What are you talking about?How was it weak?You must be a youngster who knows nothing about history to make comments like that.Your implying that if the Brasilian league was the strongest that shows competition was weak?Come on don't speak without knowing things,your just sounding ignorant.Some of the greatest players in HISTORY played in the Brasilian league in those days and you turn around and say that it shows that the competiton was weak Obviously its clear your not much of a football historian. FIRST OF ALL,Ronaldo won ONE world cup and LOST the other.In 1994 he did nothing more then watch Brasil win just like the rest of the world did.Garrincha on the other hand won TWO world cups and in 1962 he was basically THE reason Brasil won.And in 11 years playing for Brasil including participating in 3 world cups,with Garrincha on the field Brasil only lost ONCE,that my friend says more about a players value,importance to a team and greatness then anything you can say about Ronaldo. Whichever individual person you have heard overrate past players,that is there problem.History generally hold players like Garrincha,Pelé,Beckenbauer,Di Stefano etc in high regards for a reason and rate them as highly as they should be rated. Your quote "They think those past players have done stuff that none of the current players can accomplish...please" Its true,some people do think that,and I'm one of them. Do I think another player will score over 1,000 goals like Pelé?NO. Do I think another player will score goals and win a world cup at the age of 17 like Pelé?NO. Do I think another player will have a statistic like Garrincha who in 60 games for Brasil only lost 1 time?NO. Do I think there will be 2 players who when playing together for a team NEVER LOST like Pelé and Garrincha for Brasil?NO.etc.... I understand you like Ronaldo and If you want to rate him better then Garrincha or Pelé that is fine because it is your opinion.But please do not try to "degrade" past players and there accomplishments in an attempt to make Ronaldo look better.
Don't you dare rating anyone other than Pele over Garrincha To the ones that dare rating Ronaldo better than Garrincha: You are the ones that need to stop. I myself think Ronaldo is great, but please, give Caesar what belongs to Caesar... trying to downgrade players from past eras can be ignorant and dangerous. I understand that when somebody is not that much into the football world and has limited knowledge of its history, they will have a small amount of information to attempt and dissertate and less players to compare and analyze, but don't go posting ridiculous statements based on pure and obvious bias. It will only make you look good if you inform yourself and think before you post.
And to those who think strikers had an easier time back then I would like to tell you to try and watch the following matches: - Boca Juniors x Santos (Libertadores final 1963) - Brasil x Portugal (World Cup 1966) - Holland x Argentina (World Cup 1974) - Brasil x Holland (World Cup 1974) It is astonishing how the beautiful game could turn up brutal back in those days
And if you think football is harder now than before, ask Garrincha what kind of childhood impediments and poverty he had to overcome, or the european players who participated in the WC in 1930, what kind of traveling they had to do, or how many times Obdulio Varela borrowed money to take the bus home after practice. Then ask Beckham what he had for dinner today or Ronaldo where his next investment is going to.
that game was extremely brutal. portugal should have never finished that match. air fly, no one here is comparing past to present. as far as the brazilian tournament being weak, i guess you're ignorant enough to not know how many of the candidates had their glory in brazil. when you suggest that ronaldo is second to pele at the moment, you need extremely undisputable proof that he is. no 'well he was injured, and if not for the injury....' we're not discussing what if's. raul was never injured, and look what happened to him? not a pleasant what-if for you right? actually no, not even close. as far as brazilians knowing, check out ombak......
How? He'd have the same World Cup accomplishments as Garrincha basically. And like I said, Garrincha single-handedly won 1962 for us. Don't forget: Pelé + Garrincha = Brazil never lost. I'm a huge Ronaldo fan. He's my age, I've grown up watching him. Garrincha is better. Ronaldo without an injury would not come close to eclipsing Pelé. Anyone who thinks so doesn't understand soccer. Ronaldo is a very intelligent and gifted player. Pelé is to Ronaldo as ... I don't know how to put it frankly ... Einstein is to ... an exceptionally good scientific mind? Once again: Pelé. Garrincha. Now we can start talking about others.
These kind of posts are the one that disguest me the most..."Pele to Ronaldo is like Einstein to whatever" it's underrating current players imo pretty much.
The Russians thought Garrincha was a far better player than Pele in 1958 where Edson was marked well by a quality Russian def mid Yuriy Voinov whereas the Bird destroyed Boris Kuznetsov on the right flank (Soviet left). The situation reversed by the time Brazil toured the USSR in 1965 where Pele dominated a great Soviet d-mid Valeri Voronin (All World Cup Tournament team in 1962 and 1966) while Garrincha was not the same after his car accident.
Yeah, poor Joao... Good point. Garrincha's biggest individual world cup glory is being the best player of the 1962 edition, by light years. After Pele got injured, he put the team on his back, and played, really, like he was from another planet. But many forget that he was also a vital piece, if not the vital piece, for the 1958 squad. Very underrated due to the new sensation Pele. For the statistical fans, just look at the highlights from 1958; in the last 3 matches, Garrincha got like... what? 7 assists?
Well I must admit, i'm not very knowledgable about Brasilian football history so i take my previous comments back. Yes Ronaldo only won 1 WC but nonethelss they'll be counted as 2 in his resume if he retires. He has been to the finale in 98 don't forget that, and could've won that for Brasil if it wasn't for his sickness. Ronaldo has accomplished so much as a player that it isn't laugable when someone compares him to other legends. I bet 7 years from now after he retires, ALOT of people would be singing his name. You have to take into account that the game is much different back then than now. Please, name me one striker TODAY who'd score 8 goals in 1 game? Pele did that back then and was doing it on regular basis (reason why no body would touch his scoring record) Now do you think he would had accomplished that if he'd to play in today's game? That's why IMO, I think the competition back then was weak, and is it really fare to compare those past players to current players like Ronaldo and Zidane and state that they don't stand a chance? I think it's unfair and it's the main reason why i'm againt this "greatest ever" thing. To me there is no greatest ever...infact it's who was the best in his generation. As far as i know, this is how i rank them Pele - was the best in his generation Maradona - was the best in his generation Ronaldo - is the best in his generation, though some people could make a case for Zidane. I'm not gonna try to degrade them, but i feel alot of folks here degrade our current generation players (Ronaldo, Zidane). Which i don't like at all...
