Wil Trapp Thread

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by bsky22, Nov 18, 2018.

  1. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I didint see a thread for this player, nor do I think one is necessary in this forum, but since he has been the supposed leader of the USMNT for 2018 and the source of much discussion in many threads, I thought this might focus the discussion a little bit.

    Watching him this year an automatic starter and named captain, only confirmed what I have suspected for years.... the poor guy is in over his head at this level. He doesnt have the skills to play any position at this level and certainly isnt good enough to build a team around to try to hide his weaknesses. He has been deployed as a defensive midfielder and yet, he cant defend. His supporters go on and on about his deep playmaking ability and yet the majority of his passes are basic square balls or back passes. Most of the balls he has played trying to create something going forward are intercepted and dont result anything meaningful.
     
  2. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    Trapp oddly is rated well, but I dont see it. For example, the media has him as having a solid game against Brazil. A very tough opponent, but he was exposed throughout the game. Here are a couple of reviews and then a nice thread documenting his play with GIFs... they dont reconcile.

    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2018...miazga-stands-tallest-friendly-loss-vs-brazil

    Wil Trapp (6.5) - Though it's not his strong suit, Trapp was decent at disturbing Brazil rushes in the first half. The Columbus midfielder is known for positive passing through central park, and he did that well. He also served some dangerous corners and was the first US player to test the away 'keeper. And I won't even pretend to count against Trapp for the highly generous penalty decision.

    https://soccer.nbcsports.com/2018/09/07/usmnt-player-ratings-from-2-0-loss-to-brazil/

    Wil Trapp — 6 — Pretty good set piece service, and was fooled on the penalty when Fabinho felt his arm on the side and hit the deck like he saw a gold brick.


     
  3. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    Trapp can defend 1v1 so we are trouble when teams attack quickly up the middle or if rotates out wide to cover for an outside back. He is either going to get beat, commit a foul or the opponent will make an unobstructed pass or cross. Of course if he is facing anybody that is talented, he is likely to get embarrassed. Two different angles of the worst example... not sure who is running the Columbus Crew twitter account, but not sure why they couldnt find another clip of Steffen...



     
  4. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    Raleigh
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That sounds like a reasoned, thoughtful take.

    Oh wait, it sounds like knee jerk bullshit.

    Be better.
    I think we all need to be sure to update our assumpti9ns as more information comes in.

    I, personally, have been with the BS consensus that Trapp is a nice MLS player but nothing special, and certainly not a real candidate for Qatar. But his play lately has surprised me, in a good way. Im still dubious, but I’m willing to wait and see.
     
  5. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I thought he continued to look out of his depth against England. He had a nice tackle that I'm not sure I've seen from him at this level, but his lack of defensive pressure was all over those first two goals.

    An actual coach might be able to find a small role for him, but he is no where near starter quality and not sure how much progress he has made adapting after being played 90 mins of almost every game this year.
     
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  6. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    SD -

    Even you have looked askance at how the USSF has built and marketed the team around WT (whom I believe to be a moderately useful USMNT player but nowhere near a core one to build around). This apparent bias has been exacerbated by our cozy media giving him some MOTM accolades for performances below that bar.

    I'm one to give the benefit of the doubt to the establishment but it's no longer credible IMO to fully wave off conspiracy theories as there's clear support at this point that an agenda exists to put an MLS face as the center of the USMNT and to dismiss alternatives to WT.

    Could it be terrible judgment rather than an agenda? Absolutely and perhaps probably although such incompetence may actually be worse for our program.

    TL;DR. It's not that WT is terrible but he's nowhere near good enough to be considered a main cog that we build the team around (as it appears the USSF is doing currently).
     
  7. skim172

    skim172 Member+

    Feb 20, 2013
    I don't think Trapp is a bad player. But I don't think he's particularly great, and I'm mystified as to why Sarachan sees him as a every-game, ninety-minute talisman in midfield. I thought Trapp looked naive and not up to the speed of the game - and I don't mean athletically (though he's not particularly gifted there, either). I mean mentally, he was getting caught out. His positioning sense was fine, but he takes poor angles, will get caught out, and is easily circumvented by attackers. Against England, we (once again) conceded the entire midfield to the opposition. I don't see him as adding much as a defense (and even less in attack).

