USA vs Nigeria U20 Women's World Cup Quarter Final Su-7/25/2010 [R]

I have no idea, I felt so bad for her because I didn't feel that the Nigerian player needed to be that physical and shove her down like that. I know that it happens in these games but OUCH! She looked really messed up by that incident and I felt rather angered by that. I hope that whatever happened to her she is able to heal and become healthy again.

 

There was a shot of her walking around on the sidelines after the game finished, so apparently it wasn't as bad as it first looked.

 

Finally got the chance to see the match.

This thread went wild today........ Here are the points made so nicely today that I agree with.

Players were not playing to win and were complacent. Send them all down and revisit the pool and other regional players.

The were out matched, out coached and lacking fundamentals at every level. It was a gift that they even made it to Pk's. The match was really not that close in terms of play.

Younger players need to play age appropriate and not take roles for players who are better equiped to play at that level. So many never even saw playing time, then they shouldn't have been there to begin with.

No focus on posession, they looked like a local club team at times, and Nigeria looked very skilled and organized. The were there to win and beat the US girls at every opportunity. Physical, yes, but if you can't play it, your gonna get beat.

Coaching........ joke. Agree with several posters on so many points. She is there to recruit for her university team! Many of these players have been there too long and they think there spots are guaranteed. Send them all down, open up the pool and regional teams and lets see who really wants to play.

What a mess......

 

From a neutral's view (moi'), the game was a tale of two halves. However, I think the Nigerian coach had the tactics right from the start. Hammer the US women till they get flustered and break. Whenever you see a team play this many longballs, it's usually because they don't want to take the tackles or fear. I'm leaning towards the tackles, because some of those were borderline malicious. That last one on the right back, Quon, wow. Nigerian forward had no chance to win it, Quon heads it away, and the forward hammers her anyway. If this were hockey, we'd call this 'finishing the hit', but I never seen this much vicous tackling in a U-20 women's game, for sure. That is one way to stop the ping-pong passing through the midfield. I'm not advocating it, but it's defintely one way to stop it.

Quick notes on your US team throughout the tourney:

Offense: Your star Leroux seems to be very wasteful. Could of locked up the golden boot in the first round alone if she finished more of her chances. Against my country, she could of had 5-6 goals, but she's a beast. Tall, strong, and fast. I'm sure she will have a bright future ahead of her in future WNT games. Not sure who else up top posed any sort of credible threat.

Defense: And no worries on your defense. The US defense is arguably the best in the tourney/world. Your women have size and strength, but miss a bomber that can deliver a longball from the back. Your fullbacks don't seem very adventurous from what I can tell in this tourney though.

Midfield: Great size and ballwinning ability. Lacks a maestro in the mold of Foudy/Lilly/Akers or something of the like or on the opposite end, a defensive shield like a Shannon Boxx but as a group, the midfield is solid. Seemed reluctant to take a hit though especially against the Nigerians.

Good tourney, nothing to be ashamed of ladies. Hold your heads high.

 

Does anyone know why Noyola and Dimartino didn't play? I also agree with the last poster regarding younger players that were brought on to fill the roster spot while capable age appropriate players were left home. If a younger player is not good enough to start or contribute significant minutes, she should stay home. All in all, the team still has enough talents to be in the final four or win the tournament but it lacked chemistry and field leadership.

 

That's exactly what I am talking about. I don't see her as a distributor, I see her as a killer.

 

They showed that game 3 times today already, I don't think they will show it again. The only way you can watch it is if you can access ESPN360.com, you can rewatch all the U-20 WWC games there.

 

If you can get access to it:

http://espn.go.com/espn3/player?id=29031&league=FIFA

 

About Sydney L...Other prominent players have also failed to convert penalties at the crucial time...Landon Donovan missed one during the MLS Cup final last year...John Terry missed one in Moscow...Gyan missed one against Uruguay during the WC...She shouldn't really feel so bad about the PK...

I am sure that she will score numerous goals for UCLA in the upcoming season and put this experience behind her...

Maybe Coach Pia could take Sydney to WC next year...Of course, Rodriguez and Wambach should be first choice strikers...But, maybe Coach Pia could put Sydney in when USWNT is ahead by 3 or more goals...

I think USWNT could have beaten Mexico easily...Instead, S. Korea got Mexico instead...


I believed that USWNT was capable of beating Nigeria without being in the PK shootout...Maybe I expected too much...

 

I just finished watching the game. I haven't read through the whole thread, most likely my thoughts have already been mentioned, nevertheless .....

NGA deserved to advance. PK shootout showed how poorly USA managed this game. NGA had free rein in midfield, their penetration was appalling, 3-man midfield is made of swiss cheese, too many holes, Mewis & Nairn are mediocre 2-way players, Brooks is average at best, wingers don't track back.

