I can't help but think that this is a watershed cup for the maturity of US Soccer at the organization, team, and fan level. 2002 was fantastic, but fortunate. Euro seasons ran late, typical Euro powers underperformed, US was underestimated, and we had some talent, spirit, pluck, and luck. In 2006, too many players and fans believed the hype, the results, and the proven to be underperforming tactics of the coach. Luckily for 2010, we have a great upcoming class spread across MLS and Europe and we have a big chip on our shoulder. But, if we don't hold ourselves to higher standards across the board, we will almost certainly be disappointed again. Moving forward, I think US fans will be much more demanding, analytical, and critical of players and coaches much farther in advance of the cup. What US Soccer needs right now is tough, tough, realistic love. Organization level - greater maturity from - - Expectations of higher levels of performance - -- I was over in Europe watching games in pubs and all of the commentators - BBC, France, Germany - treated our performance against CR as poor but also somewhat surprising; but it was different against Italy - playing on par with Euro powers is almost an expectation for the US (FIFA bs ranking aside) -- Commentators were disappointed in our 1 dimensional offense - Being held to higher *standards* of performance -- "Getting a win" against any non-world power (top 16) isn't sufficient, we must dominate and we must score more than 1 goal - anything else is a loss -- Realizing that our real competition isn't CR, TnT, Jam, Can, etc. - it needs to be IT, Eng, FR, Ned, Ger, Bra, Arg - these are the teams we need to line up against as much as possible, regardless of the effort and cost required to make it happen - yes, this sounds naive, but we aren't going to get there on a diet of minnows -- Noone will ever be a > 4 year coach again - anyone who does well with us in the future will be recruited away Team level - - Players know they need to be harder and tougher on themselves - they've seen that they still aren't there yet on the higher levels. I think more guys playing in Europe will help with this - regardless of debates about quality of play, it seems like there's a consensus about a higher level of day-in, day-out toughness required in daily training overseas. Convey is the case study here. We need be tougher and harder on ourselves to achieve greater goals. - Either you're going to grow up or fizzle from bitterness from an experience like this - hoepfully it hardens our boys. Hopefully Landon gets tougher and Gooch won't get bitter. - Greater competition for spots at individual positions - moving forward, it does seem like we might be hitting critical mass where we might actually have decent competition or at least a second choice for starting slots at every single spot on the field, which would be a new thing and also help eliminate us taking along people who are unable to play and have been largely out of play for the last several years (JOB). Fan level - greater maturity and higher standards from - - Greater awareness of the game from non-soccer fans -- We've gone from indifference to a more serious level of evaluation and analysis from the wider audience - fans and media -- ESPN regulars asking why so few shots on goal, why so few goals, why not put in Eddie Johnson earlier? These questions frequently coming from people who might otherwise have said, "What?" or "Who cares?" four years ago. - Lower tolerances for excuses - As long as there are sports, there will always be excuses for performance, but regular watchers of the Nats and hardcore old skool fans of all sports will tell you - defensive mistakes (Boca, Dempsey, Reyna, whomever), a lack of offense (Donovan, Beasley, etc.), and a lack of tactics (Arena & co) were all much more significant issues than ref'ing. Apologies if this has been addressed in individual threads separately, but I was hoping to have a general discussion of how we must all be tougher, more critical, and analytical of the team moving forward and this seemed like the right place to do it. Thanks for participating in my therapy.
I think you make excellent points re the critical anaylsis. Especially here on BS there are way too many folks who over the past several years (even before '02) question anyone who criticizes Bruce's decisions. Whether it's wasting valuable int'l experience on his pets (Richie Willimas in '01, Armas in '05, etc) to downright questionable player selections (Agoos '02, etc) to team tactics even heading into yesterday. We need to understand that these coaches are not magicians and when some of us see things on out tv or at the stadiums that make us scratch our heads, then it's open for debate. The philosophy that somehow a coach has some untapped wealth of knowledge is just plain stupid! We must hold the coach accountable in the years leading up to the World Cup, not wait until after we go crashing out!
I doubt it. Groaning endlessly about refs and conspiracies makes me think that US "fans" will act like spoiled children, take their "football" (that's a pun) and go home. If 2006 WC is a watershed, its only in the sense that the US has been presented with an opportunity to have all its anti-soccer biases confirmed. We'll have to wait and see if the opportunity is accepted or not.
