Bigsoccer Votes for Iranian Elections

Discussion in 'Elections' started by Rostam, May 27, 2009.

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  1. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Reading Mani's posts make me wonder if I am reading about some other city than the one I live in:)

    Today is mother's day in Iran and I had to do some last minute shopping, which took around town to various places: Vanak Square, north Vali Asr Avenue, Shahrak Gharb, and the Tirajeh mall in west Tehran. Everything was quite calm and normal. There was some talk about the protests that had taken place yesterday and the election results, but other than a convoy of special forces that was heading east on the Niayesh freeway, I didn't see anything different than what I see on any other work day.

    I can, however, confirm that twitter and facebook are presently inaccessible and that internet connection is a bit slower than normal. The SMS service is also apparently not working, although I have not tried to use it myself but can confirm I haven't received any SMS messages the past couple of days.

    As for yesterday's protests, I have to admit I can't talk much about what was happening because I was mostly at home, glued to the tv and internet to get the latest on the election results. The only time I ventued out was to buy cigarettes, which didn't take me far enough to see anything. But the people I have talked to relate some small scale protests and demonstrations dispersed in several locations. The largest protests apparently numbered in the few thousand (3-4 thousand).

    Btw, it may sound corny, but when the convoy of special forces was moving on Niayesh freeway, a couple of cars honked their horns and waived at them and for some reason the scene made me a bit emotional, making me almost choke with tears. I personally hate the fact that after an election that was so open and so vibrant, a bunch of rumor mongers and sore losers have tried to throw this nation into chaos. Now, to be sure, my opinion will change if I do so see something that indicates these allegations of fraud have some merit, but even then I will always know that 90% of what is being passed along as facts are nothing but bogus rumors, most of them by people who know they are passing along fiction as fact.
     
  2. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Because I, along with the majority of the Iranian population, would find it insulting to have foreigners meddle in our elections. Basically because of the same reason that "independent foreigners" have no role in monitoring US elections or those of any othe self-respecting nation! Iran has its own institutions to do the job and if it needs to fix the way it does things, the fix should not be about what you suggest.
     
  3. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    I am going to ignore you Iranian Monitor. All along, you have acted as Ahmadinejad's unofficial apologist on this thread. So no wonder that you would make such ridiculous claims that Tehran is all calm, and people are waving at the special forces. :rolleyes:

    Here is a live Twitter from Tehran: http://twitter.com/StopAhmadi
     
  4. Borussia

    Borussia Member+

    Jun 5, 2006
    Fürth near Nuremberg
    Club:
    Borussia Mönchengladbach
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
  5. kindred

    kindred New Member

    Jul 27, 2007
    Chapel Hill
    IM -

    i'm watching live footage on CNN. something is definitely happening there, and it's more than one or two isolated little bands of people.
     
  6. Borussia

    Borussia Member+

    Jun 5, 2006
    Fürth near Nuremberg
    Club:
    Borussia Mönchengladbach
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Just a few months ago, I predicted that Khamenei & his puppets (despite the support of the infamous "Revolutionary Guards") might suffer the same fate like the Eastern European dictatorships in 1989 if they continue ignoring the own population.

    The irony of history is that the Mullahs obviously didn't learn from the Shah's mistakes, imposing the same kind of dictatorship. Huge parts among society in Iran are fed up with lies & the violation of human rights ... so if the Mullah's don't finally pay attention to a famous Gorbatshov slogan, they'll soon suffer the same fate like the regime they fighted against in '79! They are already isolated internationally ... so they should be smart enough to notice that they can't afford pissing off huge parts of the own population.


    Una bella giornata.
     
  7. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Unless something has happened since I got home, the situation that I saw is exactly as I reported it.

    I noticed, btw, that yahoo's lead story on Iran is an AP report with the same impression as I have of the city:

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090614/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election
     
  8. kindred

    kindred New Member

    Jul 27, 2007
    Chapel Hill
  9. !Bob

    !Bob Member

    Apr 28, 2005
    UK
    I wish I could do away with sleep!

    Anyway, someone asked about how the fraud could happen and I don't think IM really gave a response. Other than problems of vote rigging because voting is done by birthcertificate with no requirement of even a picture (older BCs), there are reports of anywhere between 5-7 million "ghost" votes. But that's not the problem.

