coaching during the game

Discussion in 'Coach' started by AABestor, Sep 11, 2007.

  1. AABestor

    AABestor New Member

    Jun 20, 2007
    i've noticed lately that the best teams in my youth league have coaches that say little or nothing during the game. A good example would be the U13 boys comp who are in the premier1 divison took a 6-0 beating and their head coach (also the Doc) just sat like a rock on the bench and took it. I have been guilty of coaching the players during the game, and I would like to be more like the coaches who just shut up and sit down. I have a problem though, when I do become silent my players seem to lose something on the field we just break down if i'm not giving the occasional comment. Is their some key to just sitting?
     
  2. Pathogen

    Pathogen Member

    Jul 19, 2004
    Like you care.
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've coached U6 and U8 for the past two years. Anything other than cheering U6ers on is wasted oxygen. But the U8s definitely needed some directive from the sideline during the games. Sitting completely silent when they need some quick pointers does you and them no good. The delivery is critical, though.

    Now I've got U9 girls and U6. I couldn't imagine sitting silently by with my U9s. About half of the team has never played before and they need tons of direction during the games. But it has to be given during brief stoppages. Hollaring directions while the ball is in play does little. You really struggle to get your voice above the other parents. And you can't expect them to be quiet. Most of them are thrilled that their little girls are actually kicking the ball.

    Having said that, I know that the expections for 13-year-olds is much, much different. I don't expect to be giving the same directions by the end of the season that I'm giving now. Hell, I've got four girls that don't even know how to handle a proper kickoff. But I'd imagine that U13s have that little detail downpat by now.

    My best guess with my limited coaching experience is to determine if you should speak up during the game. I know that when I played, I always felt better when my coach communicated from the sideline. If things we're going bad, I felt their silence was condemnation. But don't ever berate your players. And be careful not to pull a player that just made an incredibly stupid play. That happened to me and I was pissed that I wasn't given the chance to make up for it.
     
  3. BigGuy

    BigGuy Red Card

    Apr 12, 2007
    The more time put in coaching on the practice field the less time is needed trying to coach during the game from the touch line.

    I could never be silent on the touch line because I love to praise good play by the player. Other then that i don;t coach from the touchline. At times I may adjust but I don't actually coach.
     
  4. saabrian

    saabrian Member

    Mar 25, 2002
    Upstate NY
    Club:
    Leicester City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The fact that the players seem to lose something on the field if you're not yelling indicates that they're already been conditioned to respond to orders. It's not something you can change overnight. When you're scrimmaging in practice, try talking less. I know you still have to make your coaching points because it's practice but try to train them to figure things out for themselves and only interrupt if they're making the same error repeatedly.

    I was coaching a U17 game for my club this spring. I usually don't say too much on the sideline and we won like 5-0 so there was even less reason to. I try to wait until the player gets subbed off to explain something to him. Or quite often, I'll coach the players on the bench, which is quite useful. I'll say, "What did Johnny do right on that play? or "What would've been a better option for him?" I particularly focus on the players who play the position in question. It forces them to pay attention to the game with a critical eye.

    The game immediately following it was a U14 game for which I did the flags (our league doesn't have ARs for lower divisions). Unfortunately, the other team's coach was the polar opposite. He was yelling at his kids everytime someone touched the ball. It was getting on MY nerves and I was only in front of him for one game. Anyway, during an injury break, we were chatting. He said my team looked very good and I said thank you. Then he said that he noticed I awful quiet on the sideline during my game. And I'm thinking to myself that it's not that I'm especially quiet but that he's ridiculously loud. But tact prevailed and I said something like, "Well, they work hard during practice." Hoping he'd get the point that you do most of your work in practice. And he said, "Yeah, I know I probably shouldn't yell as much." Then 10 seconds later when the play restarted... you guessed it. No bonus points for guessing which team won the game (and division).
     
  5. Val1

    Val1 Member+

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Soccer is a player's game, whereas baseball (with the walks to the pitcher's mound and signals passed in from the bench and 3rd base coaches who send runners home), football (with every play being called by a coach) and basketball (with numerous timeouts and endless substitutions) are very much coaches' games. Look at professional soccer coaches, there's not much they can do from the sidelines and they know it. So that is ultimately going to be your model.

    Having said that, I talk too much during games as well and my challenge to myself is to try and coach less from the game. I've always been more socractic, as saabrian explained, by trying to engage the kids on the sidelines and making your coaching points when they are by your side, rather than yelling during the game. In my first game over the weekend with my U11 girls, about the only coaching was (other than reminding them who was to take corners and throws) was general team shape, i.e. defenders move up and midfielder awareness of their teammates.
     