I agree with Hector & Jane, too much whining about refs and conspiracys. I really don't believe all this tlak about how this will result in less people liking soccer and all that jazz, either. The bottom line is some people like soccer, some don't. For the average American sport fan the world of soccer is totally foreign, and that is not going to change simply becqause the USA wins a World Cup. Your average sports fan cannnot even begin to grasp the concept of relegation and promotion, titles that are decided by a team's regular season record not by a playoff system, and no player drafts. It is for these same reasons that a lot of true soccer fans have a hard time accepting MLS. How can our club teams ever compare with teams that play in a totally different system? If the LA Galaxy has a bad year they get the first pick in the next draft, if Fulham has a bad year they get relegated, lose money and face bankruptcy. I would hope that the one positive thing that comes out of this whole World Cup 2006 experince is that the USSF would finally realize that we need to focus more on developing technically sound players. I truly believe that one of the things preventing player development in this country is economics. There are just to many kids that are shut out of the elite level of youth soccer because of the costs involved. Until this barrier is removed, the player pool will be reduced to the number of players that can afford to play for elite clubs and ODP. We will be getting the best that can afford it, not the best overall players.
I think you're spot on. I also believe there's been an expansion in the base of fans during this WC. We're not going to see them until the team gets together for its next game. Bench marks to watch for: 1 - crowd size at next USMNT game. (sure, this figure has been growing) 2 - Media coverage 3 - Media analysis pre and post game 4 - 12+ month road map from (new) coach and sports media reaction to it I feel these are the earliest signs that those of us who are "old skool" can use as barometers to gage the fallout and subsequent "maturing" in the fan base, and media in the US. I am one of the VERY few that am *somewhat* glad this WC happened the way it did. Because it forces us to truly examine where we're at, take stock, and proceed in a more focused manner toward the future. Many feel we're (USMNT) on the verge of great things with our team. I count myself in that camp. 15 years is a short time to become a great and lasting power in anything. And we're nearly there. We're on the right road. We just need to tune the engine a bit more.
We have to learn from this and move on and stop been a niceguy on soccer pitch it seems that we were too much cought up with what refs did or didn't do. Second I don't want to see negative guys like Reyna on the line up regrudless who's coaching the team. Third. Bruce days are over, we need new leadership.
Hi Jeff -- Great post. I think that since 2002, MLS and the US soccer community has reached critical mass. The attitude that we're always underdogs has vanished, but it has yet to be replaced with a killer instinct. In other words, we showed thinking we were on par with top teams, but we didn't seem prepared to do anything about it. Even so, we failed to advance by a slim margin. One thing I think I've learned over the years: I don't give a rat's ass what soccer-bashers or even most apathetic non-fans think. I only care what we think, the people who have lived and breathed soccer. What I've found is that when open-minded people (who don't have a bias towards the 'major' US sports) are exposed to our passions, they become fans, either big-time, or somewhat. They know how much it means to us, and the emotion is contagious. In that respect, I think WE have greater expections: fans, players, coaches, administrators, soccer media -- and I think the US soccer community, diverse as it is, will rise to the occasion. - Barrett
Excellent points, Jeff!! I also think that this will be a watershed event for US fans like you said and media as well (aside from the "doh!! we shouldn't have believed the Nike hype!"). By far this was thee most knowledgeably covered Cup in US media history. The old garde is truly dying out, and the fact that we've participated in 5 straight Cups and that we'll more likely be in more PLUS domestic league PLUS a growing domestic market for cable and broadcast tv (albeit it much for non-US clubs and national sides), etc... the writing is on the wall: hack journalists are not going to be able to trot out the same arguments every 4 years. They'll get challenged. By their peers. By their readers/listeners/guests/viewers. Just like Arena got challenged. Now: regarding "excuses" (I'm not going to touch the "conspiracy theories" ) It's helpful to look at the global situation in order to assess properly where US soccer is. And the reality is that we held our own in 2 of the 3 games, outplaying our competition. We were also in the toughest group. The reality is that the calls screwed us. Big time. At this point, the old adage "10% of life is what happens to you, 90% is what you make of it". In this regards, we failed. Having said that, the 2 red cards were severe punishment, excessive punishment, as it forced us to play 8 field players, and that meant that defenders had to cover for midfielders, who had to cover for defenders AND for their fellow midfielders, and forwards had to cover for midfielders and even defenders. The result: 4 guys had to fluids injected via IV, and our guys were plain exhausted... against GHANA. (That's prolly why LD didn't take it into the box towards the end: he was tired and couldn't think well OR his body knew that he couldn't pull that move off.) These are things that one MUST take into account when assessing the performance of the players and staff. In short, I would say that the excessive presence of the refs in the last 2 games accounted for "50% of life is what happens to you, 50% is what you make of it". The fact is that we did NOT have enough offensive power to come back and score 2 goals against a squad that was going to sit back, defend and wait to counter. Hell, it sure as hell worked for CR!!! And that's what the final assessment should be: we didn't produce offensively. Who's at fault? We all have our opinions, but we'll just have to wait for US Soccer and the coaching staff to figure that out. BTW: We didn't turn in the worst performance in the group: that dubious honor belongs to CR in their game against Ghana. Nor did we turn in the best performance: that honor belongs to CR in their game against us.