    He doesn't have a negative impact, though. Just no impact. He's a space-filler, a placeholder - and in that role, he holds his place on the field well.

    I wouldn't blame him for the loss against England. But I don't see him as a international-level player and I don't get why Sarachan sees him as the next Captain America. At best, I might see him as a bench option to come on as a late sub to help put a win on ice.
     
  8. Cynical US fan

    Iceland
    Mar 30, 2017
    Boston
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, with McKennie sent back to Germany, Trapp will again be at Dmid vs Italy.
    Basta!
     
  9. An Unpaved Road

    An Unpaved Road Member+

    Mar 22, 2006
    Club:
    --other--
    The funny thing about this is others accuse the "SUM cartel" of being more concerned about signing foreigners than developing wholesome young American talent, as well as promoting the Mexican NT more so than the U.S. :p
     
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  10. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    SUM is concerned with what's good for MLS.....promoting WT as the face of the USMNT is in no way disharmonious with bringing in cheap foreign attacking talent.

    My hope is that they continue to overpay for Mexican talent returning from the Big 5 leagues in their primes and re-playiing what happened to MB happen to their players.....
     
  11. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    This thread is incoherent. Wonder why people who make a dedicated thread to hate Trapp have such a hard time making the case.

    Get help.
     
  12. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I think the captain of the national team deserves a thread. He has shown himself to be a fringe player at best and overwhelmed at this level.

    Adams got to play that role role in front of the back four for the first time and showed in 20 minutes that he was much better than Trapp. TA intercepted balls, won tackles, and turned players away in 1v1 situation. Not sure why Sarachan, Ussocer9...., and you cant see it.
     
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  13. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    Nov 4, 2011
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Oh, he sees it allright. And it is why he will play Adams like Armas did v. Columbus, not like Bsky22 wants to play Adams.

    We have to get our front 4 going and that means Adams as a free 8 and he's going to be freed up with Trapp and Delgado playing 6 and 8 respectively. Let's see if Sarachan plays those 3 v. Italy. I"m sure Wes would have benefited but he left camp so that's a non starter.
     
  14. bungadiri

    bungadiri Super Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 25, 2002
    Acnestia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So I had to do a little bit of clean up here as this thread went off in an odd direction.

    Thanks to those of you who took a breath and calmed down and more thanks to those of you who stepped in and poured oil on troubled waters.
     
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  15. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    I agree there is enough Trapp talk to deserve a thread. And I know I've certainly been less than excited about his roll on the team. That said, I don't think Trapp is a horrible player, just not the player we need for the roll he is being put in and not good enough in his strengths to make up what he is lacking. And, I don't understand why his spot seems written in stone while we have players at least his quality if not better that will get shifted around to accommodate him.

    Mostly, my issues come down to his being put in the the 1 in the 4141, which quibbling aside is basically a screening the backline type of position, or at least it should be. Now, if a guy is screening the backline, his first duty is to play good defense in the middle and communicate with others in that part of the field to keep things tight. And, that's not been accomplished. So for me, he's failing at job #1 for his spot.

    Then, I hear about how his real strength is his ability to distribute the ball. Right off the top, fielding a players whose best attributes are with the ball for a primarily defensive spot on the field makes very little sense to me. It sounds like we're making a trade-off. So, if that's the trade off we're making, a physically lightweight not particularly strong defensively defensive midfielder, then I want to see this distribution playing a big roll in making this team successful. Yet, we struggle to come forward from the back every game out and I've only seen Trapp hit solid passes when he's so deep he's under little pressure so to me that sounds like a horrible trade-off and I fail to see what he's bringing most games.

    I'm not so sure that there is any sort of conspiracy favoring Trapp specifically, but I think all you have to do is look to late era Bradley and see that US soccer seems to value a deep midfielder that's not particularly a dogged defensive presence as long as he can pass a bit from deep and I think that is a horrible mistake, especially if you're not a team that will dominate possession. There is a reason we had to roll Beckerman out there to protect the back-line in 2014 in order to compete with stronger teams.

    My fear is that this strategy could work well against poor teams, giving you an extra guy to spread the ball around. But, when we need someone to show some bite and defensive presence out there, we'll be left wanting as we have been in most of the games this year. I could very easily see someone playing that deep pass it around roll looking good against poor competition and solidifying that spot only to be shown as a weakness once we have to really defend that area.

