To Protect or Not to Protect (Expansion Draft Thread)

Discussion in 'Toronto FC' started by adammac19, Oct 21, 2009.

  1. adammac19

    adammac19 BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 31, 2006
    Sydney Mines
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Well that time of the year again, with another new team in the league I like to see what players Toronto FC supporters are willing to protect. Remember GA players don't need to be protected (Frei would be safe but Ibbe is different because he could graduate this year from the program). 11 players can be protected so here is my list of players

    1) De Guzman
    2) DeRo
    3) Serioux
    4) Attakora
    5) Wynne
    6) Guevara
    7) White
    8) Gomez
    9) Cronin
    10) Fellinga
    11) Edwards

    This would mean Brennan, Garcia, Vitti, Barrett, Ibbe (well unless he is classed as GA), Gerba, Gala and Samyang would be exposed.

    What is your list?
     
  2. Drexel10

    Drexel10 New Member

    Mar 7, 2008
    So you would protect Fellinga over Barrett and Robinson? Has he impressed you that much?
     
  3. alexb746

    alexb746 New Member

    Mar 24, 2009
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    1) De Guzman
    2) DeRo
    3) Serioux
    4) Attakora
    5) Wynne
    6) Guevara
    7) White
    8) Gomez
    9) Cronin
    10) Gerba
    11) Edwards

    I would like to see Gerba protected more than Fellinga. I would like to keep both and I think the likelihood of Gerba being picked up is greater.

    p.s. I have been very critical of Gerba and his fitness, but as many pointed out, strikers take a while to build cohesion with their teammates. His potential impact is also greater than Fellinga's in my opinion.
     
  4. adammac19

    adammac19 BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 31, 2006
    Sydney Mines
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Well by your list not having Barrett protected it is more likely they would pick Barrett than Gerba. Barrett and Gerba are similar to salary but Barrett is more MLS experience and wouldn't take a international spot unlike Gerba.

    Fellinga I do like and think could be a good player, it isn't like we have many left footed player in the squad and at his price you can't go wrong.
     
  5. alexb746

    alexb746 New Member

    Mar 24, 2009
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    I agree that value is a key consideration in a cap system. Fellinga could be a solid replacement for Brennan at that price... but that doesn't necessarily warrant his protection in the draft. What have we really seen from him?

    You make a good point about Gerba using up an international spot on US teams, but that's just one more argument I would use to protect him. He is more valuable to us as a domestic player. Furthermore, we also payed (and unfortunately played) Garcia to get him so I would like to see a return on that investment (of sorts).

    I don't see the Gerba/Barrett argument as cut and dry. It really depends on what is available out there.
     
  6. Khaleeji

    Khaleeji New Member

    Apr 7, 2007
    Bahrain
    1) DeRo
    2) Serieux
    3) Attakora
    4) Wynne
    5) Frei
    6) Guevarra
    7) White
    8) Gerba
    9) Gomez
    10) Cronin
    11) Robinson

    I don't think DPs need to be protected, so deGuzman is a freeby for us.
     
  7. crazypete13

    crazypete13 Moderator
    Staff Member

    May 7, 2007
    A walk from BMO
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Of all the old relatively expensive guys we have I can't see protecting Robinson, Brennan or Garcia. I would protect Guevara, assuming he wants to play here and we are willing to live with him being at the world cup for a month, solely because we are a much better team with him in the lineup and we don't have any other decent players for set pieces.

    I'm not sure about Frei or Ibby graduating from GA, but should they both graduate I'd protect Frei, but not Ibby. The good thing is we can only lose one player (at most), and ideally we would leave those players exposed that are least desirable for Philly from salary and or international slot reasons.

    Assuming DPs don't need to be protected, and considering Edwards obvious quality as a relatively cheap backup it makes sense to protect him (switch to Frei if he's no longer GA).