It's the day after the game. We can still whine about the ref and I don't care if people whine about it forever. I will, but that doesn't hide the fact that we had some serious deficiencies and mistakes that put us in a position where the ref could make a difference in the game. We need to correct those to improve. The reffing sucked. FIFA needs to address that. Why is it a crime to point that out?
Good points in the initial post. And here's my take: 1. Fans and media? Definite growth. Viewership numbers were up and that will draw sponsorship which will draw media interest. Fan support was great. Doesn't mean MLS will explode with fans and money but at least the WC is becoming mainstream. Note: this is especially critical b/c I've heard whispers that some folks (outside of the USA) are saying there is a 25% chance that South Africa will not be ready for 2010 in which case there will be a fallback candidate--and that the USA is quietly preparing for that contingency case, arguing we're the one country that could become a host with a year or less of prep time. 2. MLS: remember how we used to get a stream of articles just before the WC about how MLS' fate was tied to the USMNT? Not anymore. So in that regard, MLS has reached puberty perhaps and is no at the effect of the USNT results or credibility. 3. Organizationally: very hard to call this one. Gulati is a pro and I think he'll make some wise decisions. But USSF tends to eat it's own. And even if you're an Arena-hater, it would be a shame to take someone who has been integrally involved in the many of the successes of US soccer (in amateur, pro and internationally) over the past 4 decades and just make him PSG. Likewise, I don't think it does much for us if he ends up coaching TFKAM (though that I think is a very likely scenario). It worries me that we may jump on someone who is good tactically (with X's and O's--like Bruckner or Miluntonic or Hitzfield or Simoes) but ignore that our biggest challenge is still that, fair or not, our NT coach needs to manage our development of talent. You can criticize Arena all you want but none of it changes the fact that we showed up at this WC with arguably only TWO attacking players (Convey and Ching) in good form. Donovan, DMB, Dempsey, McBride, EJ, Wolff, Reyna, O'Brien--all of them were either not in good form over the past several months for their club and/or not even physically fit b/c of recent injuries. If you've got good depth, you can leave some of those players off the side or gamble on an O'Brien b/c the rest of your talent is healthy. There really was NO choice for Arena--he had to carry DMB, Donovan, McBride, EJ b/c we have no other players who can do what they do--even though all 4 had not been impressive for their clubs over the past 2-3 months. When I posted that though prior to the WC, one person responded "well, that's what camp is for--to get in-form." Yeah, camp can serve that purpose. But if camp ends, you go into a warmup against Morocco or Latvia or Venezvuela and still struggle to score, you have no other options to call on. Our talent pool needs to get much wider and our good players need to become great players. Where will we be in 2010 (or really 2008 b/c of qualifying)? I don't know. I do know that if we leave it up to natural evolution (and don't count on the NT coach to be good at this), we run the risk of being no better or even weaker talent-wise. 4. Team talent. Theoretically we should be better. MLS will get bigger. WC exposure will help. Soccer continues to grow in the USA. That said...absent a coherent development program and a NT coach driving priorities for the U17 and U20 coaches and talking with MLS gaffers, we could have a situation in 2008 were we are deeo at one position and have no bodies at another. The USNT pool has gotten deeper (Arena deserves a lot of credit for that). But this WC showed it's still not deep enough. We need to be in the situation where a NT coach in May can say "I'm leaving Landon Donovan and DeMarcus Beasley off the side b/c while they helped us in the last WC, they're in poor form right now and instead players X and Y have shown me more the past year." That kind of statement would be unthinkable right now. Absent continued emphasis on development from the NT director/coach, it will be unthinkable in 2008. We lose some key guys after this WC. McBride, Keller and Reyna are all likely gone. Now some won't bemoan that. But right now, given his disappearing act, does anyone think Landon Donovan is going to step up and be a good A-mid for the NT: a guy we can count on? When we needed something from him this time, he went 0-3. He's happy in LA with his girlfriend. He may turn out to be a nice club player who is a good guy to have in a supporting role for the NT but not someone to make as your captain or build a team around. People like to talk about Adu. He's made huge strides and is having a great season: and hasn't scored a goal yet (despite plenty of opportunities). Real hard to see him as someone we can count on or build an attack on for the next 2 years. Heck, if he transfers to Europe that means he'd spend most of 2007, 2008 sitting on the bench (unless he gets loaned to a lower league team