-the antiwar group MoveOn.org is running a full-page advertisement in the New York Times under the headline: "General Petraeus or General Betray us? Cooking the books for the White House." Read the whole thing. These are slimy, disgusting worms who care about nothing but political advantage. An outrage. http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/014/091rhesh.asp
Personally, I think this is great. It shows EXACTLY how the left thinks. It's plain for all to see. It creates the stark contrast people need to completely understand what the other side wants. And let there be no mistake. Moveon.org and its partners in ideology assert, with some justification, that they have captured the Democratic Party and are now its intellectual vanguard. Through the end of 2006, the left was saying "listen to the generals." Now, a general comes in -- a general whom the Senate confirmed 99-0 -- and they simply aren't interested in "listening" to what he has to say. Because what he has to say runs counter to the specific memes they have invested in. I eagerly look forward to the spectacle of these hearings. The true colors of the Democratic Party will be waved for all to see. Let it begin.
The Left prefaces every one of their statements with some variation of "We support the troops but..." then they go on to smear the military. I think it is about time that Americans ask if the Left really does support the military? My assessment is that they do not, and they cloak their hatred of the military with a thinly-veiled level of contempt. Pulling out of Iraq makes no sense, and that message comes from the battalion-level XO's to the President and we can expect that message to be echoed by the report delivered today from General Petraeus. Pulling out makes no sense simply because the surge appears to be working and soldiers have invested far too much here to abandon a work yet not done. Of course Democrats will smear General Petraeus even though they voted for him; his words will parallel Bush's words and Democrat hatred for Bush will win out. Just remember though, when Democrats say they support the troops: Remember: They are lying! If Democrats supported the troops they would accept what their commander says. They won't. Each Democrat will formulate their own condemnation of General Petraeus. Back during Vietnam Democrats used spit to express their frustration; today they use press releases condemning General Petraeus. Same yield.
It's the old "We support the foul, raping murderers of limited intelligence that serve in the Army. We are sympathetic to the fact that the only reason they are in the military is because they couldn't find other jobs or are simply stupid and are then duped and indoctrinated into believing that what they see with their own eyes in Iraq is true, rather than listening to the wise, learned counsel of those of us who have never been there."
So I drove through my old neighborhood/suburb this weekend. For a long time I've been thinking I wanted to move back there once I have kids and they are of school age. But I don't know how many stupid "Support the troops. Bring them home." signs I saw. Have any of these people talked to the troops they say they support by wanting to pull them out of a place that a majority of them seem to think we should indeed be? I have no doubt that there are some troops who think we're wasting our time in Iraq. But, from what I can tell, most seem to think it's vital that we stay there.
No, it's more the old "We actually served in the jungles of Vietnam while Bush was flying jets in Texas and while Dick Cheney, Paul Wolfowitz, Rudy Giuliani, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, John Ashcroft, Fred Thompson, Newt Gingrich, Mitch McConnell, Trent Lott, Mitt Romney, Dennis Hastert, Tom DeLay, Bill Frist, George Allen, Rick Santorum, Jeb Bush, Karl Rove, and John Boehner all had other commitments." Signed, Ted Kennedy, Al Gore, John Kerry, Bob Kerrey, Jack Murtha, Dick Gephart, Tom Daschle, David Bonoir, Charlie Rangel, Max Cleland, Daniel Inouye, Tom Harkin, Jack Reed, Fritz Hollings, Gray Davis, and Wesley Clark--all of whom served.
Let's see: -Teddy got a NATO desk job in Paris -algore was a journalist -Kerry committed treason while still technically enlisted in the military, IIRC -Bonoir never actually made it to Vietnam -and Gephardt was in the MISSOURI AIR NATIONAL ********ING GUARD! Not to mention a few of your list of conservatives would have been too young to serve in Vietnam and peacetime military service in the post-draft era isn't as common as when drafts took place. EDIT: and who the Hell would care what Gray Davis thinks about anything on the national stage, anyway? He couldn't even survive a recall election in a time when pretty much all the conservatives in California had been driven out of the state, who's asking him about Iraq?
Meanwhile, the opinions of John McCain, Thad Cochran, Larry Craig, Michael Enzi, James Inhofe, Pat Roberts, Ted Stevens, and John Warner get to be ignored because they are on the wrong side of the issue.
You left out one important player, the 4-star general that's being called a liar right now and who happens to know more about this war than any others mentioned in this thread.
