US-Mexico, the coaching and tactics

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by superdave, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 6, 2006
    emo is the answer thats why he plays so much for a club in the premier league..oh wait they just shipped him out to mls for nickles on the dollar just to get rid of him.

    short memory do you remember robinson/sargent against a certain b team before the gold cup? remember their performance that you could combine and still be short of a 5/10. robinson/sargent also had poor seasons thinking they are all of a sudden magically going to play well is crazy.


    ccv isn't ready either he hasn't shown anything saying he is.

    cameron/dwilliams its like you literally don't even look these guys up before you mention them. you say 'get rid of the old guy'...then talk about even older guys that had you looked up you know williams was hurt again. Cameron is no longer a very good player again you'd know this if you weren't picking players based on name recognition and the league name next to their names.
     
  2. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 6, 2006
    bingo

    you said it right there

    you are completely going off name recognition you have zero clue about the actual player. you look at their name and the league next to it and say 'thats my guy'.

    I think brooks is the top cb in the pool but the idea that he is a savior either is crazy. I could argue him and cameron(while he was in the premier league) put some of the worst performances of the entire team if the past cycle in at cb.

    the idea that morales is better simply because the league he plays in just isn't true.

    I would start bradley right now if I was the us national team coach.
     
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  3. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Yep, and that's why you support a team who missed the WC and lost the GC. And also, the argument is completely finished, as there's nothing else to discuss. You prefer a mediocre MLS 6 who used to be good. I prefer a Bundesliga starter who is good. Nice and simple, and that's it! good day sir.
     
  4. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    #154 DHC1, Jul 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
    I agree with all of this but I read your question as who could replace Bradley and Trapp and I think we should look at all of those options.

    If Bradley and Trapp are considered first team international quality right now, then yes, I do believe that "Morales, Bedoya, Canouse etc. are first team international quality right now." Morales is clearly better and the two are probably at least as good. Bedoya has been particularly playing well this year.

    I do think that Bradley is not really a 6 either as he's more of a traditional CM than a DM. Yet, he's playing the 6 for the USMNT.
     
  5. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 6, 2006
    ur right its over you are still short on proving a single fact other then you are looking for a savior so you pick random players you've never seen play.

    I do support the us and while I don't know who(or really care) you support I know that the reason they didn't qualify for the world cup wasn't because of a single player and that morales wouldn't have magically fixed all of the usmnts issues.

    thats what you are missing he isn't good and you've never seen him play. you pick guys by name and league and think they are magically better.

    you argue sargent over altidore...sargent doesn't even get regular first division matches lol. you just pick and chose ur savior and the rules for that player being the savior randomly it makes proving you wrong very easy.
     
  6. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Please provide a quote where I argued Sargent over altidore... Thx.
     
  7. neems

    neems Member+

    Liverpool FC
    United States
    Apr 14, 2009
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Reviewing through the game again, the Lovitz sub was the right choice, but should have happened first and much earlier. I guess it’s a little debatable though because taking Ream out and switching to a four man backline would have opened the game up a lot more regardless.

    Especially after a second viewing, it’s plain as day Ream was the third CB. Arriola was the X factor tasked with probably the most complicated instructions. Obviously, Tata saw the opportunity to exploit our transition back to defense and made adjustments leading to the goal.

    I would argue taking Ream out for a LB then switching to a 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 on both sides of the ball was what needed to happen first by GB. Then you use the other subs for building the attack. So in a way the narrative is backwards, even for the people criticizing the substitutions. I haven’t read anyone mention the order or how to adjust to what Tata was doing really - unless I missed post.

    Ultimately, the subs were still pretty bad and perhaps too rigidly calculated beforehand. Also, I would say that Berhalter was out coached too, but Tata’s adjustments were less impressive upon second viewing.
     
  8. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 6, 2006
    the guyana thread, the 23 roster release among others you lament sargent not being around its all there

    there is a search tool here lol.
     
  9. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Quote please...you said I wanted Sargent over altidore, not that I lamented Sargent not being on the roster. Please provide the quote. This should be easy Mr. Search tool.
     
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  10. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    To be exact, Morales was a lock solid starter the first half of the season, the second half was more mixed, of the games that he played, he started half and came in as a sub in the other half.

    I am not sure what went down in his team, a manager change or what ever, but looking at the stats, he was a starter, then out of the blue he fell out of favor and was bench or not even on the 18 for a few weeks, then started a few games after the mid season, but finished the season as a substitute.

    https://www.transfermarkt.us/alfredo-morales/leistungsdaten/spieler/58500/plus/0?saison=2018
     
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  11. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    Yeah, I understand that. But we're not comparing this guy to a Big 4 starter (obviously, I prefer Adams in the 6 spot). We're comparing a guy who managed loads of minutes in a top 4 league with a middle of the road MLS player, whose legs are clearly shot.