    So yeah, my problem is less with Trapp specifically or even with fielding a central deep-lying midfielder. My issue is with putting a non-defensive presence guy in a spot of the field where playing tough defense should be the primary job responsibility, especially as the level of competition goes up. And if you're going to do something like that, you need a much better reason than the passing Trapp has shown so far would give me.
     
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  16. schrutebuck

    schrutebuck Member+

    Jul 26, 2007
    In a lengthier article about Berhalter and the US (behind a paywall), Paul Tenorio got some quotes from Wil Trapp about him:

    https://theathletic.com/694363/2018/12/04/gregg-berhalter-usmnt-coach-hired-press-conference/
     
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  17. gunnerfan7

    gunnerfan7 Member+

    SJ Earthquakes/Arsenal
    United States
    Jul 22, 2012
    Pleasanton, California
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
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  18. GiallorossiYank

    GiallorossiYank Member+

    Jan 20, 2011
    NJ/Roma/Napoli
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Unless he goes to a bigger league and improves...we’ll see him at off year Gold Cups.
     
  19. KALM

    KALM Member+

    Oct 6, 2006
    Boston/Providence
    I'm glad that Wil Trapp believes that the Columbus Crew system will easily translate to the US Men's National Team. I just wonder who will play the Wil Trapp role in that system.
     
  20. Maximum Optimal

    Maximum Optimal Member+

    Jul 10, 2001
    Against stronger teams or on the road in qualifying I think we need more of a defender at that position. Someone like Danny Williams.

    But in games where we expect to control possession more it makes sense to have someone like Trapp in that spot. I say like Trapp because I actually have another player in mind. Lletget. I know he has mostly played further up the field but on occasion the Galaxy have played him deeper in midfield. I think he could be an outstanding deep-lying playmaker.
     
  21. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Posters continue to fetishize Beckerman's role within the team. He was strictly a niche player. He stayed disciplined. He didn't engage in hero-runs upfield. That's what JK could not get out of Bradley and Jones, at least initially. Posters go on as though Rasta were Makelele. He was simply not that pivotal.

    In JK's own words:

    In the Copa, with JJ and Bradley in a 442, the team performed well without Beckerman.

    And I am not suggesting Trapp be a starter.

    http://www.sportingnews.com/us/socc...kerman-jurgen-klinsmann-us-mens-national-team
     
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  22. TheHoustonHoyaFan

    Oct 14, 2011
    Houston
    Club:
    FC Schalke 04
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Beckerman was a MLS MVP candidate in 2011 when Klinsmann called him into that first camp. IIRC Dreds was averaging 3.5 tackles and 2.5 interceptions per match and was arguably the best DM in MLS along with Chara and Alonso. He finished 2011 with 3 goals and 9 MLS assists.

    Contrast that with Trapp who has never reached those heights even in MLS. Trapp could not even get into Arena's Cupcake match day squad in '17 and was laughably over his head in '15 and '16 in Klinsmann's camp.

    If anyone is being feishized it is Trapp and it has already started to caused irritation within the player pool. I posted Kljestan's comments a couple of years ago and there are rumors that Pulisic, McKennie, and others among the young corp are fed up with the Captain Futuro hype that the GOBs have shrouded Trap in.
     
  23. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    I'd say both are strictly niche/role players within the framework of the NT. Both have done good things in MLS, though neither has made a Best XI Team of the Year.

    2011 MVP Candidates
    • Brad Davis (Houston Dynamo)
    • Dwayne De Rosario (D.C. United)
    • Brek Shea (FC Dallas)
    https://buftonfootball.wordpress.com/2015/02/18/scouting-report-wil-trapp/
    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2011/11/07/mls-reveals-finalists-mvp-and-other-year-end-awards
     
  24. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Yedlin, Brooks, DWill, Miazga, Steffen, Pulisic, Adams, Weston, Sargent. It'll be interesting to see how 3G handles this. Is he really going to make Trapp Captain For Life?
     
  25. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    What's the argument for WT being named captain under GB? How many BS posters think this would be a good idea? Perhaps this is moot if CP has now been named as ongoing captain.
     

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