Ted Kennedy never served a day in the army. Al Gore spent a few days as a reporter, escorted by heavily armed guards. As for the rest of that crap, it's embarassingly lame. Shall I make a list of Clinton administration notables who never served a day - not to mention Clinton himself, who lied and committed fraud to avoid being drafted - and the long list of Republican legislators who DID serve? Is it really necessary to review the fact that when Bush sih=gned up, the unot he enlisted in WAS IN VIETNAM. Kind of an odd way o avoid Southeast Asia, eh? Or do I have to review for you the fact that, after that unit was brought back to the US, he requested a transfer to another unit that WAS going, but got turned down because he didn't have enough hours. One thing's for certain - he never secretly negotiated with the Viet COng to try and arrange a US defeat. Or testified to COngress that the US Army was a bunch of murdering animals like...who was it again? This argument is just so old, and you liberals just continually refuse to acknowledge that it's just garbage, and it's really useless. Oh, and when John Kerry releases his entire Navy file, will you let me know? Thanks.
You know, this post is really disgusting. I feel like vomiting. Honestly. Your pals, your compatriots, the left wing assholes, bought an ad in the NYT calling an American general a traitor. I guess that makes "patriotism" a discussion we can have now? Your response to this disgusting, revolting, outrageous slime attack from moveon is to drag up a bunch of 20 year old thoroughly discredited crapola about George Bush's service in the Vietnam era? What kind of nerve. What gall. You are defending these repugnant people who are leading an attack on a distinguished American soldier FOR POLITICAL PURPOSES and the best god damn argument you can come up with is "John Kerry served in Vietnam"? Can't you see how morally destitute that is? That's all you have to say about this? A bunh of shit about Max ********ing Cleland? Does this stuff not bothe you or are you at last so bereft of any sense of decency or morality that the only reply you can come upm weith is "Well Bush was a coward, neener, neener, neener: You've completely oost any sense of right and rwrong, any sense of values. You've become stiupordave, COngratulations. What the hell is wrong with you? SOmeone who has half a brain falling in line behind this disgraceful, outrageous attack, this sliming political assault on a guy who is worth 50 of your kind any day.You have no decency left. At long last, you've become just another kneejerk liberal "BUSH BUSH BUSH BUSH piece of shit. ******** you. You make me ********ing sick.
I'll bet that the VC was trembling at the sight of Gray Davis. He hid in the weeds when the power got short in California. Davis as Gov. could fit well into the "Sir Robin" jingle from Monty Pythons Holy Grail Movie - "when danger reared its ugly head, Gray Davis turned and bravely fled"
wow. worst post of the year and that says alot. Did you seriously mention David Bonior? Seriously? I don't like the politics forum because of sleazy and deceitful posts like this.
The only flaw in my post is that it was unfair to criticize Bush, as he did serve. Everything else was fair, and it only proved my point about how deceitful and dishonest your side of the aisle is. YOU made the claim that Democrats/the left disrespects the troops. YOU subscribe to that ridiculous myth. And lo and behold, YOU ALL immediately started undermining the service of the people I listed. Why? Because it contradicts your cozy little myth. Vomit all you want. Both Democrats and Republicans have served this country with honor, and both Democrats and Republicans have, at various times, avoided service. You're only angry because you know I'm right.
I just want to quote this original post again: My half-brother retires from the Navy this autumn after a 20+ career as a serviceman and reserve. Another half-brother, who was a burnout who struggled with drug and alcohol addiction when he was younger, almost enlisted but opted not to. Everyone in the family wishes that he had. My brother in law was in the Army. The best students I had as a teacher had all spent time in either the Army or Navy. So seriously, screw you for telling me how I feel about people in the military. Screw you for telling me that I feel contempt for people I love and respect. You don't have the foggiest ********ing idea how I or any other Democrat feels. I think I'm done with your forum for a while.
Bo, in all fairness here, you listed Senators that served in the military as if they should not be questioned, yet you (your party) tries to discredit Petraeus. Has he not earned his honors also??? Does his opinion not count just because he gives a favorable account in Iraq? I do think he’s a little more learned on tactical warfare than these bozo’s on Capitol Hill.
My only reason for listing those Senators and others was out of revulsion at the continued accusation that Democrats condescend to the troops. As far as Petraeus's testimony goes, I believe that he deserves to be heard, but I believe with equal passion that we're nuts if we don't listen to assessments of the war skeptically and critically. We learned our lesson after Powell's infamous "mobile weapons lab" testimony before the UN. Powell had earned his honors, too, yet his presentation turned out to have been complete BS.
You seem to believe the MSM more than anyone else. They certainly have no credibility. How do we know those labs weren't moved (hence the name "mobile")? Didn't we recently find stored chemical weapons in NYC from Saddam's regime?
We later learned that Chalabi made them up. In fact, the very idea of mobile labs was proposed to Chalabi to see whether he would take the bait and claim they existed, and sure enough, he did. There is *nobody* who still believes that those things actually existed. It's worth noting that Powell refused to present all of the "evidence" supplied to him by the White House at that infamous UN presentation. It was later revealed--I'm not making this up--that he called the so-called evidence "bullshit" and reacted quite angrily to the suggestion that he present it. I haven't heard anything re: chemical weapons in NYC.