I squintuit that the system may never work. What makes you so optimistic? Berhalter and the players he's chosen have proved absolutely nothing so far. Just adding Pulisic and McKennie to the GC mix may add nothing as well.
Hey... it is another silly strawman from the MLS crew. All Berhalter had to do is acknowledge how difficukt it is to assess our pool of players since they play in an array leagues at different levels and use the March camp to call in the topm20 or so euro based guys. After looking at them with handful of guys from the January camp, he could picked his team from the top players at the two camps. Not hard at all. Instead, we have this roster filled with crap MLS players.
I say this in all sincerity: I admire your optimism. Maybe it's just the repeated letdowns US Soccer has given me lately but Egg's choices so far lead me with no other choice but to believe he's in over his head or people over him are forcing him to do stupid things. I simply can't see how you can take a look at our player pool and conclude that playing a wonky formation with an inverted RB and very limited training time makes sense. That's not innovative or the American way, it's stubborn ignorance. I've been a fan of Barcelona forever and it reminds me of the period between Cruyff and Guardiola where they kept getting new managers with different ideas and a meddling board. Momentum kept them going for a few years then the slide began. Guardiola came in and basically told the board to eff off and he was going to play the kids from the academy who understood the Barcelona way and culture and it led to, in my opinion, the greatest run in modern soccer. At a certain point, we have to realize what American soccer is when it's at its best. So we may not have a Busquets waiting in the wings but we have a Tyler Adams whose work rate and tenacity are the embodiment of the type of player that has made the US successful in the past. Same with McKennie. Pulisic is a more driven Donovan. We have some pieces that could lead to a free-flowing attack. We need to build around their strengths and play some defenders who will get stuck in and get the ball to our stars. I actually think Dave Sarachan realized this albeit he often went too unnecessarily defensive. Holy crap I can't believe I'm defending him. Egg needs to keep it simple and build around our best players AT THEIR BEST POSITIONS and fill in around them. Doing that alone would almost guarantee us no worse than second in Concacaf. If he doesn't figure that out I predict we will have another miserable cycle.
I agree with your mindset. The France friendly everyone crows about absolutely is an illustrative point. Yes, we tied the World Cup Champs 1-1 in a friendly. We were oushot something like 19-2 and SOG were 8-1. We scored on our ONE SOG. So yes, we bunkered and we frustrated the French in a game they really didn't care much about. But playing like that ... does the USMNT get better? Yes, we can hope the next generation is just better players. But at some point we need to try to play a better type of soccer. If for nothing else than to develop the muscle as a team. Having a plan while in possession doesn't mean you have to have overwhelming possession for it to work. You can use it even if you don't -- the quick passing, the knowing where to be, the movement designed to create openings; this will all yield benefits. It's also program wide, or that's the clear intent. That will signal to youth players and players everywhere that they need to improve their skillset. If they want to play on the national team, they need to practice their on ball skills and passing in their spare time even if it isn't a priority for their club team. Because that's how you make the squad. And at the end, if we lose the Gold Cup because of it, who cares? There's plenty of time to change over to a vanilla defensive style before we get to qualification. I know people have a lot of mistrust of US Soccer. But I can't get freaked out over friendly losses, no matter how it looked. No one ever implemented a system without a dip in form. I can look back to the Quakes this year -- they looked AWFUL for the first month under Almeyda. And then, despite a real lack of talent, they've looked pretty good.
Yup. To reply to you and the Gorilla above at once... I care a ton, but mostly because I'm such a fan. And of course that makes me bitch every day and throw things at the tv/internet but have this totally optimistic vision of the horizon I can believe we're moving toward. We're the real US fans. So I'm on board with poor performances if I can believe in the plan and view them as growing pains. Bruce, Bob, Klinsi and Bruce again each in their own way wanted us to "have faith in the process" when it didn't look like progress, and would respond with arrogance rather than try to explain what they were trying to do. With Berhalter, I think the plan is progressive rather than primitive, and scrutible. Having been dealt all the blows we have, from the 2014 World Cup to being dominated by Mexico again, to losing in early rounds of the Gold Cup and failing to qualify for the Olypics, ConFed Cup and World Cup... I can handle an underwhelming Gold Cup three years before the World Cup, when we're under major renovation with an inspiring plan.