  6. ranova

    ranova Member

    Aug 30, 2006
    This topic has already been addressed at length. But it deserves to be addressed again.

    An important part of soccer is making good decisions on the field. The faster the decision making, the faster the player is tactically. Tactical speed is very important to effective play. Players need to learn to think for themself. Making decisions for the players like the coach was playing a video game doesn't help player development in the long run. On top of that, there is no one correct tactic. Thinking that there is only one correct answer to each tactical problem creates artificial limits and discourages creative solutions. Variety is what makes the offense work. For example, if your team scores everytime they bring the ball up the right wing, you can't just bring the ball up the right wing every time. Attacking unsuccessfully from other directions keeps the defense honest and makes the attacks on the right wing work.

    Praise=good. Negative comments=bad. Players don't need to be told that they missed a tackle or wiffed a shot. Even occassions of poor execution can be praised, i.e., as a good idea or a good effort. You want to encourage, not discourage, the player to keep on trying.

    As for technical direction during the game, I prefer to keep it simple. I will communciate the same as I expect the players to communicate on the field. For instance, I will yell "man on" if no one on the field warns the man with the ball. This limits what I say to short phrases and reinforces lessons about on-field communications. Other than that I will stick to traditional coaching decisions like having players switch positions or marking assignments.
     
  7. Twenty26Six

    Twenty26Six Feeling Sheepish...

    Jan 2, 2004
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well put. This is key. And, everybody likes to scream "You shouldn't coach on the sidelines." That mantra is a fallacy. You DO coach from the sidelines. You just don't stand on the sideline and try to make all the players decisions for them.

    I think the problem some coaches have is players who make a considerable amount of mistakes repeatedly. Then, the frustration of wanting to fix everything very quickly incites them to act. What they don't realize is it is only a short-term fix.

    To others: Chances are the original poster inherited a team that was used to receiving orders from the coach during games. Let's not all chastise him because let's face it - it's the normal behavior of most coaches.
     
  8. goyoureddevils

    Dec 17, 2002
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    No chastisement from me... just the same words of caution I have seen posted already. Make sure you're directions are limited to reinforcement of the things you have worked on in practice. I have taken to seeing these as "Coaching Moments" ala USSF licensing books.

    I am quiet for long periods when the boys are playing well (I coach U13 boys at club and ODP, as well as two U23 mens teams), but find myself up off of the bench whenever I see a player who "just doesn't get it". I hate to pull a player off for that, and prefer to let them hear my direction, make the proper adjustment, and stay on the field knowing they have just had a valuable experience.

    That said, I just inherited my U13 team from another coach, and I find myself in constant "conversation" with some of them. I let them make their own decisions on the field, but I have no compunctions about actually making one of them come stand at the edge of the field while play is going on and listen to me explain the corrections to them... it often drives home to them that I consider the lesson so important that I am willing to play down a man for a moment. That definately gets their attention, and I have recently received acclaim for what I have done with my teams from my DOC, and the state board and the president of Indiana Youth Soccer. I am not saying that my way is the "best" or "only" way, but it has produced results.

    As someone far wiser to me said, "Just remember that the game is nothing more than a classroom for playing good soccer later on in their careers."
     
  9. Twenty26Six

    Twenty26Six Feeling Sheepish...

    Jan 2, 2004
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The real evil is not coaching from the sidelines but coaches who give players the answers to the problems they face. I always feel like it isn't about the correct answers, but whether or not the players are allowed to "see" the problems themselves.

    I always have faith that a player can figure out the right answer [regardless of skill] if they understand what the game is questioning of them.

    Which reminds me of the girls I am coaching right now, whose performance multiplies the minute I put a restriction on passing. It's been fairly clear to me that they've been drilled to "spread out and pass" regardless of the situation.
     
  10. KevTheGooner

    KevTheGooner Help that poor man!

    Dec 10, 1999
    THOF
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Andorra
    I like to follow the mantra of "games are won or lost in practice."

    But, unless you have a team with enough players to field full-sided scrimmages at every practice, the games are the best opportunities to teach tactics. Simple short messages are best..."stay wide" "drop back" etc. Instructing them to cross, drop, etc. while the ball is in play is useless, as has been posted here, and especially with younger kids.

    And absolutely stay positive. And also, stay calm. Ranting and raving does not help anyone.

    I also like to use Arsene Wenger's approach of a minute of silence at the beginning of half-time. Let them calm down and focus, then deliver one or two points.
     
  11. BigGuy

    BigGuy Red Card

    Apr 12, 2007
    Question for you guys you have an assistant coach if the choice was missing a practice or missing a game which one would you miss?
     
