YNT-eligible lower-division pro players: 2018 In-season thread

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by Dave Marino-Nachison, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    I'd miss that expansion Memphis 901 FC (how 'bout that name) recently announced its first signings. None of them are thread-eligible, but it's a start.

    https://www.uslsoccer.com/news_article/show/962270

    Their coach is Tim Mulqueen, a Jersey guy.
     
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  2. TarHeels17

    TarHeels17 Member+

    Jan 10, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I probably shouldn't be worried, but I can't say I'm comfortable with FC Dallas 2 not being announced yet.
     
  3. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Who knows...……………

    Maybe the FCD folks wanted to get past the Hall of Fame opening, which they put a lot effort into, before announcing their reserve team plans.

    Pareja, Clavijo (before his resignation), and others in the FCD hierarchy talk about it likes its already announced...…

    https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/soccer/soccer/2018/05/16/fc-dallas-practice-observations-may-16
     
  4. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Memphis signed a few more players, none of them thread-eligible. Anyone here know the youth soccer scene in the state? Tennessee doesn't have a DA team, and the closest one to Memphis would seem to be St. Louis FC.
     
  5. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    The Rapids and Colorado Springs finally agreed to a formal affiliation.
     
  6. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Nashville SC will be in the DA within the next season or two as a result of joining MLS.
     
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  7. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Never Mind The Bed Wetting, It's FC Dallas 2. From the inbox:

    TAMPA, Fla. – FC Dallas and USL League One announced today that FC Dallas will be a founding member and begin play during the league’s inaugural season in 2019.

    FC Dallas’ League One team will play its regular season at Toyota Stadium and potentially play a handful of games at another location within the Dallas/Fort Worth area. FC Dallas will announce the additional location as well as the name, head coach and logo of its League One team later this year.
    ;)
     
  8. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Snip:

    Fellow defender and emerging star DJ Taylor will also be back with NCFC for another season. The local product came through the NCFC Youth Academy and is part of the club’s growing youth-to-professional pipeline. Taylor was a reliable member of NCFC’s defense and played 2,742 minutes in 32 league matches last year. He also contributed 97 clearances, 48 interceptions, 48 won tackles, 145 won duels and 10 blocked shots.​
     
  9. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  10. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So, for someone who hasn't followed USL expansion very closely, what is the league going to look like? USL League One, USL Championship, D3 and D2 respectively? Do we know which teams will be in which?
     
  11. TarHeels17

    TarHeels17 Member+

    Jan 10, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My best (and researched way too much) guess:

    USL Championship (DII):
    East:

    Birmingham Legion
    Charleston Battery
    Charlotte Independence
    Hartford Athletic
    Indy Eleven
    Louisville City
    Memphis 901
    Nashville SC
    North Carolina FC
    Ottawa Fury
    Pittsburgh Riverhounds
    Saint Louis FC
    Tampa Bay Rowdies
    MLSII:
    Atlanta United 2
    Bethlehem Steel
    Loudon United
    New York Red Bulls II
    Swope Park Rangers
    West:
    Austin Bold
    Colorado Springs Switchbacks
    El Paso Locomotive
    Fresno FC
    Las Vegas Lights
    New Mexico United
    OKC Energy
    Orange County SC
    Phoenix Rising
    Reno 1898
    Rio Grande Valley FC
    Sacramento Republic
    San Antonio FC
    Tulsa Roughnecks
    MLSII:
    Los Angeles Galaxy II
    Portland Timbers 2
    Real Monarchs
    Seattle Sounders 2

    USL League One (DIII):
    Independent:

    Chattanooga Red Wolves
    FC Tucson
    Greenville Triumph
    Madison
    South Georgia Tormenta
    Richmond Kickers
    Lansing Ignite
    MLSII:
    FC Dallas 2
    Orlando City B
    Toronto FC II
     
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  12. Runhard

    Runhard Member+

    Barcelona
    United States
    Jul 5, 2018
    Someone has probably already addressed this before but is this a sustainable model for these USL League One teams? Can they operate with this much travel involved in a regular league season if they have a limited revenue stream?

