Who stays and who goes?

Discussion in 'Real Salt Lake' started by RSL Wonderbra, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. Todorojo

    Todorojo Member

    Oct 27, 2008
    South Weber, UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    There should be a substantial amount of turnover this off season. 2 big reasons why... The budget is getting a BIG boost! And we have a new head coach with a new system going into his first off season here.

    We should see a new striker, upgraded midfield and a new right side defender at a minimum. Petke wants to play his outside backs in a way that doesn't fully suit Beltran. He has all of the ability to do it until he has to actually use his foot... he just doesn't fit what Petke needs there. Rimando and the rest of the defense is good enough going into the next season, though we need some change to the depth.

    Savarino and Rusnak are the only 2 midfielders that should be locks for starting spots again next season in midfield/attack. We should be looking to upgrade everywhere else. That doesn't mean we will upgrade everywhere, but everything should be open if the right player and opportunity to sign them comes along.

    I think we will see more changes this off season than we have in quite some time. Remember, our last coaching change didn't need much for change as Cassar had already been here, and kept Kries system in tact the first season. But then think back to when Kries took over and the amount of changes that happened that first off season. Petke just had a 31 game trial period with the current roster, you better believe that he gave a lot of feedback to Weibel about who he wants to keep and who needs to move on, and what he needs to get this team to the next level. Hopefully Wiebel is able to deliver... and hopefully he can move Yura.

    (I don't know how to spell our GM's name... so I gave it 2 different attempts. :))
     
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  2. Lizzie Bee

    Lizzie Bee Member+

    Jul 27, 2004
    Utah
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Waibel.

    I agree with what you're saying in theory. I just don't think any of us should get too optimistic. There are too many places where deals can fall apart.
     
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  3. PattysCow

    PattysCow Member+

    Apr 4, 2010
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Waibel has also proven that he' only capable of working on one deal at a time. As someone who is not expecting a lot my list is:

    1. Get rid of Yura. "It's easy to spend other people's money blah blah blah" DLH just needs to get it done even if that means buying out his contract. A $2M DP sitting on the bench can honestly be the difference between a successful and a sub par season.

    2. Renew Kyle for around $300k (yeah yeah crucify me) and Nick for $200-$250k.

    3. Sunny has to be replaced. Looks like we'll have a lot of TAM

    4. Outside back. Acosta is fine. Beltran is fine (if healthy), but another starting quality player would do wonders.

    5. Plata. Honestly unless a team comes calling, he will stay. Also since there is no reason to buy Lennon from Liverpool, we will need a player here. So if we sell Plata, they need to look to replace him. Maybe use some of that new TAM.

    6. Other than that, maybe just find some depth signings.
     
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  4. Taragui

    Taragui Member+

    Aug 13, 2006
    Northern Utah
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    All this talk about Beltran not fitting Petke's system has got me thinking. Would either Lennon or Allen be worth a shot trying to convert to RB?
    I'm thinking Allen has done it before IIRC, and Lennon's strength seems to be his crosses, which RSL would still have if he came forward from an RB position. Don't recall any serious defensive mistakes by either, although you could argue that that is due to not having that as their primary role and only helping out occasionally.
     
  5. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    I wasn't suggesting for a minute that everyone in red on my list needed to go rather the 'reds' being the ones I wouldn't fight to keep.

    The 'reds' being the ones you use to help upgrade the team through trades, releases, etc.

    I am in the camp of this team needs more turnover on the roster than in years past though.

    I hope they don't get caught up in almost making the playoffs and thinking this was so close to being a playoff team. They weren't and aren't. They were simply fortunate that other teams around sucked almost as bad as they did down the stretch.

    There are plenty of spots to fill with young up and coming talent.
     
  6. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    instead of moving players out of positions they are good at to positions they are alright at (Lennon and Allen to RB instead of RW) why not (a) let those players play their best position and (b) sign a player who is best at that position?
     
  7. Taragui

    Taragui Member+

    Aug 13, 2006
    Northern Utah
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    So, if we can't move Yura due to his contract, you're saying moving him to CB is a bad idea? :p

    Imagining Rimando losing his voice due to all the shouting...
     
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  8. BalanceUT

    BalanceUT RSL and THFC!

    Oct 8, 2006
    Appalachia
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How do you plan on replacing all those guys.... an expansion draft?
     
  9. DrownedElf

    DrownedElf Member+

    Jul 5, 2010
    Ogden
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I think Ideally we sign anywhere from 5-6 players between starters and depth, but the reality is we sign about 3 at most. If those 3 are top quality signings, then I can live with it. We were a playoff team (on the low end) had Petke been coaching all year. So 3 quality signings should at the very least keep us in that same spot, or possibly moves us up depending on how everyone performs.

    I think our bigger problem is not properly moving out older players when we should. We keep clinging to these guys until they're past their sell by date, then have to scramble because instead of needing ~3 guys, we now need ~6, which isn't likely to happen. What sucks is that this continues to put us behind on moving players, unless we do to big and make some bold moves. At some point we'll have to, or risk falling behind even more. This is the downside of the 'RSL Family' mentality. We hold onto too many players for too long.
     