No organization in attack, just kick-and-run. Nairn played poorly the entire tournament & Ellis is blind to this development. how can someone like this ever ascend to the WNT level? Nairn's failure at this level can be summed up by her dumb foul to concede the set piece that led to the tying goal, and of course failing the PK. Missing PKs - a Jill Ellis kind of player.

I'm biased, but Noyola is so much better at running a team and managing the game. The one thing that Noyola excels at is making her teammates better. Sadly, she never got the chance to play in this game.

Subs. I find it amusing that Ellis finds an opportunity to field the 22nd & 23rd choice players on her list, those were not even on the original list. they have never made it to qualifying yet here they are trying to win a game for Ellis. Tactically, the subs made little sense. Withdrawing both wingers was not entirely wrong, but the team had no creativity and direction from midfield, and midfield was conceding so much space and possession.

The larger question about the subs is that if Ellis thought that her best option was to bring in her 22nd & 23rd-choice player, what does that say about the other non-starters? Did she have no confidence in them? Did she bring the right players to Germany? Who makes these decisions anyway?

leroux is vastly overrated. Has adequate speed, but footwork and technique with the ball at her feet is mediocre. Service to her means kick-and-run, pass to her feet and she does not know how to combine with other attackers, if they show up in the first place. Leroux's lack of technique to operate in tight places shows how technically deficient the whole team are.

Which leads me to saying that there was no plan B. If the kick-and-run doesn't work, USA have no ideas how to crack open an opponent. There was no diversity in attack and in the approach of how to attack an opponent. The 1st game was the harbinger to USA's approach to this tournament.

Somewhere in Canada, a few people are reveling in schadenfreude about Leroux's decision to play for USA. If I were Canadian, I'd join them.

Shit like this tournament filters to the top. jill Ellis is a failure at the college level and now the international level. This is the coach who admitted that she did not prepare her college team for a PK shootout a few years ago in an NCAA game, because she didn't believe it would come to that. Preparation is not Jill Ellis' middle name back then, and it still is today. She lacks tactical nous.

The problem with selecting someone like Ellis to lead this program is that she will gladly do this job for free because she has access to the top talent in the country in order to recruit to UCLA. Hopefully, people will be smarter in choosing where they would play college ball, seeing how Ellis is such a poor tactician in this tournament, and how poorly she assembled this team.

The silver lining in this loss, and of the u17s failure to qualify in their tournament, is that the Fed will probably rid itself of Ellis and other college coaches and hopefully have a full-time technical director to manage the youth teams.

I don't mind Ellis' teams finding a way to lose, like her college team. But this team is my team too, and I'm very angry that it ended the way it did. This back-scratching by Ellis and the Fed hopefully will end. The kids should not suffer because of her and the Fed's incompetence.

 

Horrible idea........ there are better players in the pool.
Send her down and see if she can even re-earn a spot in the pool. Without Ellis' bias maybe some hidden gems will be found.
Her crying and sobbing after the game was nauseating.

 

I think some of us here are going overboard in criticizing individual players on an under-20 team. But that's just my opinion.

Apparently both of you have forgotten that Nairn and Leroux were stars of the 2008 team that won the Under-20 Cup. And they were selected by Tony DiCicco who coached that team.

So no on being there because of Ellis' bias. No on missing a PK making Nairn an Ellis-kind of player. And no on Canadian schadenfreude - the US won in 2008 and Leroux was the Golden Boot winner.

The tactics and substitutions in this game are open to second-guessing (although it also was a tale of two halves). And I certainly have no problem with those who think it's time to move on and give someone else a chance at the job. But calling Jill Ellis a failure at the college level is a cheap shot as I've pointed out elsewhere.

I guess the only way to be fireproof against this argument is, say, to win an NCAA championship. I don't have a problem with Randy Waldrum, Garrett Smith, or Anson Dorrance coaching the team.

I don't know about Randy or Garrett, but does anyone think Anson wants the job?

That pool to select from is shrinking fast.

USC's Ali Khosroshahin? He won so maybe. But I can see how temperament-wise, the Federation just may not think he's the right guy.

But most importantly, if this team is your team, too, then treat the kids like they are your team and don't crap all over them just because they aren't Stanford.

 

A few thoughts from How I Saw It:

Conditioning. The US was the better team when fresh, but gradually deteriorated as they tired, and they tired early. Nigeria did not appear to tire at all. The game did not change suddenly, but over a slow rising curve. We were talking about it at my house at the 35 minute mark.

This team played a direct game because that's where their talent was. No point in not doing what you do well. Nigeria simply had the speed to defend it without much adjustment.

