Article: Interesting comparison between US and European workers

I agree. For many, "quality of life" means having done what it takes to acquire the means to contract for a new kitchen. For others, it means remembering the kitchen as one of the places where the family spent alot of time.

We've certainly constructed much of American society on the former model, the psychosis of regular refinancing be damned. The more important issue is, how many stakeholders were at the table when we all agreed that this was the way in which we wanted to construct America? Do we even know when that meeting was, or who was in it?

Who decided that living for work (for the most part) would be the American mode and modus? Because I KNOW I missed that meeting.

 

If you do now, or have ever owned even one single share of stock in a publicly traded company, then YOU decided this whether you wanna admit to it or not.

 

Ah yes, I love this. Americans defined wholly as consumers, and never as citizens. We "vote with our wallet," and participating in a decision-making process is buying stock. Its the construction of who we are in the States best reflected in the first PSAs the City and State of New York produced in the post-9/11 days...

Rudy and Pataki came on the air and didn't say "Now you know that old couple in your building, have you checked on them?" They didn't say that "Now is the time to demonstrate, in any way you can, what volunterrism means, and we hope that you can come up with ways for us to help each other that we haven't thought of yet, and hopefully we can carry some of these organizations in to the future..." No, nothing like that at all.

No, because you are fundamentally conceived of, and appreciated as, consumers, and not citizens, the first thing these two "leaders" bothered to ask you to do after September 11th?

"Get out there and shop; go to a show." SPEND MONEY!

 

Great post Matt. Best I've read in a while. Who is the manufacturer? I've worked with a few of the automotive companies.

The first question I have to ask is, Are the guys you are working with getting paid by the hour or salary? If it's by the hour then I suspect that they are justifying their charges. Second, are they contract employees or permanent? I suspect you are working with a bunch of contract, hourly people who need to push their resumes and justify their hours charged. The US IT industry is full of people like that.

I hated that kind of hourly BS and resume pushing BS by contract workers and got out of the construction business. They were an emotional drain on me.

.I've worked with the French a lot, especially for Michelin, and they continually complain about how hard we work. They don’t like to get up early. We are not like the French.

The meetings suck. Big time. In my previous company we had a phrase for handling that situation. Someone with some seniority would point around the table and ask, "How much money are we spending to sit here?" We also kept our meetings on time. The phrase when the last person walked in was "Dollar waiting on a dime." Now I work for a larger company and the meetings are ridiculous. I just avoid them. Some take being invited to a meeting like being invited to a party. The more they go, the more popular they are. It's stupid really.

The scheduling and milestone-ing is just a tool for the managers to be able to point fingers when the task gets put back. The trick to handling that is to be very clear about what tasks your job is dependent on. Then point the finger at others when they fall behind. Make it clear that it's not your fault because, believe me, someone else will be pointing at you. Pointing a finger is the easiest way to get out of doing work.

 

See, but the idea is an employee who isn't miserable, an employee who isn't roughing it and constantly trying to shake off an illness, an employee who takes enough time from work to recharge, be it going to their kids' soccer games or spending 3 weeks in the Mediterranean, an employee who has enough time to pursue interests outside of work are all going to be more productive than otherwise.

Plus, comfortable work environment and culture attract the best talent, and employees who aren't disgruntled generally won't steal from you, or god forbid, shoot the mother********ing place up - that's terrible for workplace morale.

Good employers understand that time spent not working can be just as beneficial to the bottom line as the time the employees are clocked in. All work and no play make Jack a very dull, and more importantly, very unproductive boy.

 

I think that the societal differences between the US and europe are pretty obvious.

we do work more. we get less time off.

americans seem to value money and objects more than time spent with friends or family.

i notice this very clearly everytime im in europe. take what i noticed while sitting at a square for a few hours in spain. by 2.30 or so you notice mothers with thier children who they have picked up from school. by 3 or 3.30 theyre joined by thier fathers/husbands. for the next few hours you can see the parents sitting and talking and watching thier kids play soccer in the square or whatever.

i have NEVER, EVER seen this type of environment in the states, and i feel that is unfortunate.


what sort of forumla did the guy throw the GDP per capita rates through... according to the CIA:

1 Luxembourg $ 55,100 2003 est.
2 United States $ 37,800 2003 est.
3 Norway $ 37,700 2003 est.



http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html

 

Jesus ...

I get 25 days paid holiday plus about 8 days in national holidays. That's 32. Or, in working week terms, about seven week's holiday a year. I get up to two weeks' sick leave on full pay (only if signed off as necessary by a doctor after 3 days) and up to six months on half pay, dependant on condition.

And according to the figures posted earlier in this thread, I get considerably more money than the average in the US too. Which I realise is less significant, given that it is an average, but still ... in the particular case of me, it sucks to be you.

 

Toyota.

Salary. They're all pretty senior guys, given that they are being sent over to Europe for anything up to 10 days at a time.