    1) De Rosario
    2) Serioux
    3) Attakora
    4) Wynne
    5) Cronin
    6) Guevara
    7) White
    8) Gerba
    9) Gomez
    10) Sanyang
    11) Edwards
     
  8. adammac19

    adammac19 BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 31, 2006
    Sydney Mines
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    You guys are right about De Guzman, based on last year rules unless he has a no trade clause (which I don't think he has) he doesn't have to be protected

    Link
     
  9. smenge

    smenge New Member

    Apr 5, 2008
    toronto
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    I would like to see the team dump the following players, either through the draft, trade, or salary dump:

    Barrett, because I hate anybody that looks like Rooney but scores like, well, like Barrett
    Serioux, because he is old, slow and is almost as bad at ball distribution as..
    brennan, because he is old, slow, and pouts too much.
    and because he is a long ball specialist, that is, boot the ball long when you can't do anything else with it.
    Wynne, because he was so good and now so average, what is next, so crap?
    Gerba, because anybody that reminds me of Colin Samuel has got to go
    Guevera, because if his NT commitments were distracting this year, imagine what the world cup will do for his attachment to tfc?
    Garcia because somebody in the south end would kill him one day if he is still here

    Mo needs to find at least two good defenders and one or two, or three forwards who can score.
     
  10. ArteEtLabore

    ArteEtLabore Member

    Dec 16, 2006
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada

    and you left Mo off the list of people the team should dump? Are you feeling alright, Smenge?
     
  11. TFCBlue

    TFCBlue Member

    Feb 7, 2007
    KW, Sec 223
    Club:
    Manchester City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I think most of us would drive Garcia and Vitti to whatever other team would take them off our hands, so they won't be protected.

    Hopefully as you indicate, De Guzman, Ibby, and Frei won't need protecting.

    I know it's tempting to keep players for the future, but I think we need to keep a solid core team that could start in 2010:
    1) DeRo - no question - only reason we're competing for playoffs still
    2) Attakora - most improved and most promising player
    3) Cronin - when played more centrally is solid
    4) White - possible complete striker when fit
    5) Wynne - lighting fast, just hope someone teaches him positioning
    6) Serioux - overconfident at times but solid enough
    7) Brennan - solid if not unspectacular - still the captain
    8) Guevara - a good coach will motivate him to play every game

    I'm not thrilled with the choices for the last 3 spots but I'd give them to players that won't start but provide depth:
    9) Gomez - promises to step up next year like Nana did this year
    10) Barrett - as long as he accepts he's playing a supporting role
    11) Edwards - solid #2 and seems willing to play backup

    Just missing out:
    Sanyang - he might come good in future but it's going to be too long
    Gala - haven't seen enough of him - must be a reason he's not playing
    Gerba - no mobility whatsoever - doesn't seem to fit in this league.
    Robinson - doesn't know what to do once he has the ball.
    Fellinga - can't think of anything he's actually done worth remembering

    Can we please also not protect Cummins?
     
  12. scaryice

    scaryice Member

    Jan 25, 2001
    Barring something crazy, Frei will graduate from GA and Ibrahim will not.

    I'd say the following 8 players are locks to be protected:

    Attakora
    Barrett
    Cronin
    de Guzman
    De Rosario
    Frei
    White
    Wynne

    That leaves 3 spots for the following 6 players:

    Brennan, Fellinga, Gomez, Guevara, Sanyang, Serioux
     
  13. KyleP

    KyleP Member

    Jan 24, 2009
    Club:
    AC Milan
    Protected:
    Attakora
    Cronin
    de Guzman
    De Rosario
    Frei
    Gerba
    Gomez
    Sanyang
    Serioux
    White
    Wynne

    Unprotected:
    Barrett
    Brennan
    Edwards
    Fellinga
    Gala
    Garcia
    Guevara
    Robinson
    Vitti

    It may seem like a bit of a cowardly move protecting de Guzman but I don't think the risk is worth taking; too scared that Nowak and the Union would screw us over some how. In the actual list, I wouldn't be suprised if Barrett is protected over Gerba, as he's more likely to be taken, but in all honesty I couldn't care less about Barrett being taken so I have no worries about dangling him out there. The only guy I really don't like leaving unprotected is Guevara but hopefully with his salary and rumours that he may be off at the end of the season, Philly stays clear.
    Robinson and Brennan are both old with high salaries so again I'd be suprised if Philly took the risk with them.
     
  14. Polygong

    Polygong Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 8, 2007
    Toronto
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Regarding Vitti, he's here on loan so I'm not sure if he's eligible to be taken in the expansion draft anyway.

    Unless of course he's on loan to MLS and not to TFC specifically, in this commie league God only knows...
     
  15. smenge

    smenge New Member

    Apr 5, 2008
    toronto
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    yea, i know, i am biting my lip and holding my tongue until i see what Mo and MLSE does in the off season, but I expect, as do you i suppose, that i will be on the murder Mo wagon again one day.
     
