US women soccer players want equal pay to US men's team.

This is very true of Moderate thinking though. Most are just watching from the sidelines and either don't want to or don't care to voice their opinion whichever way.

 

Wha...?

I honestly have no idea what the first sentence means.

 

Moderates. People in the middle.

 

I understand that. By your quoting of Dr. King, I presume you are attempting to equate the struggle of African-Americans against Jim Crow and other systematic oppression (both public and private) with a bunch of (mostly) white (mostly) upper-middle-class women playing a sport.

That's...creative.

 

No, you understand incorrectly. I merely tried to illustrate a Moderate standing can be more hurtful to a cause than an opposition standing.

 

What I think is lost upon the WNT is the fact that the MNT doesn't have as much socio-political messaging at the core of its identity, marketing, and operation.

WNT players make lots of political statements. MNT players rarely do.

WNT players are always out to prove that Women's pro soccer can work in a sports marketplace dominated by male sports. MNT players already proved that pro soccer can work here, they're just trying to choose where they can play to get the most money/be challenged the most.

WNT players have inextricably tight connections to the USSF at all levels, from time as YNT players to their professionalplaying careers. MNT players don't even have Bradenton anymore, and are professional club players like any other player in the world soccer landscape.

The MNT isn't talking about payment policies? What would lead anyone to think that they WOULD talk?

 

I'm still not sure that's applicable in this case, but whatever. It was not terribly clear.

 

In the sense that the NT keeps silent rather than voicing an opinion. One would think Bradley or a few others might say some words.

 

One would not think that. Especially if their opinions were to cause some kind of controversy, which they are almost guaranteed to.

The WNT is suing the USSF, and moreover has been trashing the USSF and MNT in the press for years, arguably decades (their argument for better pay has always been based on comparing amenities and FIFA bonuses, with direct and oblique references to a comparative lack of success on the Men's side). Any statement that isn't the most bland BS possible, is going to be seen as supporting either the USSF or the WNT.

Even going "bland" is controversial, as you demonstrate here, because that would be seen as "cowardly" by the WNT.

It's just a lose-lose, so I'm entirely unsurprised that nobody has decided to get sucked into that quagmire.

 

Another news/opinion article I saw (fyi, I'm also posting this in the thread on the USWNT N&A board):

What the USWNT can learn from Australia's equal pay deal

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/so...ias-equal-pay-deal/ar-BBWXdst?ocid=spartandhp

 

There were opportunities a long time ago to merge the Unions and negotiate together and the WNTPA always refused. The MNTPA also issued a supportive statement and I'd imagine the PA asked its members to let the Union do the talking on this. I believe the men are also playing on an expired CBA and could be waiting this out because it believes the next WNT CBA strengthens its own bargaining position. For me, though, the inability to consider that the WNT rhetoric trashing the men's team would lead to is not the best way to get them to come out in support demonstrates a pretty high level of ignorance.

 

It's making money specifically because US Soccer is paying their salaries. NWSL couldn't afford them.

 

It's amazing the level of self awareness that defenders of the WNT lack. Your post is so much truth. The WNT want the fame and recognition of the MENs GAME (they have the recognition as stars and famous people but not as sports figures) without having to go through the doldrums that the men's team drudged through over the decades. Just as recently as the 90s and early 2000s I think US Soccer paid the men's salaries just like the women have now. Literally had contracts exclusively with US Soccer. Obviously now MLS is successful, but it wasn't always the case. In 2002 MLS was reduced to just ten teams. It's only in recent years is there more and more rumors that MLS is finally as profitable as it should be (players bargaining agreements).

How many previous women's leagues have folded in just their third year of existence? NWSL is finally showing signs of success but they could just as easily destroy that success by trying to leapfrog into thinking they are as strong as even weak MLS now

 

USSF has not had male players on contract since the 1994 world cup cycle.

 

Wait, what? This is a little rich, considering that the USSF is paying the USWNT players' salaries, and the CBA still prohibits NWSL teams from paying anyone more than the USWNT players.

Also, at this point it's clearly the USWNT against other women.

