Vancouver vs. TFC March 18

Discussion in 'Vancouver Whitecaps' started by Kingston, Mar 15, 2017.

  1. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    Coming over as a TFC fan.

    I'm curious to know how Vancouver fans see this upcoming game. TFC hasn't exactly shone in their first two matched may be missing Giovinco. Vancouver, on the other hand, has also had some early season issues and is coming of a mid-week CCL game. Are you optimistic or pessimistic about this one?

    Also, more broadly, how do you view TFC in terms of rivalry? I'm assume not as highly as your Cascadian fellows but are games against TFC noteworthy for you?
     
  2. hot potato

    hot potato Member+

    Feb 21, 2014
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    simply put- TFC is a better team with a better MF- even without gio, i favor TO to win

    the games vs TO and montreal should be like the cascadia IMO, but this club does a poor job of marketing these types of rivalries- to gain new supporters and STHs, the Caps should be hyping games against TO, seattle, Montreal, portland and LA- offering a special 5 game pak for these games would get a higher imprint in vancouver which is stagnating IMO- these games could at least fill the lower bowl and then take it up to 40 000 over a few years

    instead, the Caps owners seem content to staying smallish to middling, much like our players and salaries

    i am not expecting any significant push to be MLS Cup contenders- the odd playoff game and cascadia or canada cup seems to satisfy- i want more because this a great market, but it lacks serious owners who are serious about aiming to be the best
     
  3. OldFan2015

    OldFan2015 Member

    Nov 29, 2015
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    I wish the rivalry was more heated, but to be honest one of the things that really makes rivalries is large numbers of visiting fans in each other's grounds. Due to distances in Canada, we can't have that with TO. They are important to me and to the fans, just not with the same level of heat as the Cascadia clubs.

    Our supporters can get to Seattle and Portland easy (border issues aside!) and at low cost.. getting to TO (and their fans vice versa) takes time commitments, airplanes, money, etc.

    Our biggest rivals are Seattle and Portland for sure. As for TO, we have the Canadian Championship tournament. Problem there is the games are usually lackluster as they play B and C teams most of the time, it just isn't the same.

    This is a game the Caps should win with Giovinco out and being at home. If they don't, there should be some serious questions about Robinson's 4 year contract (I already have those questions of course, I don't think he is a very good coach... however, the general fanbase seems to still like him a lot). These guys are professional athletes and played on Tuesday only one time zone apart. They have several days in between it isn't like they will be run ragged. That is not an excuse.
     
  4. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    I admit I'm watching the Vancouver market from Ontario but I am surprised the Whitecaps don't try something like what you're recommending. Games against those five teams should be easier to market. Even if they don't offer a special package, at least the idea of promoting them as rivalry type games and opening the lower bowl.

    In fairness, I don't think TFC does as much as it could to promote Vancouver as a rival. Montreal for sure and the team doesn't even need to do anything to make that happen. After that, though, they seem more interested in generating buzz against the New York teams than against Vancouver. I think they should upsell the Canadian rival angle more here, too.
     
  5. OldFan2015

    OldFan2015 Member

    Nov 29, 2015
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    The Whitecaps don't try it because they lack creativity and vision. Quite frankly, they don't want to grow the attendance beyond 21 or 22 ..... they would have done it long ago if they did. That is their "comfort zone" and they seem to want to be comfortable. in 2015 season they would turn away 3000+ people for tickets to our Cascadia matches because they wanted to keep the tarped sections for some bizarre "this will create long term season ticket holders" idea.

    The Whitecaps are going to continue to be dreadful under Carl Robinson so attendance is going to hurt no matter the visiting team. It is going to be a long long year for players and fans , which is unfortunate.

    I miss a guy like Teitur, heck, I miss Martin Rennie at this point... Carl has lost me, lost his players, and I hope the market finally wakes up.
     
