Youngsters in MLS (1997 or later)

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by Mario Balotelli, Mar 30, 2016.

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  1. barvsenal

    barvsenal Member

    Apr 19, 2016
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    #5351 barvsenal, Mar 29, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2018
    Christ, why did he go to that camp? Now it’s back to USL for him...


    Golden opportunity this month to get minutes given that Barco was out. He got a total of... 14.


    He’s being entirely mismanaged by the club.
     
  2. punintended_13

    punintended_13 Member+

    Atlanta United
    Mar 22, 2010
    Atlanta, GA
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    What? Him getting sick is somehow him being mismanaged? Look at the starting line-ups for the first 3 games, who should he have started over? Who on those teams is he better than?

    He's going to get more of a chance as the season goes on but using him getting sick as a platform to say he's being mismanaged is pretty ridiculous.
     
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  3. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I think he's better than all their players.
     
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  4. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Gressel..... just because Atlanta has won 2 games with him at right back doesn't mean Carleton wouldn't have done the same. Would Bvb or schalke start Gressel over Carleton? No. And I guarantee ATL moves back to a LW AM RW setup when Barco returns.
     
  5. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Gressel was MLS ROY. If he had American citizenship, most would be talking about a Camp Cupcake type call up. He's one of the most versatile players in MLS.

    And I'm a big Carleton fan.
     
  6. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That article on Pomykal from the previous page is infuriating... re-posted in light of the tweets in the next comment:

    What is FC Dallas doing with Paxton Pomykal? - Big D Soccer

    For years the narrative in the league was that Dallas had far and away the best academy. FCD was nestled in the hotbed of youth soccer that is North Texas, and not only did they have access to this talent, but they weren’t afraid to give them their shot. Now, the rest of the league has caught up. NY Red Bulls regularly rank first in minutes given to Homegrowns, Real Salt Lake boasts plenty of youth talent, and Sporting Kansas City have invested in their youth facilities and opened a state-of-the-art training facility. The homegrown gimmick isn’t enough to separate Dallas from the rest of the pack anymore. Dallas is not the only team that gives young players minutes and they aren’t the only team with good youth facilities. They must be incredibly careful that they do not take their access to youth talent for granted.

    After the loss of Weston McKennie to Germany, and now Shaft Brewer to LAFC, the front office has to realize that the opportunity to potentially play for the first team isn’t enough to keep players around anymore. These guys want minutes and if Dallas isn’t their best route to finding them anymore, then they’ll go the USL route like Devin Vega, bounce to Europe (if they’re unsigned and 18), or go college on a scholarship. Reggie Cannon turned down a contract out of high school to attend UCLA for a semester, then returned to FCD when he felt he was ready. Cannon’s choice shows that players are priortizing their education and personal development rather than rushing to sign a professional contract. Dallas are still in the driver’s seat when it comes to negotiating with youth talent, but improved choice for youth players is putting pressure on FCD to treat their homegrowns better, starting with Paxton Pomykal.

    ...

    Last week Paxton did not put a foot wrong.

    975907317211369472 is not a valid tweet id


    He received praise from around the league and left an impression on anyone that watched the game. But he was set to miss last week’s game against Portland with U20 national team duty. Instead of losing momentum with FC Dallas, either Paxton or FCD made the decision that he would not be attending the U20 camp.

    ...

    If it was Paxton’s decision, then he was misled about his involvement in the team and missed out on a chance with his national team because of it. If it was Dallas’ decision, they took the choice out of Paxton’s hands and made an ethical farce by not playing Paxton. Yes, the goal of FC Dallas is to win games, not develop young players, but because a player missed out on minutes to be in the 18 because there was an insinuation that he would play, then you are beyond strongly encouraged to play that player.

    While Paxton did feature in the 18 for Dallas against Portland, he never came on. Pomykal sat on the bench while Dallas replaced both the number 10 and left winger.

    So now, Dallas’ best youth prospect has missed out on participating with his national team, missed out on participating with his professional team, and according to Carter Baum, will be playing in Dallas Cup this week. He’s right back to where he started last year.
     
  7. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    979572171684110336 is not a valid tweet id


    979601809907085312 is not a valid tweet id
     
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  8. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    I love MLS but if I have an EU Passport, I'm going to Europe. MLS has some issues but they play American teens more than any league on the planet.
     
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  9. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    #5359 Clint Eastwood, Mar 30, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2018
    These comments like the one from Zack Goldman miss the point.
    The presence of an FCDII isn't going to prevent players like McKennie, Dunning, Hyndman, etc. from going to Europe. Let's see................Feyenoord, Schalke..........or FCDII. What a choice?! Hmmmmmmmmmmm.

    By the way, this is exactly what happens in Europe with a great number of kids from Belgium, Croatia, Turkey, etc. The elite go to the big clubs when they're 16.
    I don't know why this is such a big deal. This is the way its supposed to go.
    Also, nobody actually knew who the hell Jamie Dunning was before Parchman's tweet. Now its a big deal that he's left?

    By the way...............are people really that upset that Paxton played 90 against Arsenal U19s at the Dallas Cup in the Cotton Bowl instead of Portland? Really? We're really worked up about that? I'd argue 90 against Arsenal U19s is just as good as a sub appearance against 10-man Portland.