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  10. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Monarch promotions (we've already seen this somewhat)
    Andy Williams scouting
    Academy signings / Draft
    Waiver wire
     
  11. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    And 18 months from now a great signing from Waibel. No worries.
     
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  12. DrownedElf

    DrownedElf Member+

    Jul 5, 2010
    Ogden
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Don't worry, we'll get that forward we need this *year!

    *3 years
     
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  13. Todorojo

    Todorojo Member

    Oct 27, 2008
    South Weber, UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    To be fair, he made 3 really good signings in the past 12 months...
     
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  14. DrownedElf

    DrownedElf Member+

    Jul 5, 2010
    Ogden
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One of which was 3 years late..

    So assuming he keeps up the same level, which position is going to be in need of, but 'just fine' for the next few years?

    Hopefully he's actually learning from all this and improving. But right now, his overall track record isn't that great. I'm not quite on the fire Waibel train, but I'm still pretty close. If he can make some solid moves this off season (at least on paper) then it'll restore some faith in his ability. The biggest item for me is dumping Yura and getting a quality forward. Obviously the new guy may not pan out, but I want someone with some kind of pedigree at this level. Someone that can (on paper) provide 15-20 goals. To me, it's our biggest hole right now. I certainly have other areas of concern I want to improve, but that CF spot is to me where we need to improve on.
     
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  15. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Center mid. No doubt in my mind we'll stick with KB this year and Luke/Sunny next to him. I want change, but Luke is gonna be around and I don't see them finding a way to move Sunny. They'll draft players after that to fill it. Give an academy kid half a chance. By 2020 we'll finally buy a good box to box middy.
     
  16. The Franchise

    The Franchise Member+

    Nov 13, 2014
    Bakersfield, CA
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I exited the Fire Waibel train this season, but it won't be that tough to reboard.
     
  17. irondeepbicycle

    irondeepbicycle Member+

    Real Salt Lake
    United States
    Jul 31, 2017
    I get that it's fun to meme, but Waibel's track record over the last 12 months has been very good. We expect that players and coaches can improve with experience, so why can't a GM?

    Over the last 12 months we got the attacking mid we needed, the center back we needed, and hit a home run with Savarino. It's a tough job, and it's not hard to imagine someone getting better at it over time.
     
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  18. UPinSLC

    UPinSLC Member+

    Jul 11, 2004
    SL,UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Certainly, but that doesn't excuse his very poor decisions on many other signings and many failures to address clear needs that went on for years, plus the whole Cassar and Yura contract bullshit. He's had a solid year, now he needs to do what it takes to make this team, with Petke's help, a contender. We missed the playoffs this year, that can't be understated, yes there was clear improvement and an obvious path laid out for the team going forward but we were still on the outside looking in. Resting on what we did from July onward for 2018 won't guarantee us a spot in the playoffs, nor will we be a contender for hardware, the team still needs improving in a few areas and until those needs are addressed we'll continue to be a middle of the pack team.

    Every single offseason should be met by Waibel with a clear strategy to make improvements of the team, at no point should he be in a mentality of "this team is set". Whether that's identifying youngsters who can be rotated in and hopefully be impact players in 2-3 years or moving a regular 18 player to bring in someone who can take the team to a higher level. Improvement in roster/personnel can ALWAYS be made.
     
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  19. Lizzie Bee

    Lizzie Bee Member+

    Jul 27, 2004
    Utah
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I acknowledge that Waibel did not just a good, but a stellar, job with signings this last year.

    I also acknowledge that it'll take more time to forget and move past some of the past problems such as the Yura debacle. Time heals all wounds.
     
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  20. stucknutah

    stucknutah Member+

    Feb 14, 2002
    In the Office
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    I was one of the first to call for Waibel's head, AND, I have to agree that his last year was dramatically better than his previous. In fact, with Rusnak, Sava and big Silva, he added some nice talent. I didn't even have a problem with Barrett (who DID look to be our best forward until he was injured) and Horst (experienced backup.) Add in locking up some younger talent, and he is showing nice signs.

    With that being said, how and whether he can fix his huge Yura error will color my view of him as a GM going forward.
     
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  21. El-ahrairah

    El-ahrairah Member+

    Sep 20, 2004
    Wanker County
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe he's getting better thru on-the-job training?
     
  22. irondeepbicycle

    irondeepbicycle Member+

    Real Salt Lake
    United States
    Jul 31, 2017
    It's really more Dell Loy's call than Waibel's, isn't it?
     
  23. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd say Yura has the most power in that whole shitty situation. Or, at least as much as DLH.
     
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  24. Lizzie Bee

    Lizzie Bee Member+

    Jul 27, 2004
    Utah
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And that's the problem.
     
  25. irondeepbicycle

    irondeepbicycle Member+

    Real Salt Lake
    United States
    Jul 31, 2017
    Dell Loy has one unilateral option, which is a buyout. Yura has to agree to anything short of that, but if DLH is willing to shell out, then ultimately he makes the call.

    In any case, Waibel doesn't really have any options on his own. Either DLH spends, Yura agrees to a move, or we tolerate Yura on the roster.
     

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