 

Male footballers should earn more than women... according to US football authorities

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/51835288

 

"Literally everyone in the world understands that an argument male players 'have more responsibility' is just plain simple sexism," Molly Levinson, a spokesperson for the players, said in a statement.

What a crock of shenanigans.

Everyone in the world?


The attorneys must have been reading this thread.

I mentioned months ago that one of the main reasons why the women should not get paid as much is because their qualifying is a piece of cake compared to what the men have to deal it.

Way too much emotional and mental stress and even a fear for their lives when they travel to Mexico and Central American venues.

The women can just walk around listening to party in the USA by Miley Cyrus on their iphones and not have to worry about anything.

I still have not heard a good counter-argument to that premise.

 

US Soccer sponsor Coca-Cola statement to the @WSJ on the federation’s recent court filing in pay-discrimination case: https://t.co/IYgSZ6wvZu pic.twitter.com/YcYtU372kW

— Rachel Bachman (@Bachscore) March 11, 2020

 

I wonder what the percentage of Coke's hardest jobs in the factory and distribution in Atlanta are done by women.

Very, very curious actually.

 

Coke has paid 200 million dollars from discrimination lawsuits, second only to Bank of America (210 million) in the United States.

PR stunts, again. The USSF would be better served cutting the Women's program and letting them have their own governing body. Let them get the sponsors, write the CBA, etc.

 

Most of the "Woke" movement are PR stunts or just ignorant rambling without facts.

 

they brought in a lot of revenue and were far more successful ie world cup champs, which for a non profit sporting federation should matter more than pure spreadsheets.

i mean, do some of you get this is not the NBA -- a business -- this is more like the US Olympic Committee? at least on paper.

mind you, we wouldn't want them going broke. but do some of you get USSF turns in charity returns showing 9-figure annual revenues minus expenses? this is not even about can they afford it.

are some of you serious? we never needed a black athlete olympic committee, or a women's olympic committee, but you're seriously going to pull the 'create a women's USSF card?"

 

"but our qualifying is tough" basically tries to make a virtue out of our own recent struggles. and limited successes.

and it neglects that the goal is making the world cup and succeeding there. which they do far better.

it also would be at odds with our men's present coaching and tactical choices, which while arguably regionally naive are nominally claimed to be pointed towards global improvement. in plain english, the whole premise of the men's program at the moment is to implement a new approach, take qualifying for granted, and point beyond. but now you're saying let's chat up the rigors of qualifying? ok, why did we adopt such a childlike scheme then? people claim quali is too easy, now it's too hard, or at least hard enough to justify inverting the pay rates, make up your mind.

the pee bag argument feels about 10 years plus stale. for starters, we chopped our quali down to the hex now, which is basically the VIP suite in comparison. second, to me the semi and back end of hex teams have improved and it's less ugly ball. there will be one dog in the hex, tops. there will be a few organized teams whose fans behave themselves in the repechage. this is no longer 3 organized leagues and a bunch of semi pros and amateurs. some mexican stadia are as nice as here. there's a certain sort of suburban arrogance beneath the pee bag argument.

also, implicit in the men have it harder, is acting like hosting is automatic. what is our recent rate of success hosting gold cup? mind you, it is advantageous, but they cash in. they cash in because they make themselves superior without fail. if they sat on their duffs the region could catch up. you're trying to make success into a negative.

also, i think people have forgotten canada. canada doesn't keep us from qualifying. canada is a world cup regular with a 4th place finish.

 

Athletes are paid what they are contractually obligated to receive. They don't "deserve" money for performing an act of entertainment any more than a busker "deserves" to make as much money as Taylor Swift for playing in a BART station. As someone who watches both Men's and Women's soccer, I lose nothing if the WNT run their own Federation and set their own deals. I gain not having to hear them cry foul every 6 months to try to get a new deal, arguing that it's sexist that they aren't paid more money.

The same group of players who brought the lawsuit have claimed that FIFA should give them the same amount of prize money despite less sponsorship/viewership numbers, and that being the best Women's player means that should mean you should be paid like Messi/Ronaldo. That's not how markets work.