    Everyone has so many excuses - minutes came at the wrong point of the season, he played for us 4 years ago and didn't impress, US coaches (that failed spectacularly) have ignored him meaning they know more. It's all nonsense. He played many minutes at a much higher level than MB or Trapp. Nobody has said he's a savior, nobody says he's better than Messi, nobody says he's gonna be around for a decade. We simply have said his body of work over the last 12 months is much better than MB.

    The fact so many arguments are invented to argue this point is so weird. All to protect the spot of an average MLS midfielder? Or to protect Egg's/USSF's roster selections?

    (edit - how many times do you all have to defend the status quo, that has failed nonstop the last 3-4 years, before we try something new?)
     
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  12. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't think that he is 'much better' than MB, he is probably better than Trapp (I don't rate Trapp), so I would have loved to see him get a chance to at least be the back up.

    Even if MB started, I would be more confident in subbing in Morales over Trapp to replace MB who was gassed in the second half.

    I still think Bradley is serviceable, he had a good tournament but faded when faced with hard opposition.

    My beef with MB playing is more about the future, he is not going to Qatar, so why waste minutes playing him, I rather lose with a younger guy.

    Morales would be 32 for Qatar, so not young, but still young enough to at least be given a shot.
     
  13. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    I think our team has failed enough with Bradley as the fulcrum.

    I don't think morales will be around for the WC, nor do I want him to be. I just think he's better than what we're putting out there, including MB.
     
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  14. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 6, 2006

    now its adams lol

    that may be the issue you are comparing him to messi but we are talking about a defensive midfielder savior which is hilarious.

    his body of work isn't great and there is zero evidence he is better and the coaches are free to pick guys they are comfortable with. Picking random guys is how you end up with a guy like emo or gyau in camp and then think what a wasted spot that was.

    how many times are you just going to pick random players as the savior? everytime the they lose its 'if (some random player) had played it would've been different' it really gets old.
     
  15. yurch10

    yurch10 Member+

    Feb 13, 2004
    I can't tell if you're a troll, or legitimately this dimwitted.

    How many times have Emo and Gyau played 1600 minutes in a top 4 league?
     
  16. bob347

    bob347 Member

    Liverpool FC
    United States
    Oct 15, 2017
    yurch10,

    I admire your tenacity. I wish MB still had some ;)
     
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  17. nbarbour

    nbarbour Member

    Jun 19, 2006
    Washington DC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is the most frustrating part. It's not like Tata put on a master class. He made a simple tactical change that was obvious within minutes of viewing. But our coach had NO ANSWER for what was an obvious tactical adjustment by the other side. Instead, he makes the situation worse and kills off any chance we had at a comeback.

    This is why people are so angry! It was coaching malpractice.
     
  18. Winoman

    Winoman Drinkin' Wine Spo-De-O-De!

    Jul 26, 2000
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Tata's adjustment was simple & effective to do, and devastating for the US to ignore.
     
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  19. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    do you think that Bradley has the ability to play in the B1 given its pace and rapid decision making?
     
  20. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not at his current salary.

    But if he went on loan and MLS covered his salary, I think some bottom feeders would take a look.
     
  21. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    LOL. Let's see when his contract is up and how much he gets on the field!

    I'm happy to put a friendly wager on it - proceeds go to charity.
     
  22. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Do you think he wants to go play for cheap to "Europe"?

    He will get a DP level contract with MLS next year, it won't be massive like the one he got before, but it will be over a million per year IMO.
     
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  23. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    As I've said many many times, there's no "Europe". There are a select number of elite leagues that are significantly better than MLS/Championship/B2 and the rest are equal to or lower.

    If someone is willing to pay Bradley a million dollars a year, he should run at that contract as fast as he ran to the last one. His play is far worse than Jermaine Jones' was in 2015 and Jones received $600K/year for two years.
     
  24. ceezmad

    ceezmad Member+

    Mar 4, 2010
    Chicago
    Club:
    Chicago Red Stars
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lots of times pay is more than field skills, some DPs get money for off field situation, MB still has brand value to MLS, he will get the money.
     
  25. DHC1

    DHC1 Member+

    Jun 3, 2002
    NYC
    Good for him. I'm interested to see how it plays out. He's not a difference maker in MLS anymore.
     

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