Alert: **** The Official Champions League Thread****

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

I think there is a big difference in quality. Is Walter Samuel really the difference between getting knocked out in the round of 16 and getting to atleast the Semi's?

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Really? a big difference?

I fail to see that. You're either overrating Chelsea or underrating us. I can understand if you think Chelsea were better, but to say there is a big difference in quality is a huge overexageration.

Take a look at the difference Samuel has made since he returned in Serie A. His performances have been largely flawless and we've won every game since he's been back.

But it's not only Samuel that's the difference. Hopefully we get a bit more luck with injuries. Last season we lost several center backs. The season before we lost several center midfielders. I'm sure you'll appreciate that considering the defensive injury problems you had a couple of seasons ago in the semifinal against Milan, which could well have been the difference in that tie.

In addition, having Mourinho will certainly help. He has a good record in Europe and seems like the type of manager who would do alot of preparation for big ties like this which is in stark contrast to Mancini. Last time we had a manager with a good record in Europe (Cuper) we reached the semi's, only losing on away goals to Milan and missing our best player, Vieri.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Yes, he's overrating that Chelsea side. You know, the one that actually won a couple titles a side that looked impregnable at home in a VERY tough league. I fail to see how anyone can get hyped up over what Inter are doing in the league when they've coasted in the league the last couple seasons and been shite in the CL the last couple seasons.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

We've won a couple of titles aswell, but we're comparing Mourinho's Inter to his Chelsea side, so Mancini's achievements shouldn't come into this.

I know you're trying to imply that Chelsea had much tougher competition to win the league than we do now but i don't agree. For example in 04/05 Liverpool wern't even challenging for the league whilst i'm sure you'll agree that Man Utd were in transition. Only Arsenal was really capable of mounting a serious title challenge. That's not even mentioning the other 16 teams, which i won't go into.

Mourinho himself compared his Inter side to Chelsea and talked about the strength of the players at his disposal. What more do you want.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Your missing the point. It is still pretty much the same talent. Talent not good enough to do much in the CL. Chelsea's talent level has been so high they literally dragged themselves to the final last season, with an inept manager. Under Jose they made the semis losing twice in heartbreaking ways.

You cannot compare the talent level. You just can't.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Do you even know the circumstances of our CL exits?

We were missing our 3 CM's in the match against Valencia, and 3 CB's in the match against Liverpool.

We have more attacking options now btw, and lack of talent is not the reason for our underachieving in the CL, as i explained above and in one of my earlier posts (if you cared to read).

Grant was using Mourinho's tactics, plus they had a good draw for the last 16 and quarters.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Saying this in the most respectful way, those circumstances do not impress me. I've looked at the teams for your last two CL exits, and even though there are injuries [Samuel and sometimes Cordoba], I still feel that if Inter had dreams of winning the CL, those excuses will not fly losing to Valencia. They are not even close contenders.

I do agree, there are more attacking options in Mancini and Quaresma but Ibra is still constant there. He has yet to impress in these stages of the CL.

Im not rating you based on how I think we will do against you, but just in comparison to the rest of the field and the last couple years and Inter are unimpressive. Chjelsea 05 may not have won anything, but they certainly strike me as the way better team, just my opinion

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Well surely you'd agree that getting alot of injuries in one position is rather unfortunate? As we saw with you guys against Milan 2 seasons ago. Remember that Valencia ran Chelsea very close in the following round.

Agree on Ibra. He needs to start performing when at the KO stages. I hope he comes good.

I hope you mean unimpressive in Europe, which i admit is true. But if we are to compare Mourinho's Inter to his Chelsea then i guess we have to wait till the end of the season.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

“All you need is an injury or loss of form to change everything. Straight off I’d say Manchester United have the edge, you just need to look at their front line: Wayne Rooney, Cristiano Ronaldo, Dimitar Berbatov, Carlos Tevez, Anderson and Nani.


“However, Inter seem to be built especially to make [Sir Alex] Ferguson’s side suffer. The current Champions League and Club World Cup holders have shown they struggle against physically strong opponents.


“Inter are so physical they can be described as a tank. To beat Manchester United you need to be aggressive and rile them up. You also require a few well-placed kicks,” continued Fabio Capello’s right hand man.


“The important thing is don’t let champions like Cristiano Ronaldo or Tevez play the ball to feet, otherwise you’re dead.”


Baldini tips United as “slight favourites” in that tie, but gives his verdict to the Italians in the other two fixtures.

http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/jan4e.html
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He's spot on... and I'd expect that kind of game from Inter, especially at their place.

Hardly a secret really, the whole world knows we're essentially soft. Not as soft as the likes of Barca or Arsenal, but certainly not hard nuts when faced with teams who want to get stuck in all across the pitch.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

That's a dangerously fine line to walk though. Sure in midfield they may dominate depending on how we are set up and how we want to play it, but Inter have a few hot-heads on their books and cards come come into the equation. You don't get away with the rough stuff, especially not on WPOTY in the latter stages of the CL. I also don't rate their backline as I've said before.

