What are you looking for in the 2020 Democratic candidate: restore norms, or counterrevolution?

Discussion in 'Elections' started by superdave, Feb 19, 2019.

  1. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Concernig Gaetz . . . Have the Republicans even done the usual "tsk tsk" thing that they do when Trump does something historically abnormal for the office, or when Steve King (Racist- Iowa) talks to European neo-nazis?
     
  2. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    It seems to me that this board alone has several exceptions.
     
  3. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
    Club:
    Tottenham Hotspur FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Oh, I agree.

    But hopefully there will be more than just letting it slide.
     
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  4. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
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    DC United
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    United States
    #29 superdave, Mar 4, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2019
    I know this is mostly a policy statement, but I think it's also an attitudinal statement.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/3/4/18246381/democrats-clinton-sanders-left-brad-delong

    "“Barack Obama rolls into office with Mitt Romney’s health care policy, with John McCain’s climate policy, with Bill Clinton’s tax policy, and George H.W. Bush’s foreign policy,” DeLong [from the Clinton administration] notes. “And did George H.W. Bush, did Mitt Romney, did John McCain say a single good word about anything Barack Obama ever did over the course of eight solid years? No, they ********ing did not.”

    I know he mentions several policies, but IMO his criticism is that the GOPers he named didn't attempt to compromise or have any impact on the policies or do any governing. Note that he didn't name any Tea Partiers...yet their attitude was indistinguishable from that of Ted Cruz or Mark Meadows.

    Later:

     
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  5. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
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  6. Funkfoot

    Funkfoot Member+

    May 18, 2002
    New Orleans, LA
    Interesting article. Makes more sense than the progressive v moderate narrative you usually see (I guess because people think in binary). I would say I am progressive new guard, personally. Noteworthy that the article doesn't really touch on foreign policy.
     
  7. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Thanks to the Democrats' "open borders" position, there's no need for a foreign policy.

    [/FoxNews Take]
     
  8. MatthausSammer

    MatthausSammer Moderator
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    Dec 9, 2012
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    Foreign policy complicates the whole piece.
     
  9. ASU55RR

    ASU55RR Member+

    Jul 31, 2004
    Brooklyn, NY/Brno,CZ
    Club:
    FC Zbrojovka Brno
    Nat'l Team:
    Czechia
    Foreign Policy (and probably some ageism on my part) is why I'm currently supporting Warren more than Sanders (his outlined policy isn't so bad, but he has made some dumb statements/choices over the years that would bite him in an election). On the initial question of this thread: I think making an uncompromising push for popular policy solutions that keep American quality of life from falling behind other developed country is not counterrevolution, and I definitely do think it is the way to win.

    I'm an immigrant from the former Eastern Bloc sphere whose family came here for advancement opportunity in the 1990s. Now as 30-something, my American born wife is constantly suggesting that we move back to where I was born because better healthcare, no mass incarceration, and many other QOL advantages such as years of maternity leave.

    Respectively disagreeing with regressive power grabs and trusting the inertia of institutional norms doesn't win, at best it delays.
     
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  10. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    I need to get off my ass and copyright the phrase "Bernie Sandinista" to sell that shit to the MAGA hat crowd, should Sanders win the nomination.
     
  11. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    And to the leftiest left of his fanclub.
     
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  12. Boandlkramer

    Boandlkramer Member+

    Apr 9, 2009
    Samma Weltmeister!
    Club:
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    Interesting...

    “noun
    a member of a left-wing Nicaraguan political organization, the Sandinista National Liberation Front (FSLN), which came to power in 1979 after overthrowing the dictator Anastasio Somoza. Opposed during most of their period of rule by the **US-backed** Contras, the Sandinistas were voted out of office in 1990.”

    We just can’t stay out of south/central America’s business can we?

    It’s the easy go-to isn’t it? FrEeDoM!!!!!
     
  13. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    #38 Dr. Wankler, Mar 14, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2019
    I know who and what "Sandinista" means. I also know that Ortega's actions of late haven't exactly been, for lack of a better word, excessively democratic. The negative ads will literally write themselves.

    EDIT: And just to be clear: Like you say in the other thread, I will vote for any of the Democrats in the field against Trump. Or Pence. If Sanders comes out of the convention on the ticket, that's my vote.

    Unless somehow the Democrats run a ticket consisting of Charles Manson and Tex Watson, that's my vote.
     
  14. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
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    Chicago Red Stars
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    United States
    Fidel Castro also overthrew a dictator that was backed by the USA, Fidel's human rights and democratic record afterwards was not very good.

    Similar with the Sandinista. Is not as bad as being pro Hugo Chavez and Maduro, but in the same ballpark.
     
  15. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
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    The Democratic tea party will be as helpful as the GOP tea party.

    1106752139404075010 is not a valid tweet id
     
  16. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Well, except that the GOP Tea Party votes for GOP candidates on a consistent basis. A lot of the campus-based far left, like the woke folks in antifa, doesn't vote consistently, if at all.
     
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  17. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
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    Argentina
    At this point the American political institutions have been weakened and discredited significantly. I will vote for the candidate from either party who will be most likely to help strengthen the institutions. Obviously it's hard to imagine somebody worse than Trump in that regard, but any candidate who's more interested in his ideology than in preserving and strengthening the democratic institutions will be problematic for the nation at this juncture, regardless of what he/she stands for.
     
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  18. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
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    Chicago Red Stars
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    United States
    Where do you place people like Mich McConnel and other GOP figures that let him get away with it?
     
  19. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    While I recognize that politically they were put in a very difficult position by Trump's win and behavior, I still view them as cowards with no backbone. They are enablers who contribute to the discrediting of the institutions that hold this country's system together.
     
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  20. Funkfoot

    Funkfoot Member+

    May 18, 2002
    New Orleans, LA
    That is just nuts. What connection does Chelsea Clinton have to the massacre in New Zealand? What a dumbass.
     
  21. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
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    United States
    She did not defend Representative Omar regarding the AIPAC comments. No kidding, that is what this was about.
     
  22. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    She's Hillary's daughter. One way or another, everything bad that happens always gets traced back to Hillary.
     
  23. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    To their credit, Democrats don't often nominate candidates who get the extreme left excited. Republicans do that much more often with the extreme right.
     
  24. Q*bert Jones III

    Q*bert Jones III The People's Poet

    Feb 12, 2005
    Woodstock, NY
    Club:
    DC United
    How's that working out for them?
     
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  25. argentine soccer fan

    Staff Member

    Jan 18, 2001
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Club:
    CA Boca Juniors
    Nat'l Team:
    Argentina
    So far it's kept them from nominating a populist extremist presidential candidate likely to win an election in the short term and destroy the party for the foreseeable future, so I'd say it's a pretty good strategy.
     

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