why mls is better than other leagues

Discussion in 'MLS: General' started by kronz21, Apr 28, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. ECUNCHATER

    ECUNCHATER Member

    Sep 30, 1999
    I agree! That does make it cool. I like how they have some European style names, Latino style names, and American style names.
     
  2. Pike

    Pike Member

    Arsenal | Hertha Berlin | Brest 29
    United States
    Jun 3, 2000
    New Orleans Born | Shanghai
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You seem to misunderstood. There were hundreds of established clubs. The clubs were organized among regional leagues.

    The teams that didn't complete their season among the professional teams didn't disappear, they just left the league.

    It had more to do with money! Traveling was very expensive. Minor leagues, to this day, are still divided regionally.

    NOTE: I used "professional" in quotes only because the term professional would be misleading. There were a few "amatuer" teams far better than their "professional" counterparts, like Rockford (IL). Going professional was very controversial. Many believed that the purity of the game would be lost.

    I asume you are referring to Excelsior of Chicago. Excelsior was a premier club of "base ball." They were comparable to the better financed clubs of New York. Unfortunnately, they folded. The Chicago base ball club was established to replace Excelsior. I can't think of another club that started from "scratch," but I wouldn't consider the Chicago Base ball club as one of them. The club replaced a vacuum.


    I used "professional" in quotes only because the term professional would be misleading. There were a few "amateur" teams far better than their "professional" counterparts, like Rockford (IL). Going professional was very controversial. Many believed that the purity of the game would be lost.

    Yes, not "huge" leagues, but a LOT of smaller regional leagues. It was about credibility either,... they were already going against the grain by establishing a "professional" league. I also read nothing that there was any concerns about survival. The main clubs were almost exclusively based on the Northeast (except Cincinnati & Chicago).

    So promotion and relegation wasn;t an issue, because one, it was all an exclusive big boys club, and two, many teams rsented the push to professionalism.
     
  3. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    by survival and credibility I meant league survival and credibility. A league where about one team in 3 folds every year doesn't present a very good image.

    I can't claim to exactly be an expert on the subject, but the baseball sporting landscape back them, at the true professional level at least, seems curiously reminscent of the NASL during its dying days.

    No matter how many clubs existed, the pro leagues were not finding they had more viable applicants than member places - in fact the exact opposite, hence the need to kick out those not up to scratch.
     
  4. DCUdiplomat96

    DCUdiplomat96 Member

    Mar 19, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    i totally agree to your comments with major league soccer can have pro reg in a few years but no single table please !!!!
     
  5. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Christ man. Read the thread.

    No MLS cannot have promotion/relegation in a few years. Single table is almost into effect now if you scroll around to the table that was created by well I forgot who made it but it is useful.

    Maybe one more exclamatoin point and I would have agreed. Other than that, you are agreeing with the worst of all people, seeing how he was run out of here. Haven't heard from him in days.
     
  6. kronz21

    kronz21 Member

    Mar 17, 2006
    cleveland
    1st paragraph

    no shit,
    2ndly you make it worse so it gets better next year, if your already out of the playoffs you might as well trade for prospects and draft pics so you can have a decent team next year, it makes perfect sense. i bet you thought your little comment about folding was cute well, i call your bluff all in!!




    your 2nd paragraph

    i could say more without sayng its hard to explain, i just thought i already had my point accross. every game does start 0-0 how does that have to do with what iam saying? i never said to fold during a game, i said if your already out of it during the season like i seid above me.

    3rd paragraph

    your just pissed,pointless paragraph :cool:

    4th paragraph

    really so the commisinor of baseball doesnt really own mlb? the owners of each team does? maybe iam wrong, hey you have to be right some time right? lmao

    5th paragraph

    you draft a player just to trade him so you get his trade value and maybe can get a weaness filled. you relize not every foreign player we get is euro really hope you relize that.

    6th paragraph
    l
    yeah and nfl europe is world wide like soccer:D. how many people in europe actually care about nfl europe? exactly! also how that england football(american) team doing?

    yes the nba plays games around the world, baketball is more world wide than the other top 3 sports in the usa but in how many countries is it the top 3 sport? or top 5?

    baseball is played throughtout the world like most sports are but the question is it a top 3 or 5 sport in many courtries? no

    soccer is the main sport in just about every coutry which gives an advantage to soccer leagues

    no shit it was sarcasm and i know that the sports are played in other counries but how big are they there? not so big

    your closing

    wow flintstone vitamins, you relize how unhealthy those things are? you probably took them as a kid thats why your so messed up.....

    when i said your in hole, i basically said it has to get worse before it can get better, i know you were just trying to crack a joke but to be logical its not a very good one.



    next time you think your going to rip me a new one(remember it didnt work), open up a cold one, sit back and remember what happened the first time.....:D
     
  7. Wizardscharter

    Wizardscharter New Member

    Jul 25, 2001
    Blue Springs, MO
    Back to the point, you know, before the Peacocks had to show their delapidated plumage for no one in particular...