This is a good post too, but I don't think we have - or even can - build our national team plan around whatever positions a couple 20 year olds happen to be playing at the moment. McKennie has been everywhere and not always good. We're just coming to agree that Pulisic is best out wide - but that could change! Certainly there are still US fans insisting that Pulisic be our #10. (Whereas those 8/10 slots could be made for Puli, McKennie or even Adams when we want to pressure high.) Seriously, 20 year olds' form can swing wildly. And what would you say if next season, Adams was a flank player. Would that change all our national team plans? (And nobody mentions it, but is it so dumb to have one of our best, most athletic competitors available as a right flank nullifier when it's common for a team's primary attacking threat to be a right footed, inverted winger?)
This is actually a good discussion. The main argument I make against what you both are saying is that the type of experiments Egg has done so far are non-sensical ones. What realistically are we going to learn by playing a 3-2-2-3? That Bradley and Trapp need help to play against good teams at the 6? That the system goes completely bust without Tyler Adams there? Both those things are already proven. Here are the type of experiments I would like to see: 1 - Against a Concacaf minnow like Guyana, let's play with some attacking fullbacks like Robinson/Garza on the left and maybe Lima on the right and see if we can use the extra numbers going forward to break down a bunker. 2 - Pulisic and Holmes - can they be interchangeable throughout a game at outside forward and #10. Holmes plays some of both for club. If that experiment works, it will make it much harder for Pulisic to get marked out of a game. 3 - McKennie and Adams as double pivot - obviously we can't see it in Gold Cup but we need to see it asap. It's the most logical solution to many of our problems. 4 - Counter-Attacks - With Pulisic, Boyd, McKennie, and even Altidore as decent quick combiners, we should have a functional counter-attack. The thing about playing out of the back is you're trying to suck an opponent up to open up space behind them but we never seem to find those spaces. Can we start hitting those balls? For me, that is coaching. 5 - Formations that emphasize the strengths of our pool - this is a big one for me. I get that positions can change and evolve over time but any time you have a depth chart of one for a position, something is amiss. One final point before this gets too long, I think the youth setup should emulate the senior team in style but not necessarily in formation. We have to use the strength of each team to get the best players on the field but they need to know that as a USMNT at any level, we are trying to connect passes out of the back to spring a counter, play the channel to speedy wingers to use their 1 v 1 skills, etc. Whatever our style is going to be, we can emphasize that utilizing formations that best suit each team. This isn't like Ajax where we can just plug and play. I do agree with the larger point that having the youth teams mimic the senior team to the extent possible is well worth the effort.
Wait, which case are you making? If you're saying Bruce and GB arrogantly eschewed the big established names in favor of the lesser knowns at home who best knew and represented the US way and culture, I don't entirely agree with you, let alone think it's the key to our success.
Basically that we have entered that dangerous territory where we have meddling higher powers and tinkerers as coaches which is always a recipe for disaster. We need to keep things relatively simple and go back to doing what the USMNT used to do while using our most skilled group of young attackers to actually play a more free-flowing offense than we could have in previous decades. It's probably been 02' that we've had this many high-ceiling attacking players in our pool. Defense and keeper is another story but I think we have guys that can defend hard, they just don't offer much going forward (Cannon is an example of this type of player) which makes the current setup pretty difficult for them.
Totally agree - I think the way GB is currently addressing this, with the senior team as a model, is by talking about principles of emphasis. What's our angle / fundamental values, how do we try to play?
That was a terrible performance. Here was Portugal's side: POR: 22-António Pimparel; 2-Nelson Semedo, 3-Pepe (4-Luis Neto, 10), 24-Ricardo Ferreira, 5-Vitorino Antunes; 8-Bruno Fernandes (10-João Eduardo, 46), 13-Danilo Pereira (6-Ruben Neves, 62); 14-Manuel Fernandes, 17-Bruma (11-Bernardo Silva, 62), 18-Gelson Martins (19-Gonçalo Paciência, 46); 7-Gonçalo Guedes (16-Marcos Lopes, 81) Their WC side just months earlier in KO round v. Uruguay was Patricio, Guerrero, Pepe, Fonte, Mario, Ronaldo, Bernardo and Adrien Silva, William, Ricardo, Guedes Essentially Portugal was playing all new players apart from Guedes and a half hour from B.Silva. We can hardly count Pepe who hobbled off after 10 minutes. After a few adjustments from Portugal, we were totally incapable of mounting a serious challenge.