Maybe. maybe. don't get ahead of yourself anymore. you never know if ronaldo could injure his knee again. as of now, he still has a lot of catching up to do, since we can only go by what he has accomplished, or what he may have, should've, would've, could've accomplished. no one is degrading current players. you just have to wait until their careers are over to judge them. don't get ahead of yourself and guarantee him another WC victory, or status as a great yet.
Any source considering Ronaldo a World Cup champion in 1994 is inaccurate. Ronaldo did not play in 1994. He did not win the world cup then, just like, for example, Baresi did not win it in 1982 or Passarella in 1986. They were not champions in those tournaments. They were non-used reserves. You have to play, even if it's for a few seconds, to be part of the champion's list. I remember watching the 1994 final and during extra time, when Brazil still had one substitution available, telling my family: "I really hope Parreira doesn't put Ronaldo de Lima in just to make him eligible for world cup champion. It would look bad if he pulls a 'Trobbiani'..." And at the end I was glad he didn't do it, for him and for Ronaldo. There is people out there trying to degrade Pele for playing 2 games in 1962. Imagine what they could say about Ronaldo in 1994, if he had played a couple of minutes. I hope this is clear enough. I don't have anything against anyone, but I feel I should try to point to what is false information for it to be amended.
People forget that neither Pele nor Garrincha started the first 2 matches. It was the 0-0 tie with England that forced Feola into bringing in Pele as an inside right forward and Garrincha as a right flanker in their 4-2-4. It didn't hurt that the Russians had never seen that Brazilian team, not even on film. According to Lev Yashin, the Soviet team found out where the Brazilians were training and then just went over to their site and ended up having a nice social visit with the bunch of guys they only read about in papers. Now, imagine being Boris "Joao" Kuznetzov and seeing Garrincha for the first time in the deciding group stage match. Needless to say, Garrincha turned him inside out with every move and the most intimidating play, according to the Soviet coverage, wasn't just the move but the shot that Garrincha took almost immediately after the opening whistle -- he faked out the Russian leftback and let go of a rocket that Yashin never even moved on. The ball crashed into Yashin's left post and richoched all the way back to midfield. Then a minute later (hope I have my sequence correctly), Garrincha beat Boris again and slid the ball to Vava for a goal. The opening barrage by the Brazilians has become known as "the best two minutes of football". Mind you, this was no average Soviet team. It consisted of players that would go on to become legends of the game : Igor Netto (who was hurt and had an awful game marking Didi, IIRC, but that was before any subs were allowed), Valentin Ivanov, Lev Yashin, Yuriy Voinov, Nikita Simonyan, et al. What was even remarkable was the fact that, under the old rules, the USSR was tied with England and had to play a single game play-off two days following the Brazil game, making it four games in nine days for the Russians ... and they managed to beat a very good English team with Billy Wright, Bobby Robson and Tom Finney (young Bobby Charlton never made it off the bench). Two days later (this is the 5th game in 11 days for the Soviets), they lost to a very good Swedish team - playing at home, no less - that featured 2/3 of the famed GreNoLi line (Nordahl was out as a pro but Gren and Liedholm played, along with another great Kurt Hamrin, a wing who scored 190 goals in Serie A!).
Romario is still active and has scored over 900 goals so far Although Romario is hands down a great, no one would argue he is up to Pelé's class So yes, if Pelé played in today's game, he'd score as much or more
I have to disagree regarding Rivaldo. Rivaldo has been more successful with Brazil than Ademir. He was arguably Brazil's best player in two World Cups scoring 8 goals and providing an equal number of assists! He was the best player and joint top scorer in Brazil's Copa America win in 1999 and almost single-handedly qualified Brazil to the 2002 WC. He also produced sublime performances for Brazil against heavyweight teams like Argentina, Holland etc. How many games did he clobber Argentina in? At his peak, he was unquestionably the world's best. He definitely has a better claim than Ademir.
Rivaldo is most definitely an all-time GREAT. Sometimes people forget the ridicolous plays he pulled off and how great he was in the clutch......Why not reminisce on the great Rivaldo with this incredible 4 minute compilation of one of the best players to grace a Seleção shirt? http://tecnix2003.free.fr/
The friendlies in those days and when Santos was involved were not like the ones you see now,when Santos made a trip to Europe it was the great Pelé and the great Santos that people went to see and other teams did not treat this as friendlies,Europe's top teams wanted to see what all the fuss was about and players did not take playing Santos lightly.Think about it,you are a great European team and you hear about this kid Pelé who is considered to be the best player in the world and that Santos is the best team in the world,then they come to Europe to play you,are you going to treat this like some kind of practice or a friendly?I don't think so. But believe whatever you want,if you want to call it "lame" go ahead,most will disagree.
https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=151221 Even if you discount his goals in friendlies he still comfortably beats everyone else.
sure. like it states in that stat sheet peles total included goals in all kinda weird ass brazilian cups. even with those, müller scored more frequently (38 to 36 goals per season). anyway, my point was that the whole 1300 goals thing is misleading. people dont realize that they include more then 500 goals in friendlies. hardly something to put on your resume.