For me we have 2 major weaknesses.

We are prone to let fast, physical strikers get chances, especially snap shots or deflections/rebounds near the top of the box.

We struggle to break down a bunkering team that is well organized compared to the likes of Barca and Arsenal who walk through them.


Inter can certainly hope that Ibra gets a couple chances and pulls something special off. I wouldn't bet against it personally (but I wouldn't bet on it either). However the 2nd is what they've got no hope in achieving. Too many of their players are volatile or attacking in nature to sit back for 90 mins against us. Roma who imo are a far better counter attacking team that actually had excellent performance from their CBs against us never threatened United over 2 legs, even when we played scrubs!

Don't get me wrong, we're not infallible, but Inter don't have the team that can batten down the hatches AND maintain high pressure for 90 mins against us without either abandoning the attack all together or leaving spaces for our counter-attack to exploit.

For me, the keys to the tie are:


United

Distribution of the ball from CMs and CBs
Countering down the flank that Maicon leaves exposed
Exploiting defence ill-suited to playing against Ron, Berba, Rooney and Tevez (3 of em)

Inter

Ibra must be focal point of attack and a threat to score whilst playing in others.
Defense, especially CBs must overachieve
Mark Ronaldo on set pieces and crosses
Win midfield battle and keep possession enough to frustrate United's rhythym.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Don't know why on earth you don't rate our backline. It's one of the best in Europe IMO.

In terms of hot heads, Materazzi and Burdisso are 4th and 5th choice centre backs and the likelihood is that one of them will make way for Samuel in the CL squad. The only other person who you could remotely call a "hot head" is Adriano. Man Utd have Rooney and Ronaldo though - both could easily get wound up, as we've seen recently.

The 2 weaknesses you mention we can certainly exploit with our 2 physical strikers who are good at long shots and also our solid defence coupled with a workman like midfield.

Not sure about your judgement on Roma. Last season they created more than enough chances at the Olimpico, but ended up conceding on the first real chance that Man Utd had in the first half. Their defence isn't good enough whilst their midfield doesnt provide enough protection.

I think our team could easily sit back for 90 minutes. We have 3 defensive minded midfielders, plus Stankovic who also works his ass off. These guys can easily maintain pressure for 90 minutes.

As for countering the flank that Maicon leaves exposed, Zanetti normally covers for him when he pushes forward and vice versa.

Cordoba would be a good match for Rooney or Tevez. Not saying he'll have either of them in his pocket, but he's a speedy man marker which is what we need against that type of player. Samuel would be ideally suited to handling Berbatov. Samuel's main weakness is fast players running at him and Berba isn't particularly fast. Ronaldo will probably prove more problematic. He'll most likely be up against Chivu and Maxwell with help from Muntari or Cambiasso. Our best bet is to double up on him and close him down very quickly. Still its easier said than done.

The one thing i'm not sure about us doing is keeping possesion enough to frustrate Man Utd.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

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Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Samuel was one of the guys I was talking about. Not that he's not in control, but he goes in for some silly tackles at time. It may not be rage, but its something.

As for your midfield: you are getting things mixed up. 3 defensive minded mids is not what you need if you want to maintain high pressure, 3 Stinkys (stinky is my nickname for Stankovic) and a DM is what you want to maintain high pressure. Throw in 2 hard working forwards and specimens at FB and you're a lock to give us fits.

I forgot to mention Zanetti, he's the x-factor. If he plays his best football he could be a problem for us at both ends of the field, but barring that I don't think Inter match up well. Sitting back means discipline and cohesion against a frontline as mobile as ours. It will also mean trying to hit us on the counter which as mentioned before, you are not built to. That also opens up the counter-counter game, one which United have won comfortably against most such opposition.

Having a defender in your backline who is susceptible to pace/direct play is usually a problem when there's 1 forward who's good at it. It is usually a nightmare if there are 2 or 3 on the pitch. Expect Ronaldo, Rooney (and Park if he's on the pitch) played through by Berbatov, to be going right at Samuel.

Like I said above, Zanetti is the x-factor he can clean up a lot of mistakes when he's on.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

I'd say Cordoba is more prone to make some silly tackles. Samuel is not a hot head at all.

I think our midfield is better than 3 Stankovic's, plus a DM. Muntari and Zanetti both attack well whilst both being sound defensively.

Counter attacks don't necessarily need fast players - just quick passing which we are capable of. We don't intend to play counter - counter because our defence always sits deep and is well protected.

I'm not sure having a defender who is susceptible to pace is such a huge weakness if he plays in a low line and is well protected by his midfield (e.g. when Maldini played against you guys, he didn't have too many problems, or even Puyol). And also, like i said, Cordoba will man mark Rooney very tightly. Samuel will deal with the other forward (most likely Berbatov). Fair enough Samuel could be exposed if he's isolated and run at, and that will most likely happen if we're chasing the game.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

In one season at Madrid he had 37 appearances and tallied 18 yellows and 2 reds.