I guess maybe, but I don't have a huge argument if he was aiming for more continuity from camp to camp at this stage.
That whole trying to come out playing from the back, keeping possession, passing it around, slowing the tempo, becoming more "tactical," etc. isn't the usual modus operandi for a new NT coach until he loses enough games and reverts to the defend-at-all-costs-and-hope-for-the-counters style that has made us (in)famous?
Yup. With MB90 in CM, the USMNT was routinely dominated in midfield with corresponding, near constant pressure on the defense. Defender A eventually falters and he gets lit up on the media and BS. MB90 escapes accountability, ironically because he is virtually invisible as the opposition midfield breezes right around him. That MB90 is still in the CM conversation doesn't portend well for 2022.
You are correct that there is nothing to suggest that FJ told Berhalter that, other than he's not been called up but has been in communication with him, and they have a playing history together (GGG has been accused of "nepotism" by several posters, so that would seem to apply here as well). He's also been injured, so that's a possible reason for his exclusion (could be either player or coach's call). I also think A Robinson has lots of potential. He did play like shit against Jamaica, but we didn't see training either. He may have looked bad there, too. When I was watching that game, he was the earliest to stand out as really really bad on the day, and I made a mental note that he looked like he had no idea what Berhalter wanted from him. I know that doesn't speak volumes given the whole team's play, but at this time perhaps he's just not excelling and a weak player like Lovitz at least gets the game plan.
I'm not in the "MLS crew". Or maybe I am since I don't have a hard-on for Novakovic or Tim Chandler. I also don't have a hard-on for Baird, Lovitz, Omar, Bradley, Trapp, Roldan, Arriola or pretty much anyone else available at this point (other than Sargent, I do have a hard-on for him). We mostly have mediocre players in any league, with a whole lot of youth potential coming through the pipeline which may or may not pan out.
That just sounds like one of the many ridiculous excuses to justify Berhalter not having any consistent approach to find the most talented or highest potential players. The inconsistencies of those excuses have been flowing all year. why would he want consistency in March and then mix up to have the mess we just saw before the GC? Euro based players were limited in March supposedly so he could continue work with the same inept players. After those games, he suggested he needed to simplify the system. He now called in a right back that he doesnt think can play the silly hybrid role. The arguments for Berhalter are just a moving target. it starting to look like he doesnt know what he is doing and just trying things out. A bunch of small pointless experiments inside the larger experiment to see if they can get a team with mostly MLS players to not suck.
Then why did you suggest he did? He also didnt tell Arena he didnt want to play outside back. I have no explanation why FJ hasnt been called in based on the other playere who have been kept around. If you want veteran leadership, it would make sense to pick a player at a position we are weak and has a understanding of more tactical approaches to the game instead of CB who cant play out of the back. It is a shame nobody in our media has gotten an answer from Berhalter and/or FJ.
I didn't "suggest" that he did, I suggested that it's a possibility, along with another legitimate possibility as to why Fabian Johnson isn't here (injury). I said "Fabian Johnson (but, just perhaps, he told Berhalter he doesn't want to play left back--he has said as much under a previous coach)". I completely and wholeheartedly agree that it is a shame that nobody in our soccer media has the balls to ask these questions of the coach. It's the only way we on BS would ever get anything more than "legitimate possibilities" to work with. EDIT: Further, Berhalter said in March “When I look at his profile and look at his position and being an outside back and the demands of an outside back and I’m projecting towards 2022, he’s one that’s right on the borderline. It’s a tough one.”
Maybe a hot take but: perhaps Fabian Johnson doesn't get call-ups because he's proven to be entirely underwhelming. I mean, so have Trapp, Roldan etc. so yes, the MLS thing is still an issue. But let's not act like it's crazy to rate Johnson poorly.
The TYAC guys are pretty tight with Fabian. They said recently that FJ told USSF he wants to come back and will play anywhere, anytime. FJ has not heard back.