Panic-- when the direct game wasn't going well, they gradually started firing the ball up quicker and quicker and with less effort at making a play than just clearing it out, not making much effort to serve a playable ball.

Throw ins were horrible beyond description. We'd rather have had Nigeria taking them.

Our corner kicks were pretty substandard too. Its 1-0 Nigeria in regulation if they don't have the brain fart on the short corner, 'cause we weren't getting much done on service corners at all.

It's not the end of the world. Its an under 20 tournament. There's a ton of talent there, and plenty of future.

"Hang the coach" is a cheap and easy reaction which does no one any good. We get to see what goes wrong and say the coach should have anticipated it. The coach has to try to anticipate everything and find enough practice time to deal with it all. I'd just about guarantee her next team will be better conditioned and will do a lot of work on composure and throw ins; and then that team may unexpectedly have difficulty with one on one defending or some other thing. Entropy is not your friend...

 

It's funny when a player is doing well they are the best but when a player does one thing wrong they are a disgrace. You must have perfect lives and your kids must be the best or you were the best athlete in your time. Do you people have anything better to do with your time than put down players that have worked their asses off for this World cup. Do you think all the time they put in and worked so hard towards wanted this outcome. You tell me a striker that has finished every shot, run, pk in their carreer? The nigerians played a dirty game hoping to break a few legs if thats what it took to win. Most of these players didn't get brought up playing long ball either. This is what they practice and the style they are told to play. Certain players never scored for 2 years with the full team and they stayed on the full team and now that player is starting to look bright again. You really must think what it feels like for players to read this crap you all know so much about. The comment that Sydney Leroux is tall, big, beast shes only 5"7 weighing in about 125lbs if thats a beast you better look what a beast means in the dictionary. This is what I mean you all know so much about players. Maybe you should all go over your faults make sure your perfect then maybe someone will listen to you.

 

The Nigerian player had one of the corner flags, which she had clearly taken as a keepsake of the victory. This is not unusual these days after the last match at a tournament venue. I saw it a couple of times in the recent World Cup in South Africa. It is something like the American tradition of cutting down the nets after winning high school and collegiate basketball championships.

Anyway, one of the American staff was trying to grab it from her, which really demonstrated poor sportsmanship. I certainly hope he thought better of it and apologized later.

 

Is that the official story ? Well if so, he did nothing wrong -> but she deserves a lesson, and I expect she will be taught it.

 

I don't know about "nauseating"...

There was absolutely nothing wrong with how Sydney L. reacted after she missed the PK...

Just as I don't think Mia Hamm and Coach Heinrichs did anything wrong by crying after Germany beat US in the 2003 WC semifinal...

 

This thread has been a bit over the top but that's not shocking giving the result of yesterday's game.

Ellis did not have a good tourny in my book. I am one here that critiques her, not as much as some other posters. I don't think she is a bad head coach but I don't think she's an excellent one. Before the tourny I questioned her ability to coach a team to the Big Win. She has yet to silence my criticism. I now wonder if she is more of a "roll the ball out and let them play" type of coach--think Jim Boeheim rep in men's college bball.

The poor results on corners (the one vs Nigeria notwithstanding) and free kicks is something that should be worked on enough in training to be fairly reliable. And no excuse for those throw ins, :shudder: I said in early game threads that the players were looking for the "homerun" ball too much (ie every time) rather than making the simple play. Some of that is ingrained to players but coaches need to work to counter that instinct in their teams.

Did the team practice PKs while in Germany? Why did she not properly scout Ghana (she admitted not seeing any film of them or knowing much about them)? Why did the midfield/forward lines look like no one knew their job/role (they were especially disorganized in the 1st game)? Why were the set piece plays so bad? These are things Ellis had control over in ways a coach can not control whether a striker will have an unlucky day finishing chances.

Coaching the international game is a very different type of job than coaching a club (or college) team. Some coaches are able to switch back & forth but some are just much better at one than the other. I think DiCicco is one of those coaches that's just better at the international game than the daily club grind.

The substitutions by Ellis were odd--both in this game & all tourny. The only article I've read about the NIgeria game so far quotes Ellis saying the team was very tired. Well, Jill, that's kinda your job to deal w/. With the exception of Narin in the first game, Basically the same players were subbed out--the outside players--DiMartino (to never be seen again), Bywaters & Hayes. Then Leroux twice w/ just a few minutes left in two games. So, while she might have used all 3 subs in each game the 'rest' was not spread around.

Contrast this predictable pattern to 2008. In 2008, the sub patter was more, um, complex. More people got to play and subs were spread out a bit more. Check out the subs--Washington got subbed a couple of times but check the difference in starting lineups, too. Granted, needing the win in the last game complicated matters for Ellis but still, fair game for serious critique, imo. In at least one of the games where Bywaters came out around the 70' mark, Ellis could have subbed out Mewis to save her legs instead. Or Brooks. Or Leroux. In this game, again only the wide players were subbed out (Short, Bywaters, Hayes) w/ Short only playing in this game. Just wacky.