    The best thing about MLS is the complete and total lack of that evil bane of soccer, relegation. Nothing in a business model makes less sense, promotes the concept of "rich get richer", or ruins a competitive structure like relegation.

    The only good aspect of relegation, the only one, is that it creates a better Champions league. Unfortunatly the cost of having a better CL is now every domestic league sucks as a competition. You don't like one of the top 2 contenders (or sometimes just 1)? Too bad, here's your 3 rounds of the UEFA Cup every 6th year or so.

    Better to divide out the 16-24 "best" teams and let them play their own full year CL. Then just include those teams in domestic Cups to satisfy the traditionalists.
     
  8. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    how does relegating Watford make Man Utd richer ? (as opposed to having exactly the same system of money distribution, but not relegating them)

    how does not relegating Watford make them more competitive than the team that replaces them? (keeping the same system of money distribution and remembering you can't give them draft picks as there's nowhere to draft from)
     
  9. F0nSY_Dynamo

    F0nSY_Dynamo New Member

    Apr 11, 2007
    Robertson Stadium
    The MLS is not better than europe leagues...Did you see a europe match?
     
  10. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Baseball is bigger than soccer in the Dominican just for an example but there are many others. You didn't make one point. If anyone can understand that gibberish I'd be surprised. You haven't gotten anything across except you don't know shit. You cannot support not one thing you say. "It's hard to explain but I could say more" doesn't cut it. And I don't get pissed at computer screens. Especially not enough to make threats.

    And son, it went over your head, much like everything else. Sorry you wouldn't understand. Continue to look worse at my expense. You were doing yourself a favor by not posting. Pretend like you are Ellinger and this thread is RSL. You've made your mark, but with every touch the shit spreads.
     
  11. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Good points. This increased seperation between wealthy and poor clubs wouldn't happen in the American system. And isn't the G14 trying to do exactly what you suggest?
     
  12. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd fancy to argue that the thread was meant to mean in structural aspects of a league, not just the play on the field. However, this thread had turned into an devil child of BS.
     
  13. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Man U doesn't get richer in the sense of getting money because of Watford being relegated. Just in the sense that the gap widens because Watford doesn't get the TV revenue that will go to the team coming up.
     
  14. leg_breaker

    leg_breaker Member

    Dec 23, 2005
    If it wasn't for promotion/relegation, Man United wouldn't be in the Premiership to start with. That's something to put in your pipe. In fact Liverpool FC wouldn't be there either.
     
  15. Bob Morocco

    Bob Morocco Member+

    Aug 11, 2003
    Billings, MT
    But what if there was contraction and expansion and confrences and divisions? Or did I just blow your mind?
     
  16. URS on the Warpath redded

    Apr 21, 2007
    Wounded Knee
    If Spartacus would have had a Piper Cub...
     
  17. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    must spread rep before.....
     
  18. omnivorewyo

    omnivorewyo New Member

    May 4, 2007
    Club:
    --other--
    If Baseball was structured more like soccer in Europe, it would be a lot more interesting than it is right now. If there were all sorts of cup tournaments throughout the year to watch, if it wasn't ALL about just seeing your team ONLY play for one title each year, it would be a lot more fun.

    Because let's face it, only one team wins each year. And the leagues are rigged in the US to almost make it certain that the teams who are favored win each year.

    Upsets in Europe are more exciting, because they are against all odds. And because you have -- among the smaller clubs -- leagues full of Green Bays capturing the hearts of the locals and rallying them together to a common cause.

    That's FAR more interesting than leagues that have moved teams simply because their stadiums weren't big enough, that have no loyalty to their markets at all and that are organized by billionaire gestapos intent on doing nothing more than squeezing the last red cent out of as many people as possible. Or of course, catering to the rich by creating luxury suites, etc.

    The games are a lot less interesting than they used to be and college sports are just faux professional sports with athletes who don't get paid.

    So, let's face it. MLS isn't close to soccer in Europe. It's not the gold standard and it never will be. Because MLS teams are owned by the league itself essentially and everyone knows that. There isn't a sense of urgency associated with much of anything in that league, because there isn't anything organic about the way players are acquired or even how they're traded.

    The whole setup is a joke, to a degree.
     
  19. URS on the Warpath redded

    Apr 21, 2007
    Wounded Knee
    Welcome to BigSoccer, and thanks for joining. Like we needed another sheep in pasture.
     
  20. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    exactly

    so is the problem about pro/rel or about TV money distribution?

    You get problems with promoted clubs "bridging the gap", but that's much more widespread in England than anywhere else in the world. Because people in the US tend to know the premiership more than other leagues, it seems to be regarded as the norm.