    Then there are the polling stations where all the candidates are allowed to have a representative, but of course it's never that simple. The person in charge of organising these representatives is...yep you guessed it...appointed by the government (i.e AN). So the candidates were complaining about many who were not hearing back and therefore would have had no representative in some polling stations, others who were assigned to a different one than what they had requested (i.e. the guy from NYC being assigned a polling station in Alabama the day before the elections!) The candidates said this was particularly difficult for the female reps. Others were intimidated by being refused entry/their phones taken and broken etc. BUT this was not the problem either!!!

    So what is the problem? These representatives are in the polling stations. The stations do send their numbers on form 22 to the Ministry of Interior who collate and announce the results. But the reps in the polling stations are not supposed to tell anyone their own results - it's confidential. And there is no supervision in the Ministry of Interior; so the Ministry can announce any number they like! The reason that Mousavi and others were up in arms is that 4 years ago Karrubi claimed that he had been cheated in the vote counting by the Ministry and he had been second not AN (in the first round). So this time, the candidates (especially the two reformers) ensured that they made an organised system of getting their reps numbers and collating them themselves. Which is why Mousavi said conclusively that the numbers were showing he had won.

    I have posted this link before, but since many seem to be asking the same questions again, here it is. It shows all the ways that cheating can occur. The Ministry of Interior is the only place where cheating of this scale can occur.

    http://washingtoninstitute.org/templateC05.php?CID=3068

    The previous stats I posted were taken from:

    balatarin.com (the site itself is not affliated politically so far as I know!)

    But there are now sites which are politically affliated giving different numbers and saying these are quite certain! The site was affliated with Khatami and when Khatami pulled out and supported Mousavi, got heavily behind him. It isn't one of the two main sites that Mousavi announced his information but reliable and completely with the Mousavi camp.

    http://mowj.ir/ShowNews.php?7229

    Ballets cast - 37.4 million (81%)
    Spoilt ballets - 600,000 (1.6%)
    Mir Hossein Mousavi - 21.3 million (57.2%)
    Mahmoud Ahmadinejad - 10.5 million (28%)
    Mohsen Rezaei - 2.7 million (7.2%)
    Mehdi Karrubi - 2.2 million (6%)

    Finally the article by Mani - There Will be Blood is actually quite an accurate description of what I've been hearing too. AN/Khamenei do seem to be planning to at the very least marginalise their opposition. Some big names are being arrested which is unprecidented on this scale and such level of people!! One or two big journalists or one religious person being sidelined or arrested may have happened every now and then but this is at least 10 times worse than anything that has gone on the past 30 years put together. There are reports of the Expediency Council, headed by Rafsanjani potentially making a move against Khamenei. That is the body than can under section 111 of the Constitutional Code remove the Supreme Leader.

    The people on the streets are being urged to calm down by all camps. Mousavi has made a request from the authorities for peaceful demonstrations on Monday. They are also suggesting "strikes" by the people from Tuesday. Karrubi has said he will publish something tomorrow. His newspaper had a strikingly blank front page today (half the page was empty!!

    Rezaei that I mentioned earlier who had backed off after the anouncement by Khamenei and as a former head of Revolutionary Guard may play a major role in splitting the RG, but had not congratulated AN yet has now come out and specifically said that he will also contest the results in before the appropriate body.

    The swords are drawn on all sides by the big players. And no one is blinking yet.
     
  10. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Mani,

    If I recounted what I saw and if it didn't fit the impression you have, it is either because I am lying or your impression is wrong. You can decide which is the case, but at least during the time I went through the areas of Tehran I mentioned here, things were absolutely calm. This is not to say that things are not volatile and cannot get out of hand; no one disputes that Mousavi had millions of voters (by the official count, more than 13 million voted for him) and that many of them were shocked by the results. In Tehran, most of the Mousavi supporters I have met have felt robbed and can't believe their candidate really lost. One of them is a bright young guy who is my cousin, who I have not talked to since the election, but who was at a family gathering Thursday night. He was arguing before the election about how Mousavi was sure to win and how everyone supported him. I told him lets take your proposition to a simple test; lets see who in our own family is voting for? And in my family, except for one of my other cousins and her husband, there is no one who is really religious. Most are middle or upper middle class.

    Suffice it to say that when I finished with my informal survey of our family members, and my cousin noticed that there were at most 5 (3 who had totally made up their mind, and 2 who were leaning towards him) Mousavi supporters among 36 people there, his only reaction was to joke and say: we have a wierd family. That "everyone" he knows in their neighorhood, at work, and his former university classmates, is supporting Mousavi. And what I told him is this: that if he had been asked before our informal survey what percentage of his own family supported Mousavi, he would not have come up with the numbers we got. That he needs to pay a a little more attention to people who see things differently he does and not assume that those who talk the loudest and speak with the greatest conviction are the only ones that count.
     
