about this in a different light.

We need to give Kaka more time. After all, he wasn't amazing right away at AC Milan either. It came in patches. And we need a coach who is comfortable with big names and star egos if this one doesn't work out.
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Let me tell you how i see it.

Kaka was better than he was against Sevilla. He opened a lot of goal scoring opportunities, but his final choice was often pathetic. Towards the end of the game, i was left with an impression of a a player that played as he would under any circumstance, but froze up when he realized that it was time to make the final pass or take a shot. A few times he got into the box in a dangerous position only to pass it directly to a Milan player, like a team mate, as my old man said.

To me this is much worse than just playing bad. you can always play better, when you have the quality, but this was proof of mental weakness. We paid a ton of money, and that should be respected.

In a discussion today, i said that Kaka will have to do a lot to turn around my opinion after this. Not on him as a player, but about his commitment in this project.

When he fell to the ground against Seedorf and took his time to get up, you could tell the crowd was kind of fed up with it as well.
Under normal circumstances, you take the player off at this point...Van der Vaart could've come on for him at that point and i would have approved the switch, and even Kaka would probably be glad to leave the field.However, when the player is Kaka, he plays through, and that's not a "evil Perez & Valdano" thing, it is that way in football and life in general. There is a reason Berbatov was started in that CL final even though he was pants.

WhiteBlood · Oct 24, 2009

Wait, he didnt start in the CL final..

4x4s · Oct 24, 2009

WhiteBlood said: ↑

Wait, he didnt start in the CL final..
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Wow, talk about me making a mistake.

Anyway, you get my point. If Berbatov would cost a third of what he actually did, he'd only a third of the chances he actually gets.

It's in the nature of life that people want to get their money's worth. You play PES2010 all the time even though you hate it, for example.

WhiteBlood · Oct 24, 2009

4x4s said: ↑

It's in the nature of life that people want to get their money's worth. You play PES2010 all the time even though you hate it, for example.
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Point well made I have to say

natenate101 · Oct 24, 2009

4x4s said: ↑

Let me tell you how i see it.

Kaka was better than he was against Sevilla. He opened a lot of goal scoring opportunities, but his final choice was often pathetic. Towards the end of the game, i was left with an impression of a a player that played as he would under any circumstance, but froze up when he realized that it was time to make the final pass or take a shot. A few times he got into the box in a dangerous position only to pass it directly to a Milan player, like a team mate, as my old man said.

To me this is much worse than just playing bad. you can always play better, when you have the quality, but this was proof of mental weakness. We paid a ton of money, and that should be respected.

In a discussion today, i said that Kaka will have to do a lot to turn around my opinion after this. Not on him as a player, but about his commitment in this project.

When he fell to the ground against Seedorf and took his time to get up, you could tell the crowd was kind of fed up with it as well.
Under normal circumstances, you take the player off at this point...Van der Vaart could've come on for him at that point and i would have approved the switch, and even Kaka would probably be glad to leave the field.However, when the player is Kaka, he plays through, and that's not a "evil Perez & Valdano" thing, it is that way in football and life in general. There is a reason Berbatov was started in that CL final even though he was pants.
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Repped.

Chinky24 · Oct 24, 2009

*muses thoughtfully*

Bronaldo · Oct 24, 2009

Berbatov started a CL final?

News to me. (yes, slightly pointless)

Umar · Nov 11, 2009

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/nov/12/kaka-interview-brazil-england

Interesting interview with Kaka.

mymy33 · Nov 12, 2009

Gattuso on Kaka at Real Madrid:

"As far as I know, Real Madrid don’t work enough on their fitness levels" Gattuso told the Corriere della Sera.

“And when a player like ‘Ricky’ has grown accustomed to training more regularly, he ends up struggling.

“At Milan, Kaka used to work even when we had two or three days off. And our fitness coach, Daniele Tognaccini, made him run.

“Let’s call a spade a spade - this Kaka of Real Madrid is not the same Kaka we used to know.”

http://goal.com/en-us/news/86/italy...is-a-shadow-of-his-former-self-at-real-madrid