  6. hot potato

    hot potato Member+

    Feb 21, 2014
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    do you miss tommy soehn?? who, IYO, has been the best whitecap coach since joining MLS? my answer would be winger- but i all seriousness, i think the Caps should have stuck with teitur as i dont think he really got a fair shake and time with a weak expansion team
     
  7. OldFan2015

    OldFan2015 Member

    Nov 29, 2015
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    No, I don't miss Soehn. I was revolted at what he did to Teitur after building him a very poor squad ,and he was terrible as head coach and lost the room. He seems to have done fine as an assistant and good for him.

    The best coach we had out of the four was Teitur. However, he never really had a chance to show because he was given a poor team (Soehn built it), had several injuries during that season, and was sacked in 12 matches. I remember arguing with the Southsiders after he got canned and they had a general feeling that he was not good enough for MLS. Considering who we have had since, I think they were very wrong. Plus he was a quality man and not a smooth talking snake like Carl has turned out to be. Players also wanted to give their all for Teitur and that can not be underestimated as to its importance.
     
  8. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    I totally understand the idea of limiting supply to keep demand high. I don't doubt they would draw fewer fans if the entire stadium was open. That said, I don't understand why they don't aim at a full lower bowl (which is what, 27 000?) instead of a partly tarped off lower bowl.

    I'm quite surprised at this. Vancouver had previously done a great job as an organization of running a competitive team year after year. As a TFC fan, when Vancouver entered the league, I fully dreaded seeing Vancouver quickly put together at top notch team while TFC continued to wallow in incompetent leadership. (As a TFC fan I'm not sad to be wrong but I am surprised.)
     
  9. hot potato

    hot potato Member+

    Feb 21, 2014
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    correction- vancouver has never had a top-notch team- we have had 1 home playoff game in 6 years and this year is heading south also- we really havent been much better than TFC was for its first 6 years- its only when ambitious new owners, an inspired new FO and a soccer-intelligent new head coach came together that the Reds fortunes turned- Vancouver has none of that
     
  10. Kingston

    Kingston Member+

    Oct 6, 2005
    ^ I meant that the organization was usually successful before they joined MLS. I expected them to continue that tradition of success into MLS. They haven't and that surprised me.
     
  11. hot potato

    hot potato Member+

    Feb 21, 2014
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    its also surprised us soccer lovers of the whitecaps- even if they had a bad year, you knew the club would fix the problems and make the next year better- the club was always ambitious to be the best, an elite team in any league they were in

    since 2011 and MLS, that has not been the case and the continuing results reflect that- i blame a disengaged ownership group that doesnt give a crap as long as their investment is making money... and it has in the millions- any sports organization- or business for that matter- that continues with a PLAN that has negative results year-after-year, except for the odd blip, and then rewards the leaders in charge a new 4 year contract is really out-of-touch with soccer reality

    and we are seeing signs of that in growing numbers of STHs not even coming to the games even though the ticket is paid for- when a team looses those committed supporters, it will be tough to get them back- just ask the BC Lions and the canucks about that
     
  12. OldFan2015

    OldFan2015 Member

    Nov 29, 2015
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    The organization was great when it was a small business in a lower tier type of league. As soon as we hit the top division where millions of dollars are on the line, ownership has kept running it like the USL days with no ambition to be any more and so we have this problem we face today.

    The mere fact they are willing to accept losing results from their coach, and reward it for four more years, is really the most damning evidence we have of their lack of serious goals.

    If they have an epiphany and sack Carl and start over, I will have hope. but really, If I were to drop as small bet in Vegas, I would say Carl is back in 2018. Which is all I need to know about the vision of this club.
     
  13. hot potato

    hot potato Member+

    Feb 21, 2014
    Club:
    Vancouver Whitecaps
    if that happens- and i dont see us having a successful 2017 season- we have 1/9 points so far with LA coming in april 1; the team as a whole are a mess and could be a worse repeat from 2016- and the owners keep with their PLAN and keep the same FO and coaching staff, i will not be renewing my STs for 2018- i dont reward continuing failure and spin doctoring, lack of ambition and poor entertainment with my hard-earned money and a 1 1/2 hour trip to the stadium

    for 40 years, i have loved watching soccer and the Whitecaps, but i wont support this dog and pony show,,, and i think others are beginning to reach the same conclusion

    anytime the head coach looses the belief of the players and supporters, its all downhill
     

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