As far as team conditioning, I think Ellis's poor distribution of substitution time wore out the legs of some players (eg Leroux & Mewis). But I do think several players were not as strong as needed and got pushed off the ball and/or faded too easily/quickly. But yes, others just wore out by the second half. Going for the homerun all the time & turning the ball over a lot will do that.

In previous settings, I've seen Leroux combine with other players but in this tourny she was far too isolated. I think this team did have the ability to play slightly less direct but weren't encouraged to do that much--they kept going for the homerun. And I'd have to go back and watch the games again but it felt like to me players either tried 1 touch passes (or clearances) OR they dribbled/held the ball way too long.

The formation (however you describe it 4-5-1, 4-3-3, ??) didn't help matters, either.

On your last point. You are right that the knee-jerk "hang the coach" reaction that generally occurs after losses throughout sports is bad. However, Ellis has been the U20 coach twice--DiCicco took over mid-cycle--and coached U21s prior to that so she's been around for like 6-9 yrs. I think it is time for some new blood. Even if Ellis had not, imo, laid an egg in Germany. Which she did so that intensifies the need for a fresh start.

Unlike the poster that believes there will be full-time Uxx women's coaches now, I do not think that will happen. So a coach will be hired part time. Will the next U20 be in the summer or in the fall? If it is in the fall, is getting coach w/ pro experience out of the question?

 

I think Sydney's reaction was natural, and appropriate for a 20-year-old. Ellis and Nairn (both of whom suffered through disappointing at best performances) were at their best comforting her.

Mia also has no apologies to make. Athletes have to hold in their emotions while playing, sometimes after a match they just pour out. Positive emotions as well as negative ones.

Heinrichs on the other hand just showed she lacked the temperament to be a head coach.

 

I can't beleive that a US women's head coach will use fatigue as an excuse at a world cup competition. It is laughable and quite insulting to hear the lame excuse. That comment alone should be the reason why the coach needs to go. US players are known for playing too many games (both college and club soccer) in a short period of time. Are we now expected to believe that playing 4 games with a minimum of 2 days rest is too much for US U20 players? Didin't she bring about 21 players to Germany? Maybe if she had brought some other players instead of her college recruits (that barely ever plays meaningful role) to the tournament she could have had different lineups for games if necessary. Is the coach trying to label those hard working players as unfit? I still believe the whole debacle was lack of leadership and team chemistry on and off the pitch. Talent alone does not win games at the highest level.
I feel for the players because they have to live with the results until school ball starts. I hope they know that most soccer fans are with them and we understand that soccer is cruel and humbling. Jill's comments on fifa website about fatigue is not only an insult to her players, but a disgrace to US soccer as well as disrespectful to the opponent Nigeria. By the way, Jill should remember the team almost lost to Ghana as well in the first match (a team she failed to prepare for by her own admission). Didn't the team lose both pre world cup friendly games in Germany? The coach needs to look in the mirror and accept responsibility for the defeats.

 

Was it nauseating when Dempsey (and other MNT) players cried at the end of the Confed Cup after a gutting loss? How about the crying done by the male WC players that missed PKs during the WC in SA that cost their team advancement?

Leroux wears her emotions on her sleeve. This loss should have devastated players. I would have been even more upset if there were NOT players who were crying or visibly upset. Get over yourself.

 

Link to FIFA website article

http://www.fifa.com/u20womensworldcup/news/newsid=1277902.html#fatigue+blamed+usa+failure

 

The US U-17 over achieved in New Zealand due to a good coach and good fortune. The Coach Tambi stated on more than one occasion that the game had changed for the US due to the higher standards in ball retention vs athleticism in the international game.

2 years on and the U-17 cores of all nations move up to U-20 and nothing has changed for the better with the US. As a neutral I could see that Jill Ellis had made a huge error much like the WWC 07 coach, thinking what works in the US system will work on the international stage. After each game Ellis resorted back further and further to what she knew best, speed in straight lines.

Each time US lost its way Ellis threw on more runners agianst sides that could cope with speed. Remember without a slice of offside luck US would have been out in the group stage. Players like Noyola and Di Martino would never stand a chance in this system which is a shame, as its more of the smaller crafty players the WNT needs.

The next big shift in the women's game is occuring now, and the results will be seen at Germany 2011. The Full WNT has a coach can see this shift but does she have the players to cope?

The US will always be a power but without the former guarantee of success. The women's game keeps moving at a swift rate, the US has to keep moving or else finals will keep becoming fewer.