Do you get off on all this shit talking or are you actually this pig headed you're going to stick to your wild guess to the end? Remember that time you claimed Motta was the better player at PSG, On the French team of the year as well (no he wasn't) and then went like a weasel to the PSG thread asking how Motta was doing this year and that was he better than Verratti. You were laughed at. Found out to be guessing. If you were a serious poster you would have just held your hands up 2 years ago, admitted to being wrong and all would be forgotten.
None of those quotes contradict anything I said. I wanted Verratti to have some competition for his spot. I'm actually not as high on him as others on this site (and said that a few times). But you actually insult him and appear to think he's not worthy of even making the squad (while I think he's a starter but should not be untouchable if playing poorly). That's crazy. I'm saying he might be somewhat overhyped, your basically saying he sucks. Big difference... As for Immobile, even now I think Gabbs is better. I just said that a few days ago. I still think that Immobile would be better off the bench. And that comment you pulled up... specifically mentions how Immobile's only scored three goals for Dortmund. Again, that's in line with my belief on form during a domestic season.
Why am I not surprised that you would ignore the rational and well thought out responses to your ludicrous claims with a spineless cop out response where you can tuck your tail between your legs and try to exit this thread without being noticed? It's too late tutufan, the jig is up, even IAF is on to you now, lulz!
I don't understand why societal discourse has become so pigheaded. No human is right 100% of the time, and yet we approach dialogue about politics or sports as if we are infallible and the other side never has any merit. We all make mistakes in our evaluation of players. It's no mystery I think Verratti is supremely talented. Heck, he's been my avatar now for a couple years. I'd rate him as top 5 CM in the world. However, does he have room to get better? Sure. He absolutely can make every pass in the book. He's hard nosed. Immense dribbling skill. He has it all. I still think he has to work on his tempo. He prefers a slower build up. There are times I'd like him to be more direct and/or to attack people on the dribble. Some of that may be coaching or design. Being direct means more risk of dispossession and his manager may not want that given he is the last line of defense in the midfield. I think Tottifan is a very good poster. I just don't know why he can't bring himself to acknowledge that Verratti continues to become a better player. Why do we have to assume he's reached a ceiling and will never get better? Never win anything?
By the way, I think this board would be a lot better when we admit the times we were wrong about players. There were a lot of players I thought would eventually become world class that never amounted to much....Abate, Montolivo, Aquilani, etc. I'm a big fan of SES and Saponara, but they haven't taken the next step yet. I thought Bonucci was solid, but I never thought he'd become world class because of his pace. He's proven me wrong. Of course, I think I got Belotti, Gabbs, Bernardeschi, and Verratti right. I think I'll get Rugani and Romagnoli very right as well. Win some lose some.
On this point I said this 2 years ago when tottifan was going off in this then as well. The kid has it all. Zeman picked him as a playmaker, a talented attacking midfielder and made him into that player that was a joy to watch in a different role from deep. Has he a slower build up...Now yes. But that's tactics and the team setup he finds himself in. It's rare to see a brain like his from anyone never mind someone so young and I have no doubts that if he was put in a system again that demanded him to speed up his game and become more direct he would adjust. He has it all and yes still lots to grow on. All the top teams in the world would crawl over broken glass to get a chance at his signature. There is no doubt he is amongst the best in the world.
I am not sure about Gabbiadini. I kind of predicted him to become world class and while he is better since he moved to EPL, I am still not sure yet. We'll wait and see. I always knew SES was gonna flop. Wasn't so sure about Saponara though. I expected him to be a good player, but not world class.
SES will always look world class in a false 9 system that's free flowing and he can move loosely across the pitch. His ability to link with a forward is no existence and thus makes him extremely limited. I'm hoping Roma can sell him off the back of his extremely impressive highlight reel to the highest bidder in the EPL. And I can see an offer of 20 pushing to 30million from teams like West Hams, Everton etc level. At 24 he can go to England and play on has instincts and still get a move to a big side again in a couple of years. Englands play on instinct will suit him if he adjusts to the physical side. Talented in what he does, his skill set is just way to narrow to be relied upon.
IAF is going down the wrong path in having faith in Roma. @Calcio Pauly please talk some sense into that boy. He's only going as far back as the Garcia days.
Well to be honest Napoli are a good team as well, and quite comparable to Roma. I am honestly not surprised.