  12. Twenty26Six

    Twenty26Six Feeling Sheepish...

    Jan 2, 2004
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd miss the game.
     
  13. KevTheGooner

    KevTheGooner Help that poor man!

    Dec 10, 1999
    THOF
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Andorra

    My brain would want to go to practice but my heart would want to go to the game.

    I guess it would depend on who we were playing! ;)
     
  14. BigGuy

    BigGuy Red Card

    Apr 12, 2007
    Bravo so would I. I make a real difference at practice I would have to be dying to miss practice. Plus I always coached more then one team.

    Teams sometimes play at different locations at about the same times. So unless they are home games you can't be every place at once.

    Always did adult teams and youth teams at the same time. I missed a lot of adult games.
     
  15. NHRef

    NHRef Member+

    Apr 7, 2004
    Southern NH
    There's a huge difference between coaching from the sidelines and "correcting" something occassionally. The players, especially as they get older should need less and less from the coach during the game.

    Additionally you can actually cause trouble to the players, assume they have in thier mind what they want to do as they approach a situation, then they hear the coach bark out orders. Well that takes time to process and if it is different from what they where going to do, they will now change tacks and probably do it to late.

    Correct a behaviour pattern that you see, but for the most part the role of the coach during a game is to watch, cheer and take notes for what to work on in the next practice.

    I also look at it this way, if the players are use to hearing your voice, they will eventually just tune it out. Then when you really do have something you need them to hear, they won't hear it.

    My two sons played for a coach last spring who never shutup, constantly saying things that didn't need saying cause they were obvious. One son said it bugged him and made him second guess everything he wanted to do, the other said after the first 10 minutes of the first game he never heard the coach again.
     
  16. Val1

    Val1 Member+

    Arsenal
    Mar 12, 2004
    MD's Eastern Shore
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I know what you mean, but for me, easily I'd choose going to the game. I have way more practices than games. I've been running weekly sessions all spring and summer in my girls league, add that to the 7 team practices so far this fall season, and maybe I've had 32 practices to one game so far in 2007. You can't tell me practices are 30 times more important than games.

    Plus games are more fun, game day (what with 15 of my former players playing at varying age groups) is more fun, and game day is more important to my players and their parents. The game wins out easily in this limited example.
     
  17. goru_no_ura

    goru_no_ura Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 20, 2006
    Miyako of Zipang
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Here are my generic lines, based upon my humble experience...

    - U8 to U12 can use coaching from the sidelines; however, the math works as follow: the more they are used to you yelling ath them, the less they will learn to think and decide by themselves. Ergo, it is important to find balance, and to reduce instruction from the touchline as the players grow.

    - U6 and U7 will not listen anyway, and even if they are listening, they won't understand much of what you say. I once yelled at one of my U7s to push-up, meaning to move forwards, and after a moment of confusion, he stopped, and started to do push-ups in the middle of the game... (it was for me a moment of enlightenment)

    - U13 and above don't need coaching from the touchline. If they do, you're in troubles. ;)

    - Instructions should be SIMPLE and comprehensible. I laugh when I see coaches delivering complicated sermons from their bench. Do they really think the players can compute nuch instruction while running, looking at the ball, the team-mates, the opponents...?? :rolleyes:

    - There is a catch in the truth "Good team's coaches do not coach much from the touchline." Well, if you have a good team, with good players, there's probably not much to say.

    - Also: video helps a lot. Kids learn very quickly thru observation. It's hard to understand some concepts while playing the game, but if players have a chance to observe a video of their games, or pro-games on TV they will learn a lot.
    I was in Italy two summers ago. Kids there are quite amazing for the way they "feel" the game. Of course: they grow up fed "bread and soccer," thus even U6s KNOW EXACTLY what to do on a corner kick, because they ahve seen Cannavaro doing it hundred of times already.
    I still need to remember to my U9s here in the US that somebody should get the posts every time we concede a corner kick...

    - Final point. There is one thing that is worse than yelling coaches.....: yelling parents coaching. :eek:

    PS = BTW, coaching from the touchlines for 40-50 minutes is exhausting, and probably bad for our health.
     
  18. goru_no_ura

    goru_no_ura Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 20, 2006
    Miyako of Zipang
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Depends upon which mom is doing the post-game snacks... ;)
     
  19. BigGuy

    BigGuy Red Card

    Apr 12, 2007
    That sounds like my brother talking. I go to watch his 9 yr old play baseball. My brother is 63 but very fit like me. When I got there you notived that we were the only 2 men at the game. So I said knowing my brother how many of the mothers have you had. He points to 1 mother and says that one. Which meant he had them all except that one.