    Are people really that upset that Paxton played 90 against Arsenal U19s instead of staying with the u20s to play against an Atletico Madrid youth team? Really? That difference really has people worked up?

    I understand that on these boards people REALLY ache and yearn to be pissed off about something, but these issues sometimes leave me bewildered.
     
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  10. Sup Bro

    Sup Bro Member+

    Oct 26, 2012
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    For an academy like Dallas’, I think one of the main functions for a USL would be a backdoor to the no training compensation rule.

    If they can get enough enough young academy guys under contract, it’s fine if they want to go overseas, but FCD would at least get compensated. Sure it won’t be easy to convince all these 15, 16, 17 year olds to sign a USL deal, but with the number of prospects with legit pro potential on their books they could snag a few.

    That’s not to mention the benefit of developing future first team players on a club owned USL team.
     
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  11. Baysider

    Baysider Member+

    Jul 16, 2004
    Santa Monica
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    This seems right, but I wonder how how much value it would bring. There was an interview with an agent who was focused on placing players in Europe and one of the things he emphasized is that American players were becoming popular precisely because they could be transferred on a free with no training compensation.
     
  12. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Yet Carleton is better than Gressel .The point is if you have a top prospect you don't make him wait until freaking gressel gets injured or something because he's damn sure not leaving MLS soon. You make room for him.
     
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  13. kba4life1

    kba4life1 Member+

    Jul 14, 2010
    Irvine, CA
    Yeah, no one knew who Dunning was, but, this is indicative of the issue all MLS teams face: the pathway to first team playing time for academy players. The lack of said pathway is leading to a relative exodus of MLS academy players for free to Europe.

    Presumably, financials is the biggest reason FCD hasn’t started a USL team. It’s very easy for me to spend the Hunt’s money, but how much are they spending on the hall of fame museum? $40 million? How many people are actually going to pay to visit that? That same money, if allocated to a USL team, would last for 5-10 years potentially.

    On the aspect of Croatian, Dutch etc players getting raided at 16, yes, that certainly happens. But the domestic club teams get a fee for the trouble. I know solidarity and child labor laws come into play here for the US, but it’s not as though club teams in Europe are losing academy players on a free with regularity, that is a problem that is uniquely MLS’s.
     
  14. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Can everyone agree that Gressel, Almiron, Vilalba, Martinez aren't good players? I'll leave Barco out of the conversation because he's kind of in a similar situation to Carleton. We can extend it to their USMNT players as well, Nagbe and Guzan, they get a lot of criticism from US fans. No one would claim they are good players on the world stage.

    If these players were playing in the top leagues in Europe, how would they do? Except for Almiron and Guzan at his best, I think the answer is that they all wouldn't be good enough, and even then, I don't think Almiron (who hasn't went to Europe yet to prove himself) or Guzan (who proved himself in Europe but for a short amount of time) are world beaters over in Europe.

    Unless you expect Carleton to be a flop and not make it to the same extent that Pulisic, McKennie, etc are doing now, why wouldn't he be better than these players? Nowhere in the world (except maybe this country) does a young player have to prove himself as better than players who have had much lengthier careers to get minutes. How do we know how Carleton stands in comparison to these players if he doesn't play?
     
  15. Balerion

    Balerion Member+

    Aug 5, 2006
    Roslindale, MA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I think you're going to see Almiron and Martinez in "top European leagues" soon enough. Martinez has scored back-to-back hat tricks for Pete's sake. I think those two are awfully good. Villalba is fine. Good but not spectacular. Same as Asad.

    The truth is that you can have Almiron, Martinez, etc. as key contributors for Atlanta with Carleton still getting significant minutes. It's not an either/or situation.

    Same for Durkin, Pomykal and others.....................
     
  17. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I agree about Almiron, but Martinez played a few seasons in Serie A, and wasn't that good. Is he any better than an Altidore?

    My point here is that these players are good for MLS, but so are Bradley or Altidore. If we want youngsters to be better than Bradley and Altidore are with the NT, we should want the same at the club level. Lets not put "good MLS'ers" on this pedestal because if thats all these youngsters we talk about become, the fans will not be happy with their careers.
     
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  18. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yes, pro appearances in are better than youth amateur appearances.
     
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  19. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    Um, No. A stern, forceful no.
     
  20. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    How would they do at Dortmund or Schalke where our two best players play?
     
  21. Brotheryoungbuck

    Jan 24, 2015
    parts unknown
    Martinez and Almiron probably wouldn’t do too bad in all honesty. Gressel and Vilalba are a different story.
     
  22. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Martinez had 7 goals in 58 Serie A matches. Wood has 6 goals in 48 Bundesliga matches.

    Almiron might not do too bad, I agree. I think he'd make it in Europe, to some extent. Whether it could be at Champions League caliber clubs, thats to be determined.
     
  23. Anderson11

    Anderson11 Member

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lindley starts for Orlando, Redding and Duncan start for New York.
     
  24. SUDano

    SUDano Member+

    Jan 18, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    That's your argument? Seems like a false assertion, comparison, non-relevancy, etc. Almost nonsensical.
    I don't know how they would do? They aren't on those teams, they may be on equivalent teams in the near future, they may not be.
    That inherently doesn't make them bad players.
     
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  25. Kombucha

    Kombucha Member+

    Jul 1, 2016
    Club:
    --other--
    Lindley our at HT. Not watching, but had the worst Opta score in the game.
     

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