It's one thing being right making predictions based on young talent that either pan our or not, but this thread seems to have a pandemic (ok maybe not so infectious) of posters who want to be like "I told you that guy was going to be awesome! So look at me because I have this impeccable insight into the game" Yeah, you hit some, and some you miss. And if we were to take every prospective Italian talent and mention them each time, we'd miss more than we hit, because that's just the way things go. Here, let me play that game... "Hey guys, at least in so far as I know, I'm the first person to mention Federico Chiesa in the national team forums, so when/if he pans out, you'll all remember that I told you so first, and I'm going to remind you over and over again." What's the point of that? Let me list a few others too, just in case; Scamacca, Kean. So that if they turn out to be greats, I can say that I was talking about them for a long time too. Look, there's nothing wrong with acknowledging prospects, talent, etc, so I'm not shitting on anyone doing so. I just find the practice of "Hey I called him out a long time ago, so look at me, I'm so smart" a bit silly. Acknowledge the talent they have in youth and then hope it translates into full time first team play, then European comp and finally International. Nothing wrong with that. Imagine if Balotelli screwed his head on. Cassano? What if Santon really turned into the next Maldini and what if Macheda, who we've all forgotten about, really became the new Vieri? We would have won another tournament by now, wouldn't we? There's a whole lot more "talent" that doesn't translate than does. I remember people being excited about Aquilani and Montolivo as being the next torch bearers, and all but at least one understands that's long past and never going to happen. On the flipside, when one who has been proving himself at that level for several years against the best clubs in Europe continually gets called worthless, then it's become a practice of butt soreness taken to epic extremes. Can he improve? Yeah. Do we all hope he does? Most of us, anyway. But that's such a stupid argument because most players can improve until they fully mature some time in their late 20's, early 30's. So it too is just a way of avoiding admitting you've been wrong about a player because when he does that one magical pass that leads to a goal that elevates his club or country to some perceived status you can say, I've always said that I think he could be he never did. Then there's just adding insult to injury when players like Pavoletti and Montolivo are hailed as something special. There's no rational discourse possible. My good friend Forrest Gump always said stupid is as stupid does, and if stupid wants to say stupid stuff, then how can stupid expect rational discourse? Not possible. PS - and IAF, listen to Toronto Soccer about whatever he's telling you...and if you're looking for a new club to support, rather than Juve, Milan is your club. It's just a matter of time before we sell and some Trump-like figure makes us great again
Your first paragraph is spot on. Everyone has a right to their opinion. Unfortunately there are many posters who lose it because they can't put together rational arguments in defence of their positions and so resort to childish insults etc. Verratti does not have it all. If he did he would play centrally closer to the forwards. His shooting is sub-par, he is small, for a player who plays so deep (close to his own defenders) his long-range passing is poor. And he is often less than direct (as you said). Where am I wrong? With all these flaws how can he be top 5? He has improved since his early PSG days though I'll give you that.
Pandore from the PSG forum came on these boards and openly admitted I schooled her. Motta has a highly decorated career, Verratti has still achieved next to nothing. Its a fair comparison to make especially given their respective roles at the time i said it.
No drama. We broadly agree on Verratti, overhyped but good enough to make the squad. Although I clearly rate him lower than you. Immobile is only good off the bench because he needs lots of space to operate (if for example the opposition is behind and are chasing the game.) From observing him play I said before the 2014 World Cup that he lacks a good first touch which will prevent him from ever becoming truly world class. Incidentally i saw a stat recently that he has the the most turnovers from first touches in the league. We disagree on Eder and Montolivo.
Goebbels you're up to your old lies again. Everyone watched her shred every weasely trick you tried. @Pandore
Seriously who gives a shit. If they dont win jack shit then all this talked about talent means nothing.
Haha oh my god, thank you for the laugh. I'll be honest though, I'd love for the club to hire totti fan. We can unleash him on any prospective buyers for Verratti and they'll end up going back home with Motta instead. Though unfortunately, I have a feeling Motta will lose his player of the year award during the move.
Anyone that cares about the national team and Italian soccer is okay in my book. I may disagree with much of what Tottifan says, but I will readily admit that he's an essential poster on these boards. Saponara is a good one. Many of us were probably wrong about him. It seems I overrated Soriano as well. But the biggest one I got wrong was definitely Andrea Poli. I really expected him to be (at minimum) a solid squad member for many years to come. That one definitely didn't pan out. I think with Verratti, some posters cut him more slack than they would with other players. Not sure why that is, but he's got a bunch of competition coming up through the ranks soon. I think that's a good thing. We'll see what he's made of. Personally, I think he's up for the challenge and will win his spot. We can't underestimate the effect Ventura may have on Immobile's international career. Ciro has played well in the last few fixtures, and his domestic form for Lazio is also good. One thing we can't deny, Immobile will fight for the shirt. He's not the most talented CF we could put out there, but his chemistry with Belotti seems legit.
what's your attacking lineup look like at the moment? I don't follow Serie A so much but was watching the Southampton-Watford match. Gabbiadini and Okaka I'm curious where they are in the depth.
It depends on the formation. My selections would be..... If 4 3 3.... ---------------Belotti---------------- Bernardeschi--Candreva/Berardi If 4 2 4.... ---------Belotti--Gabbiadini------- Bernardeschi--Candreva/Berardi Something like 4 2 3 1 might be interesting also.... -----------------Belotti------------------------ Insigne--Bernardeschi--Candreva/Berardi For me, Gabbiadini should be second choice at CF behind Andrea Belotti. I think Ventura will probably consider him number three behind Belotti/Immobile. Either way he should make the squad in March. Okaka is not good enough IMO. Better players at that position. Candreva is the starting RW at the moment, but Berardi will probably take that spot in the future.
Honestly at this rate I am not even sure. Ventura might start a whole new team this international break. I have a feeling Belotti and Bernardeschi will start but I am not sure who else. Maybe Candreva, maybe Gabbiadini, maybe Bonaventura. Also I have no idea about the formation either.
Ah yes, because that wasn't as obvious as it gets when it comes to being sarcastic. (to avoid any misunderstanding, ^ that is also an example )