    It was never a problem before TV money went nuts, and isn't a problem in any other division of the league. Likewise you never had a big 4 or similar perpetually at the top. Indeed the "big 5" in the mid 80s were regarded as Liverpool, Everton, Man Utd, Arsenal and Spurs, and the last three of those hadn't won a title for 15-25 years. Two (Spurs and Man Utd) had been relegated in the last decade.

    Pro/rel is fine if you have a system to support it, and England has a stronger professional club base than anywhere in the world, but TV money has become the ultimate poisoned chalice for the professional game here.

    It is a problem but I can't see any way the top clubs are going to give up their advantages for a more competitive league. Glazer might think revenue sharing in great in the NFL, but there's no way in the world he'll be pressing the premiership to introduce similar practices in England. He knows he'll make far more money without them. The premiership was formed with greed as its founding principal (so the top clubs wouldn't have to share revenue with the 72 other pro clubs) and as long as chairmen keep seeing their revenues rising, they won't see there's a problem.
     
  21. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    exactly. Gald we are starting to boil this down simply. What exaclty do mean bridge the gap? Between all teams are just those who seem to constantly go back and forth between leagues?

    I am sure that with a EUFA set up that revenue sharing won't come to pass. The top teams will want to out do other leagues' top teams even if there wasn't a CL but the old EC. American (and other foriegn investors) are not buying into the EPL to implement revenue sharing. Gillete, Learner and Glazer may have been attracted to the EPL model and clubs becuase of a lack thereof. More money for them to be made knowing they aren't competing against the Fulham's and Watford's but that they are preparing for CL action/competition.
     
  22. RichardL

    RichardL BigSoccer Supporter

    May 2, 2001
    Berkshire
    Club:
    Reading FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    We used to have revenue sharing, to a degree. TV money was shared equally (and in any case was just a small part of the clubs' income) and something in the region of 25% of the home crowd receipts at every game were given to the away team. There was no champions league money. European games were only shown live if it was the final and English team was there - certainly no pot of gold.

    You also had a different mindset that allowed Man Utd, who had the biggest crowds even back then, to say that because their crowds were high, they could charge lower admission prices than other clubs.

    You also had the pre-Bosman transfer rules, which meant that top clubs would have to pay a transfer fee even if a player was out of contract (unless the player wasn't offered an improved contract, in which case he was a free transfer).

    Bit by bit, over a decade or so, all the things which stopped the larger teams from running away got dismantled.
     
  23. F0nSY_Dynamo

    F0nSY_Dynamo New Member

    Apr 11, 2007
    Robertson Stadium

    yes,i know...I love the MLS but i want say that the MLS is not better than the europe leagues.I like the superdraft and i like the salary cap too They are good ideas for this league.


    Forever Orange!!!
     
  24. dredgfan

    dredgfan Member+

    MLS
    Nov 5, 2004
    Denver or NOLA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Boy do I love the MLS too. I'm trying my best here.

    Why is MLS not better than the European leagues? (Don't anwser this question, really just specify which Euro Leagues. This question has gotten enough started.)

    The superdraft is a nice idea. As we've seen with the NFL Draft (which might go primetime). It's a nice way of maintaining parity, creating interest, and introducing players to the league's fan bases. The salary cap will become a challenged entity but not so much in disolving it, just raising it, as other threads are discussing.

    Trying to wrap it up while looking at the initial thread topic (dear lord):

    MLS is better than other leagues when trying to attract the ESPN crowd. It structure must be so, or we'd just call it the USL. Euro leagues for those who really watch the sport and want to see Euro action. I'm just a soccer fan. I like all the structures because it provide a variance. I don't see why German, French, Nigerian, Japanese, Peruvian, Mexican, and American (TFC fukc off:p ) soccer should all be just oh so similar. I appreciate what MLS is and will believe its better than other leagues for one reason. I can go watch it. That's it. I can build some excitement with who ever is at the game instead of building excitement with a cat and some pizza rolls. I can smell the grass, see the girls, and hear the tackles. Granted top teams in Europe might steamroll an MLS team if both were in form. But I doubt it. The scoreline would be respectable in most cases. Might not be the prettiest of games but that's what contrast styles are for. Why should league structure be any different? Its all a global competition now. And I can only see soccer two ways: television or personally. Well I like my soccer, personally. And I can see MLS.
    The best league is your league.
    And mine's the MLS.










    Comments?
     
  25. frenil

    frenil Member

    Mar 11, 2004
    Lund
    I'm not sure, but this might be a bit off topic.

    The Bosman rule is probably the worst thing to have happened to european soccer in the past couple of decades. I don't necessarily believe that the principles on which the rule is based on are wrong, but the inevitable consequences were rather unfortunate.
     

Share This Page