    FCD2 will fly to Florida, Toronto, Michigan, Wisconsin and Arizona (with a rost of mostly 19 year old youth players) among other cities for regular league games that will more than likely be played in front of less than 4K fans a night. What is the cost to run one of these teams? If the teams do not sell these players for profit at some point, is this a sustainable model?

    In England and much of Europe the lower level teams can drive within an hour or two for league games and bus it. These USL League one teams will all require flights to play games.

    would be nice to have a league that looks more like the following for FCD2 (
    FCD2
    Austin team
    Houston Team
    San Antonio team
    Oklahoma city team
    Baton Rouge Team
    Sporting Kansas City 2.

    Hopefully the spread out region of this new league doesn't cause too much difficulty in the cost department.
     
  13. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Wonderful, thank you. I suppose I should've used Wikipedia too, because they have most of these teams.

    I have to imagine League One has to have some kinda re-structuring or expansion planned because I can't see how small teams are going to be able to travel such large distances to play each other. Nobody's going to want to go from Richmond to Tucson, or from Lansing to Statesboro.
     
  14. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lol, we're on the same page. They've gotta make it regional, which means they'll have to expand or contract somehow. FC Tucson has been around for a while, and the Kino Sports Complex is nice enough, but it's a geographical island. Even if you had to play teams on the West Coast, driving to LA or the Bay Area for games is going to be really tough. Tucson's 20 minutes from the border, so it's almost like having a team based in Northern Mexico.

    Sorta the same with Orlando City B as well, they're close to South Georgia and nowhere else.
     
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  15. Runhard

    Runhard Member+

    Barcelona
    United States
    Jul 5, 2018
    Saw your post right after mine. Yea, some of these games would not only require a flight but also at least one night in a hotel. Can't get to Toronto from Dallas and play and come back the same day. Actually, probably all of them would require a hotel stay. If you can develop and sell some of these players coming through this program for a few million, it makes sense. If you sell no one, or simply sign a few to your first team every now and then, not sure how they won't lose money on this league.

    Hunt's could write it off and balance it against the profits on the KC Chiefs. :)
     
  16. TarHeels17

    TarHeels17 Member+

    Jan 10, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #766 TarHeels17, Nov 13, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
    Over the summer this exact thing was talked about when people realized USL1 wasn't going to have many teams. The owner of the Madison team, Peter Wilt, who has been involved in practically every pro league in the US over the past 20 years, addressed a lot of it in an interview with The Athletic here:
    https://theathletic.com/436574/2018...ke-or-break-a-lower-division-pro-soccer-team/

    Here's the meat of it:
    Funny enough, I believe that @Peter Wilt is Peter's account.

    Essentially, he argues that while there is an accounting difference, no healthy club is going to disband because of travel costs. Relatedly, the league plans to have 24 teams by 2021, so this shouldn't be much of an issue by then.
     
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  17. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    There's no doubt that the footprint needs to expand for the model to make sense. It seems possible (though this is just a guess) that the league, anticipating further growth and needing to get itself running to attract more teams, would look to defray some expenses for its first clubs.
     
  18. Baysider

    Baysider Member+

    Jul 16, 2004
    Santa Monica
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Just to agree with what everyone else is saying, it's always hard to get a league off the ground, but once it's successful, you'll see more teams joining and it will be easier to structure around regional conferences. My guess is you'll get a mix of expansion teams, teams dropping down from D2 and teams moving over from NISA or whatever the competition turns out to be.
     
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  19. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Yeah it wouldn’t surprise me if USL1 is at least double in size come 2020. Rochester and Penn FC are already scheduled to join in 2020.

    If Statesboro, GA can get a team, then a ton of markets are potentially in play.
     
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  20. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    And I suspect that a bunch of the MLS reserve teams are going to hop down to League One with FCD, Orlando, and TFC. I mean, those that are going to be academy heavy & not worry about results anyway. We laud the Sounders for going academy heavy with their USL squad (and rightfully so), but they were also one of the worst teams in the league. Their priorities are different than Louisville, Sacramento, etc.