  11. !Bob

    !Bob Member

    Apr 28, 2005
    UK
    IM I am sorry to gain have to say this to you, but you are starting to sound more and more like Comical Ali refusing to accept that the Americans are in Baghdad as the tanks are rolling in the background behind him!!
     
  12. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Good analysis, as usual. [​IMG]
     
  13. weasel

    weasel Member

    Oct 31, 2000
    NYC
    Based on your history of Jewish conspiracy theories and exaggerations regarding Iran's military capability, I think I'll go with Mani on this one.
     
  14. Iranian Monitor

    Iranian Monitor Member+

    Aug 18, 2004
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    :)

    I do live in Tehran. And as I said, even the wire reports from foreign journalists in this city fit the description I have of what is going on. The situation, no doubt, is volatile, but it is not like it is being presented through the snipets here.

    As for the election results, lets just say that the last report I read indicated that the reformists have changed their tune, and are now disputing 10 million votes that do not have the ID card numbers with them. As ID cards are not required for voting, but were repeatedly "recommended" by the authorities for voters to take with them, taking down the ID card numbers of anyone who had them, while requiring the birth certificate (shenasnameh) for voing, there might be 10 million such votes. But I wonder if all that 10 million voted for Ahmadinejad, or they voted like the rest of the population?

    In any case, the only thing I have not seen which is anamolous and not ordinary (and maybe I haven't checked it out closely) is the official break down of the votes. That is the one real issue I have with the election results. Once that breakdown is given, I will make up my own mind as to whether any of these allegations have any merit whatsoever, already knowing regardless that much of the "facts" being reported by reformist affiliated groups are fiction in any case.

    Whatever happens from all this, and whoever is right or wrong, I hope it all turns for the best for Iran. The rest, to me, is about fighting over who should have greater influence between figures who I don't know personally, neither of whom seems all that perfect for me to want to see blood spilled over.
     
  15. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Iranian Monitor: "Tehran is calm and peaceful, the people are waving at the Revolutionary Guards, throwing flowers at them, and French kissing them..."

    Meanwhile, in Tehran:
    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUlTrcPEvUA"]YouTube - iran election[/ame]
     
  16. !Bob

    !Bob Member

    Apr 28, 2005
    UK
    Karrubi has just released a statement announcing in VERY strong words that he doesn't accept AN as president and says that he will appeal the decision!
     
  17. GringoTex

    GringoTex Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    1301 miles de Texas
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    There's a reason Iran banned UN election monitors.
     
  18. GringoTex

    GringoTex Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    1301 miles de Texas
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Liar. U.N. monitors US elections.
     
  19. GringoTex

    GringoTex Member

    Aug 22, 2001
    1301 miles de Texas
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    You've already lied about U.S. election monitors. Once a liar, always a liar.
     
  20. Ali_reza

    Ali_reza Member

    Mar 1, 2006
    Iranian Monitor, apart your feedbacks of intentions of vote for AN i have yet to meet one iranian who has'nt voted against AN and that includes family here and in Iran, friends here and in Iran, iranians on the net, in the voting line, iranians i know by far, etc.

    What you're doing here is profoundly anti-iranian.

    Mani and !Bob, thanks for the updates. I'm going to spread all this info to as many people as possible.
     
  21. Scarecrow

    Scarecrow Red Card

    Feb 13, 2004
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    What's funny is that for years I have said that IM works for the ministry of Propaganda in Iran. Doesn't seem so far fetched now does it?
     
  22. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Mousavi's latest message to the Iranian people, issued moments ago: "Continue the non-violent protests and civil disobedience "
     
  23. The Devil's Architect

    Feb 10, 2000
    The American Steppe
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's a message the Palestinians need to put into effect.
     
  24. Mani

    Mani BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 1, 2004
    Club:
    Perspolis
    Nat'l Team:
    Iran
    Iranians around the globe holding a series of protests and sit-ins at the Iranian embassies yesterday, today and the rest of the week. (Where is my vote?)

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dR8Xf6AROg"]YouTube - WHERE IS MY VOTE - Paris[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3CuHZVkAEA"]YouTube - London - Where is my vote? 01[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1n_avnRZLs"]YouTube - Where is my Vote Perth Australia[/ame]
     
  25. !Bob

    !Bob Member

    Apr 28, 2005
    UK
    Let's not derail the thread with our personal agendas!!
     

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