    She just happened to be the one that came over and sat with us.

    My brothers favorite thing to do since he was a kid. Was making it with all his friends girl friends and wives. He never had any respect for his friends.
     
  20. goru_no_ura

    goru_no_ura Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 20, 2006
    Miyako of Zipang
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    Big Man... but I was talking about the FOOD...:cool:
     
  21. Pathogen

    Pathogen Member

    Jul 19, 2004
    Like you care.
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Today my U9 girls came back from a 3-0 deficit at the half to win the game 4-3. The best part was my daughter getting her first goal of the season on her birthday to tie it. The other coach was this crazy ass that yelled at his girls during the entire game. It was really frustrating. I was mostly quiet except for some quick instructions during stoppages. The other team was setting up a cherry picker inside the 18 the entire game (no offside at this level). That's how they scored two of their goals.

    At halftime, all I told me girls was that I wanted to see more aggression and more shooting. With the exception of a couple of minor adjustments on defense to deal with the cherry-picking, those were the two things that would change the game. The girls really impressed me by driving hard to every loose ball, even overcommitting sometimes. They moved off of the ball well with the exception of a couple of tacticle breakdowns. But for their second game ever as a team, they bounced back tremendously well.

    They have some very tough games coming up against teams that are destroying their opponents. I wish I had two solid weeks before our next game to work on goalkeeping and distribution. But they're learning. The best is seeing them do the things that I coach at practice. I know it's not about me, but I was full of pride today that my girls tried to play soccer and ended up getting the win in the end inspite of the other team violating the spirit of the game.
     
  22. JustSomeDude

    JustSomeDude New Member

    Sep 17, 2006
    My U7 girl played in a pre-season warm-up tournament last weekend against some teams from other clubs. One of the opposing coaches was a raving lunatic like that. He made one of his girls cry, and after the game our girls made lots of unsolicited comments such as "that other coach was mean!" He was screaming at his team a lot, and not just being loud, but in a mean, frustrated, way. What the heck, they are 6-7 years old, and that guy is going to ruin it for his kids at an early age.

    "Mean coach" also instructed his team to shoot at the goal on the kickoff (for some reason the kickoff was a direct free kick, even though all the local leagues play it as an indirect dick), off which they scored a couple of goals. Since the U7/U8 fields are small, their enormous 8-year-old was able to take a crack at the goal on every kickoff, or else take the head off anyone who got in the way of her shot. That seems to violate the spirit of the game, and doesn't really teach anything to anyone.

    Anyway, congrats on your team's performance. That's pretty cool.
     
  23. Twenty26Six

    Twenty26Six Feeling Sheepish...

    Jan 2, 2004
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's just sad that this story could be told by anyone from anywhere in the country.

    Never underestimate the insecurity and idiocy of adults.
     
  24. ALEX408

    ALEX408 Member

    Mar 25, 2007
    SJ
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1.) It also depends on the level that team is playing on. Rec, Comp, Class III, I, etc. Sure Recreational needs yelling, and giving directions. There is nothing wrong with coaches yelling at their players, especially since my dad is a coach and I play on his U16 team and my dad/coach yells alot (he got it from the armed services) and amazingly the team does pull off. There is a big difference between a coach sitting there and a coach coaching. I used to play on my High Schools JV team and the coach would not say a single word and the team did suck. At that level, the team needed a leader and a coach to give the team directions. Yelling coaches do help trust me. They tell you what is right and what is wrong...

    2.) What's wrong with parents side coaching their kids? I play in a Latino dominant league and many parents side coach their kids *the parents do know what they are talking about too* It's good to see the parents care about the game and know what they are talking about. Also, there is a League called Alamaden Youth Soccer League, and they were complete Socialist Nazis when it came to "Side Coaching". One of the rules were "let the coach does his job". And when a parent is caught "Side Coaching", the referee would have to take out a slip and give it to the "Side Coacher" and it would have to be signed by league directors and if they didn't sign it, the parent would not be allowed to be around the next game. Complete bull.

    Thoe are just my 2 cents.
     
  25. ranova

    ranova Member

    Aug 30, 2006
    Regarding point 1, don't confuse the level of player with team level. Lots of competitive players play rec for fun. Every team needs leaders on the field. If the coach is always giving directions, its more difficult to develop leadership on the field. Learning to organize and communicate on the field is part of learning to play soccer. I agree its not yelling that's bad. It depends on what is being yelled.
    Regarding point 2, your league is not typical. In most leagues the parents have never played soccer and still think that they know what they are talking about. Parents who truly understand the game can side coach effectively because they understand how to side coach without undermining what the coach is doing.
     

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