of sorts). I don't have any doubt that we'll have more bodies to choose from in 20010. The problem is: who will be the team leaders, the "go-to" guys, the "Mr. Reliable"s on the side? All of them have had their moments over the past 6 months. But of our young players with roles (Convey, Beasley, Donovan, EJ, Dempsey), there is talent there but hard to argue that any one of that bunch really was consistent and dependable. So if you don't say that one or more of that bunch will be a critical team leader, than you're expecting someone who isn't even part of the NT scene (Adu, Rolfe, Carroll) to not only upgrade his play a lot (very possible) but also to be the kind of leader that allows us to match up against an Italy or Czech Republic. Additionally, something we saw against Ghana was that we were badly outmatched in terms of physical ability and pace. They were just bigger and faster than us. Now that may be unique to Ghana and a few other African teams (like Nigeria for instance). But it just goes to show that we've got a long way to go interms of talent development. For instance, EJ is our speed guy--I some him put one ball out on the sideline against Ghana and then the defender beat him to it. Our "speed merchant" is just run of the mill among the Ghanians.
I agree with this, and I have agreed with many of your posts. The most frustrating thing about reading, before posting, on these boards was the inability to critique many players and the coach. These threads would usually wind up with people hurling insults, etc. I think this will open up US Soccer debate more. It will bring more accountability, clarity, scrutiny, and in the end knowledge. I can't help but think we isolated ourselves in a box for the past 4 years and just figured it would all be allright come 2006. Conclusions - CONCACAF is weak. Yeah road matches can be tough, and we can drop one here and there, but overall we should not have trouble finishing in the top 3 anymore. Possible, but improbable. This region clearly does not prepare players and coaches for the top level. We need more international experience on our staff. Mooch & Onalfo. Enough said. Also think we need more in our youth system, but this is another story. We need a new outlook and a different viewpoint. We need to hire outside the closed US circle to get it. We need better comp as we know. Copa, friendlies, anything. We need to test more players in these tougher comps. We need a Euro camp IMO. These players do not get a fair shake. We need to push passive personalities away from leadership on the team - LD for example, not a leader. Decent player, not a leader. (Sorry CR, but you were not a captain. This is not a lead by example quality team yet, and you were hardly here) We need accountabilty. We need a more tactical/smart approach to go along with our fitness. We need as fans to learn and understand our region better. Where it places us in regards to the rest of the world, and learn more about the tactical and subtle side of the game. We need to keep our players abilities in perspective. We have some nice young players and talent guys. We need to let them play, prove themselves, and find out who is ready for what, with no place guaranteed. Do these things, and they alone, will make us a very dangerousr team come 2010.
I agree whole heartedly with the original post. You can say the refs took the US aut of the world cup, but I really think they were equally bad for the teams that played the US making this a non starter. Defensive mistakes were crucial. The first goal in the first game was a man marking blunder. The Italian goal was an unnecessary foul in a bad area followed by another man marking mistake (by the same player). Both yellow red cards were avoidable mistakes (especially sincea player should know to adjust his game to the way the game is being called). Both goals by Ghana were basic defensive mistakes. Rule one of defense is to get the ball out of danger. The US failed to do that. But the worst offense of all was to not score. What the hell was Arena thinking of. BMB has never been a goal scoring machine, so why put "all" the goal scoring duties on him. It was a dissaster waiting to happen. Every time I saw the starting lineups my stomach turned. The lack of offense put our defense into that much more pressure, and it broke during every game. In a world cup a team needs luck, and some may say that we had plenty of bad luck. (hitting the posts, bad refs, unusual mistakes) but we had our share of good luck. how else do you explain that a tema that has not scored in its first two games still has a chance to advance in its third game, and even in the second half onf said third game. We screwed this up royally. This just means I need to double MY efforts for 2010!!! Yes mine. I will not play or coach but without my dollars the MLS will not improve, we will not get more and better players, enter more competitive tournaments etc. That is how I must help. Getting an extra shirt, inviting a friend to a beer "at a game", going to USMNT matches in the states and abroad. Every dollar counts. The other teams did not beat us simply because they better, but because they have more at stake. time tp put up or shut up.