You mis-understand me. It isn't up to the team that counter attacks to decide if they want to play counter-counter, it is the team that successfully defends a counter attack which makes that decision. If you lot sit deep and then counter us, the result will be that those hard working midfielders are going to be out of place and the result will be Ronaldo, Rooney and Berbs running at defenders which they quite enjoy.

Correct, sitting deep helps negate pace disadvantage, it also gives us more room to play in and makes getting out of your half more difficult. Maldini played next to Nesta, in a team that, no disrespect to Inter, was far more capable defensively. Maldini also got skinned badly in that tie and were it not for an unfortunate stumble he'd be on Quinton Fortune's greatest hits. QF nutmegged him one time and blew right by him another time (but then stumbled). That is beside the point, Milan didn't play as you suggest Inter should. They pressured high up the pitch. They played 451 and had 3 midfielders pressing our midfielders whenever they got on the ball, forcing us to play a disjointed game. They also kept the ball better than Inter will so that was to their advantage. Again, all the signs point to Inter needing to play a high pressure game.

As a base strategy it sounds plausible, but if United have their way in midfield (which will happen if you sit deep imo) then we should see Rooney all over the pitch which will mean he'll either pull Cordoba out of position (something easily enough achieved) or will find pockets of space from time to time in which to do his damage.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

that was at madrid though, playing with a high line and not much protection from his midfield. Totally different case at Inter.

That is unless we actually make something from our counter attacks. We're also well covered in midfield meaning we're less susceptible to counter attacks and tend to be quite conservative in the number of men we commit forward. Didn't think Berbatov liked running at defenders btw? I would've thought he'd be the one to play through balls to the likes of Rooney and Ronaldo.

I don't think that Milan was far more capable defensively. The fullbacks for a start were alot weaker (i'm talking about the match in 2007 btw). I felt Milan sat fairly deep in the first leg, plus we also have 3 midfielders who will press alot. But you're right in that they kept possesion better than we could.

Fair point, and i do realise that Rooney likes to drop deep alot and that gap could be filled by a number of midfielders. I guess we have to rely on Cambiasso to fill these gaps.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

I guess we'll just have to see come game time.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

yeh good discussion, and thanks for the info you gave on your team. Much appreciated.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Any calls or interest in the other games in this round outside of ours?

I'm looking forward to quite a few:

Barca/Lyon

RM/dippers

Juve/Chelsea

mainly. also hoping Rossi does well for Villarreal.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Club Atlético de Madrid (ESP) vs FC Porto (POR)
Olympique Lyonnais (FRA) vs FC Barcelona (ESP)
Arsenal FC (ENG) vs AS Roma (ITA)
FC Internazionale Milano (ITA) vs Manchester United FC (ENG)
Real Madrid CF (ESP) vs Liverpool FC (ENG)
Chelsea FC (ENG) vs Juventus (ITA)
Villarreal CF (ESP) vs Panathinaikos FC (GRE)
Sporting Clube de Portugal (POR) vs FC Bayern München (GER)

These would be my predictions for this round.

I expect Arsenal/Roma, Chelsea/Juve and Lyon/Barca to be interesting ties.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

I have a feeling about Barcelona... I dont know 100% what Lyon's defense looks like, but they have the players in midfield to stifle barca's... just Messi above all...;

But Barca's defense is crap as well. If Abidal is out, its between Puyol and Sylvinho at LB. That leaves their CD horribly vunerable. I have no doubt Benzema, Ederson and Keita can take advantage of them on the counter.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Villareal, Bayern & us to progress to the next round is available at 2/1 on Paddy Power for those interested, I would htink it a fairly safe bet . Money situation's a bit tight on my end though - reckon I'll just throw 20 on it or somesuch.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

I'm predicting an upset and saying Lyon will win.

I wonder what the odds are, would be a decent bet.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

Lyon is +1000 or 10/1 to win both matches according to Bodog.

Paddy Power has them at 3/1 and Barcelona at 2/9 to go through.

 

Re: **** The Official Champions League Round of 16 Draw****

My pathetic attempt to predict the future:

Club Atlético de Madrid (ESP) vs FC Porto (POR)
Olympique Lyonnais (FRA) vs FC Barcelona (ESP)
Arsenal FC (ENG) vs AS Roma (ITA)
FC Internazionale Milano (ITA) vs Manchester United FC (ENG)
Real Madrid CF (ESP) vs Liverpool FC (ENG)
Chelsea FC (ENG) vs Juventus (ITA)
Villarreal CF (ESP) vs Panathinaikos FC (GRE)
Sporting Clube de Portugal (POR) vs FC Bayern München (GER)