If you're 16-18, you're thinking about development. If you're 23, you're thinking about a job. "Breaking through as a starter somewhere by 23" is in line with that. And yes to your last 2 sentences. I don't think anyone could disagree with this.
Sounds good, but is it really true? When an 18 yo is considering his choices, he might also consider the opportunity cost of a lost college scholarship which could provide an income for the rest of his life. All economic choices have costs, and when a player chooses to forego a scholarship for intensive soccer training, he is, indeed, "choosing a club for 'development'." Most people make these choices w/o thinking too seriously about it, but are certainly aware some jobs provide more opportunity for future growth than others. I think that is all the proponents of considering the development opportunities at the club they choose to join are simply saying development should be considered like any other job opportunity.
Not much disagreement it seems about which leagues are the best for player development. Even on Big Soccer...
I guess I figure it is more important to look at individual teams and the individual players needs rather than at leagues as a whole: who are their youth managers; do they have a track record of developing talent for the first team; do they have a prior track record with Americans; what is the support structure for young players just moving overseas for the first time; what is the personality of the coach; what is the personality of the player; does the player need help adjusting to being a professional that the team can provide; how much individual attention does the player receive and the team provide, etc.
I don't want anyone with this attitude near my National team, and I hope we get to the point where it isn't even part of the discussion. Not to derail the thread, but this is one of the biggest issues we have with parents and PTP, Soccer is seen as a means to an end (college scholarship) and not the hopeful endgame. And yes, until MLS increases their rediculous minimum wages, and reduces the opportunity costs, unfortunately what you say is true. But I still stick with my original point. Besides, college will always be there, especially with online degrees, both can be accomplished (albeit probably at a slower rate.) If someone washes out as a pro, in their early to mid twenties, they are still young enough (hell I am 44 and getting my Masters degree) to go to college. Pursuing a soccer career, you only have a short window.
Truly, I don't know what you are talking about. What attitude? Why mention National team? What shouldn't be part of the discussion?
Perhaps I jumped the gun, but I mentioned USMNT because, the players being discussed were/are established players or prospects for the most part, and that seemed where the discussion was at. And the best path of development for such talented prospects. My point is that if a kid is talented enough at that age to have a chance to go pro, and he doesnt have enough desire, drive to excel, and isnt salivating at the opportunity, and take it as far as he can when given the opportunity, (or whether or not to even become a pro) he probably doesnt have the mentality to be a top player, and should be weeded out of the discussion, as he probably wont make it far to begin with. Nothing against such a kid as a person, if he doesnt love the game and walks away from it and choses college that is fine on him. But lets focus our attention elsewhere.
Avoid England, Scotland, Italy, Spain, and Portugal. I'd say if you are a top prospect on the world level go to a German club. A lot of our of our mid tier prospects/diamond in the rough have success in the Eredivisie/Belgium and on good teams in Scandinavia. Though, a prospect/player should be playing and producing on a top 3 team if the the Scandinavian league is in Norway or Sweden. And as always a player should be a starter or at least part time starter by the time they are 23 at the max. On another note you will generally see a pipeline affect when agents can become trusted by the scouts of teams of a certain region. I would expect to see more Americans in Scandinavia in the coming years, tbh.
In terms of expectation when a youth player signs with a mega-club, here’s a nice quote discussing Barcelona’s youth program. I was surprised at the low yield playing at 22 y.o. for major league teams.
MLS Home Grown players are in many cases already paid better than youth players in England and other countries abroad though: https://playerscout.co.uk/football-academies/do-academy-players-get-paid/ https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...wages-40000-a-year-jurgen-klopp-a7358886.html https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/ex9pem/real-madrid-football-youth-academy-876 https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...eft-scrapheap-thanks-exorbitant-compensation/
MLS HG contracts actually are high to start for what is an unproven player. What is the problem is that a player can break through and become an integral part of the team and still be on that salary. In Europe, if you get into the first team, you almost instantly get a new deal at a salary much higher than any HG deal. For example, Pulisic was probably on a HG level deal money wise when he first played for the first team. But he was quickly signed to a new deal at much more money. I believe he signed another deal, just after that, that possibly puts him past most DPs in MLS. Contrast with Tyler Adams, who actually has one of the better HG deals, but he is in his second year of starting, integral to the team, making the All-Star roster and making $147K. There are others in similar situations making half that I believe.
Focusing on Leagues versus Clubs is probably the wrong way to look at it. MLS can be a good league if you sign with Red Bulls, but a completely different experience if you sign with Portland. For Americans, you have to be able to get a shot to play. England is not a good destination because of work permit rules and the fact that EPL teams can buy anyone they need. France, Spain, Portugal, and Italy do not seem to be great for non-domestic talent from any country. Germany is currently the best spot and not just for Americans, but for young English players, Japanese players, etc. After Germany, the Netherlands can be good if you fit in their rules. Denmark seems to also be a place where many Americans get a fair shot. Sweden and Norway and Scotland are other places but I think they are a step below unless you can break into the best teams. In second divisions, the Championship is a good starting place but I don't think with the money in the EPL it is a stepping stone like it used to be. IOTW, I don't think EPL teams are scouting the Champ for talent like they probably did 10 years ago. 2.Bund is a good place to go and several clubs there are known for being good youth developers.
Well, I don't know a ton of academies that take prospects beyond 18; usually at that age a player is trying to gain experience not development. Basically moving from being in school to working, probably starting out with a 2nd team / reserve squad at that point. I make this distinction between development and experience because most of the skills acquired after that age are coming through playing meaningful matches against good opponents, not from instruction or training with good players at a good club, a situation that tends to get overvalued a lot in these discussions.
Here's an old article discussing which programs develop the most Big 5 talent. http://www.sportingintelligence.com...rs-for-clubs-in-europes-elite-leagues-131201/
Spain benefits from being the main bridge between Latin America and Europe. France from being the one between Africa and Europe. You have truckloads of kids moving to either very young, with their families, to be developed by clubs there.