I don't know, but suspect a bit of both.

You are in the way in which you continually tell people how hard you work. Much like the French, it has almost become a metric.

Aye. Ironically enough, minutes after I posted that post I had to join a conference call with the guys in LA ... it went on for 1 hour, 25 minutes and I reckon about 8 of those minutes were of any relevance to me. The rest was a technical planning discussion that could have been conducted offline between the two people (from eight) that were actually having the discussion.

I'm finding it's more a case of big fuss to begin with, little actual action to follow up on. Hence my noise/signal metaphor. An awful amount of effort goes into agreeing these (usually tight) deadlines and very little apparent effort goes into actually delivering on them. Me, I get my work done on time unless I have a good reason not to. I just don't like to have things hanging over me, it spoils my eons of leisure time that my idle, decadent European lifestyle affords me.

 

Tell me about it. I don't take most of my days, simply because I wouldn't feel comfortable with just 5 days "in the bank". When the end of the year comes up, I usually sell excess days back to the company because a) I can only roll over something like 20 hours to the next year, and b) my wife works assorted hourly part-time jobs (because she can't get a "real" job in this ************ economy) and we can't afford the lost wages if she took a week off to go on a holiday. Which would likely consist of a car trip to Toronto or something similarly uninspiring, 'cause we are practically living paycheck-to-paycheck.

Believe it or not, what I've got is pretty standard.

So do I. Doesn't feel like it tho. And yes, it sucks to be me, but at least it's a culture issue over here - I'm not alone.

 

For a seriously divergent take on this, check out Jeremy Rifkin's book "The European Dream: How Europe's Vision of the Future is Quietly Eclipsing the American Dream," or listen, here.

Rifkin argues that the American sink-or-swim mentality just doesn't stack up against European staples like universal health care and month-long summer vacations. And while America is ever more determined to protect its national interests through military force, the Europeans are putting cooperation ahead of conflict.

For me, my experience living in both places submits this:

Living in Europe begins with the institutions starting off with acknowledging that you are a human with inherent value. There's nothing to fail. You have value, period, and you move only forward from there.

Living in America begins wit hthe institutions starting off with submitting that you are potentially valuable, and that value, that humanity, must be proved. Failure to do so, maily by an economic measure, means a less than fully human American experience.

Europe is no utopia. But the difference in starting points is both instructive and predictive.

 

Well children, I worked in the shipyards of Liverpool (When they had them) as a 15 years old for a 49 hour work week. 9 hour days and 4 hours Sat morning. One of my friends had a brother who lived in the States and was always talking of his 36 hour week and holidays.
So, here I am. Listening to how England works less hours and gets more benefits. While I’m self employed, working for the toughest boss ever! I had a vacation a few years back but had to play catch up on return. And no way can I go ‘sick’

The wheel turns.

 

God, that SUCKS!!!

 

another great thing they do in switzerland and parts of germany (maybe other places) is everybody comes home from work or school to have lunch together on weekdays - the american family could really benefit from a custom like that... but of course, it would NEVER happen

 

Hell, FIFA bought into the Sonnenberg Restaurant because they figured, hey, we all spend three hour lunches here everyday, why not write it off?

 

Why have I never heard this line before this?

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1290021,00.html

Turn to the Guardian's university clearing pages and there are many vacancies for a subject that was once hugely popular. Until recently, American studies departments sprang up everywhere. But no longer.
Now 28 universities still have American studies places unfilled, and they include many at well-regarded institutions - Essex, Keele, Kent and Swansea among them. Due to lack of demand, five universities have closed American studies departments while others have cut staff. Keele, traditionally the top-ranking American studies department, with a maximum, grade five ranking for research for the past few years, has had to fire half its staff. Professor Ian Bell at Keele says: "Students don't want to be branded by doing American studies. They still want to do American modules as part of English or history but, after Bush, they shy away from being labelled as pro-American - not after the obscenity of Iraq..."

 

I really feel sorry for those who are simply born in the wrong country and spend their life longing for the green grass on the other side...

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20040403/DADS03
Check out the graph on page 2 -
http://www.soci.ucalgary.ca/fypp/Brief-3-parental-time-final.pdf

 

I deal with American companies for work and I am amazed to see them sending me emails at 4 in the morning (their time), scheduling conference calls at 7 in the morning etc. It's just not healthy. That said, they in turn are amazed at my 36-hour working week (which is common practise in Holland).

 

It's certainly not healthy, but that is an expected part of doing business.

 

I really cannot recommend Jeremy Rifkin's book enough. This is a guy who I don't agree with in terms of everything he says, but who is living the two continents working life, helped France experiment with the maximum 35 hour workweek, and who, to me, gets it. His book is called "The European Dream," and it is a challenge to the committed on BOTH sides of the Atlantic.

Or, listen here.

 

Or, listen here (a different interview, more challenging to Rifkin by the host I think...)

 

ORRRR....here, a different interview, off of KQED...