(1) Forwards do not have "all" the goal scoring duties. (2) Name a striker the US has that you believe would have been the answser. Johnson, with his horrid first touch, and underwhelming performance in the friendlies? Ching, who most people around here didn't even want to make the roster?
What happened to putting this country in a position to win the World Cup in 2010? Wasn't it called project 2010? We need to do all the above mentioned things but we also have to increase competition within the domestic league. Don Garber has been all for bricks and mortar and has forgotten about player talent and or skill development or even the signings of top foreign talent. Why not spend the money we have in the USSF bank? I mean soccer foundations and/or legacy or whatever it is, why can't it be used to sign a Ronaldo & Becks, or even any of the younger talent at the 06 WC? These players will increase revenue, improve the current level of national team players and would add excitement to an otherwise dull league. I am glad we have an MLS as opposed to the years 1985-1995 when there was no league, but I think its time to start thinking about this league. Landon Donavon is a good player and I'm sure he would become an even better if he really put an effort to go to Europe. We need more his type of caliber player on all MLS clubs and not just one. Landon didn't seem prepared at all and looked very lost! This was his and the rest of the USMNT's time to step up and this swagger they kept talking about never came into play. How can they be so cocky without really having accomplished much other than a quaterfinal exit in 2002? The MLS is at best at a 3rd or 4th division around the world or at least in Europe. Maybe some clubs could get away with playing in a 2nd division for a while but how successful they would be is another story. Maybe its time to forget about Soccer Specific Stadiums and should definitely start thinking about developing a national team out of a pool of maybe 30-35 MLS/European based players and no more. The 59 players that Arena has used are just too many for a 4 year cycle.
I actually was going to put something like this in, but when I realized it wasn't going to happen for another 5-10 years or so, I knew it wouldn't help towards 2010. You are right. It's just not going to happen over the next cycle IMO. I pray we can get more investors and stadiums to help force this. A more meaningfull league season, bonus pay and such would be nice. Youth program huge, but I just don't see MLS getting to these stages until about 2010,11,12unfortunately. Yeah, it sucks, but that's what I see. That's why I focused on what we can do for 2010.
2002 showed the US can play at the final 16 level. 2006 showed the US has to perform to play at the final 16 level. I think that the several members of US team thought it was done at the draw. I think that Arena & Reyna (to point fingers) felt that the US can't handle CzR & Italy. TheBruce set up a don't get embarrased game plan/formation/team. They were built to draw. ---------------------------- You miss 100% of the shots that you don't take.
Yes you are right. that is not what I meant. I meant that the offense was set up to drive up the flanks and cross the ball to MBM (the only striker). Yes other members of the team need to score but you must admit the the main duty of a striker IS to score. This created a one dimensional team, which was easy to defend against. No, we do not have a better striker than MBM, but we do have other strikers. Just like two heads are better than one, so are two strikers better than one. Our other strikers are not world beaters but they are decent. From what I saw we played better when EJ was in, and in general we play better when we are on the offensive.
This is the most salient point of this entire thread, and perhaps of any thread on this forum right now. Break this barrier, get more kids from more population segments playing young, seriously, and with professional ambition, and we will become a perennial WC championship contender. People act as if first touch and other soccer skills are simply a matter of developing skill. That if we have the right teachers with the right exercises with players who are willing to put in 10 hours a day training, that we can get perfectly proficient players. Nonsense. The ability to have a soft first touch, make accurate passes and shots, think quickly under pressure, etc, is also a matter of TALENT. Some people are simply limited in their ability to do those things no matter how hard they work. We need more TALENT getting that training. The training is there. It's just not available to and/or sought by enough great talents.
Will this cup make us grow up more than 2002? To tell you the truth, I don't think it will make us grow up I think it will make us grow out becuase these boys are all sitting down after this! SIT DOWN! STRIKE 1 2 3 AND YOU GUYS ARE OUT! SO MUCH FOR TAKE ME OUT TO THE WHOLE NEW BALL GAME! They had the nerve to even call that commercial JOGO BONITO? Heck they can't even win the Coppa della Nonna! (grandma)
Except against Italy of course. Also, I don't think the US feels we can't beat Italy or CZ. I think we just didn't prepare well for the WC at all. We need to play more difficuly competition more regularly. A game in Azteca and one in Saprissa won't stretch you enough.