  16. KyleP

    KyleP Member

    Jan 24, 2009
    Club:
    AC Milan
    The loan players were available for selection in last year's draft so unless MLS have announced anything, I assume the rules would be the same.
     
  17. alexb746

    alexb746 New Member

    Mar 24, 2009
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    If you're not on the wagon...

    then who the hell is driving it?

    @KyleP: I like those pics, but I worry as well about leaving Guevara there. I think I'd rather see Sanyang left unprotected making it easier for them to pick Barrett.
     
  18. smenge

    smenge New Member

    Apr 5, 2008
    toronto
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    yea, yea...for me, what Mo does with Robinson and Barrett will govern my response; If he keeps Robinson, or at least offers him a spot with the team next year, i will support him. If he does not do everything he can to put barrett on the first train out of town, i will not support him. Most of what he has had to do this season has a direct relationship to these two players. Early in the season, when tfc were winning, robinson was the mainstay holding midfield, leading the team, particularly the hole filled defence. His distribution is crap, he cannot hit a barn with a shot on goal, but defensively, he had few peers in this league. When he got injured, Mo and cummins did everything they could to fill the hole he left, and had to go out and use DP money to replace him. I know I am going to get hammered for this, but I think a healthy Robinson would have made it redundant to sign JDG. And, I don't think the later has the same leadership qualities. Besides, the two shots on goal by JDG that he has taken from just outside the box have been Robinsonesque, to say the least. Remember guys, JDG cannot score, as illustrated by his play in La Liga.
    With Barrett, if Mo keeps him and continues to laud him as the next great goal scorer in mls, we are going to have another season of low scoring, wasted efforts. This guy is just not that good.
     
  19. TFCSoccerDad

    TFCSoccerDad Member

    Sep 16, 2009
    Kitchener, Ontario
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    I've been very critical of Barrett and will grant that he has NO finish. However, you can't fault his work ethic or his dedication to TFC. In training he is always giving 110% and he is one of the few forwards who you see come back into the defensive end to help out during our regular scramblefests in front of the net. Seen Gerba back there lately? To me Barrett is a good, serviceable soccer player, but that dough head Cummins insists on playing him as a striker, which we all know he is not. A good coach with good soccer knowledge could put Barrett into a suitable role and you'd find he'd be one of our better players. Not only that, but the guy has a bit of fire inside him - yes it gets him in trouble sometimes, but I'd rather have a guy who's into the game then a guy like Guevara who's smiling and shaking hands after a loss. Intensity is one of those intangibles in soccer - show me that you want to be on the pitch. You can teach skills, but you can't teach work ethic and desire, you either have it or you don't. The biggest problem I've seen this year is that there are too many guys who don't give 100% on the field. (Guevara, Gerba, Garcia, Vitti) Getting rid of one of the guys who does bring it and can be a role model on the team just doesn't make sense.
     
  20. ArteEtLabore

    ArteEtLabore Member

    Dec 16, 2006
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    barrett is safe to leave unprotected, because few teams will want to touch his long contract. But if he does get taken in the draft I can see him turning into the next Jeff Cunningham
     
  21. adammac19

    adammac19 BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 31, 2006
    Sydney Mines
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    If history is going to be a clue about who to protect both San Jose and Seattle took players who were making next to nothing (Pozinak and Smith).
     
  22. deepm

    deepm Member

    May 13, 2009
    Mississauga
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    What's with so many people suggesting to leave Sanyang unprotected?

    He has pretty much done everything a defensive midfielder is supposed to do...and is a good replacement for Robo...who definately should be released after this season.

    Keep in mind Sanyang isn't going to be an offensive midfielder.

    I only understand from the aspect of we have too many central midfielders as it is...but if robo and vitti leave then a bit of cluttter is gone....not to mention a whole lot of salary.
     
  23. deepm

    deepm Member

    May 13, 2009
    Mississauga
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
    Considering the players TFC left unprotected I was surprised anyone from tfc was taken last season.

    And wow...just reading the list I just noticed Attakora was left unprotected in the '08 expansion draft. Imagine him playing the way he has been for Seattle.
    But then again he hasn't played a whole lot prior to this season.
     
  24. BearcatSA

    BearcatSA Member

    Jan 15, 2008
    Canada
    Does anyone know what Pozniak's salary was when he was with TFC?
     
  25. KyleP

    KyleP Member

    Jan 24, 2009
    Club:
    AC Milan
    His base salary was 90,000.
     

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