    Over time I can see some of the more ambitious NPSL squads moving up. For instance in Texas we have the Fort Worth Vaqueros, Laredo Heat, etc. that are in pretty good sized cities. Fort Worth Vaqueros are owned by Michael Hitchcock, former general manager of FC Dallas. They play in a decent stadium, have an academy that's run by Mark Snell (former FCD academy coach), and have an expanding fanbase. A really nice community club. The kind that you can see moving up the ranks.

    [As many know, I even advocated for them to become FCD's USL affiliate. Was never going to happen.]
     
  21. Luksarus

    Luksarus Member

    United States
    Jul 27, 2018
    IMO, one of the big problems in American soccer is the lack of a system of promotion and descent, I think that would make many of the young players get a better competition and a higher level. What is the meaning of being a 20 year old player and playing in a USL team if you know it will be very difficult for a great team to give you a signature or for that player to receive a call to the NT?
    What sense does it make for an MLS team to produce young players if, in the end, even if you finish in the eleventh position of the season, you know that you will continue in the same league as always? Send young people to a league without competition and bring foreign players at the end of their career.
    I think that with an implementation of the promotions and descents system, not only will a better level be generated in all teams, but more young people from different parts of the country will want to play football.
    I give an example, what options does a young person from Nevada have to play professional soccer if the only team that exists in Nevada plays only in the USL and can not pass more than that division? The only option is to move to a State that has a MLS franchise and stay in the bank while mediocre outsiders get more minutes.
     
  22. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
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  23. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Santa Cruz, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe when there are enough teams and enough money, maybe we can start thinking about it. But until then, the model seems to be Baseball. We're trying to get A, AA, and AAA up and running.

    And in the meantime, it makes no sense for an MLS owner to say "Hey, I want to finish last and then start playing in Hartford and Ottowa!". And on the league side, I don't think the league relishes giving up a pair of big markets like San Jose or Chicago so that Birmingham or Tulsa "have a shot".

    If your argument rests on the idea that players need a top-level team in their own State, it's a really poor one. Plenty of people move to-and-from States for work and school, if someone has to for professional soccer, it's a minuscule price to pay.
     
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  24. Peter Bonetti

    Peter Bonetti Member+

    Jan 1, 2005
    1970 WC Quarterfinal
    Most of our team sports began as college leagues long before anyone thought of making them professional. That is why lower leagues look so different in our country.

    Once professional leagues started, they spent decades as minor leagues, often an afterthought when compared to college sports. People forget that the NBA was an unstable league until 1980. The NFL was going under until Red Grange saved it in the 1930s by choosing to play in it even though it was looked down upon. The NFL really didn’t come into its own until the late 1950s. During all of this time college sports thrived as the primary source of team sports entertainment. Even now it thrives, even if it acts as our primary minor league and developmental league for football and basketball.

    Into this culture we are now trying to produce a multi tiered system with promotion and relegation. Potential owners don’t see buying or starting a franchise as an act that includes the risk of relegation.

    In addition, we have a country that’s size dictates that all leagues be at least semi regional (including all major team sports).

    This just isn’t an easy task. As was just pointed out by gunnerfan7, our leagues aren’t stable and they aren’t full. Let’s get them stabilized and full of competent teams before we implement a plan that destabilizes both the leagues and the franchises. I am fully in support of going to promotion and relegation, but only if it isn’t business suicide. That means that we need to focus on getting stable for the foreseeable future.

    I would love it if we could do it eventually though.
     
  25. Kombucha

    Kombucha Member+

    Jul 1, 2016
    Club:
    --other--
    I think Wilt's $100,000 a season estimate is a little on the low-end and the cost is probably closer to an additional $150,000-$200,000 for teams that actually have to fly for basically all away games, but that the overall point is correct that the travel isn't as big of a factor and not one of the main reasons why a team would choose DIII over DII.

    I think teams will have significantly smaller salary costs. Lots of amateurs and semi-amateurs making $1000-$1500 a month. I think the stadium costs will be significantly less and requirements are much less onerous.

    Not to mention that a true regional league is pretty far fetched. How many places around Orlando City II, Dallas II, Seattle II or Portland II can actually field teams with-in reasonable driving distance? Best case is 1 or 3 bus trips a year even in a regional league. Plus those type of teams are already paying travel expenses similar to a DII team on their DA teams.
     

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