US Goalkeeper discussion thread - Part III

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by ussoccer97531, Nov 15, 2017.

  1. soccersubjectively

    soccersubjectively BigSoccer Supporter

    Jan 17, 2012
    Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Meola played *well* for the number one team in the country and U20s. Not sure if you watch the U20s in 2017 or not but JK really looked like a fish out of water. Also had a less than stellar college run, to say the least.

    I'm sure any player is glad they get called in, ha. But the actual development comes in the day in day out training on the club side. A week's worth of camps does very little when they're with another team for the other 98% of the year.

    I'm a little confused at the last point. Should we only make exceptions to include the best players? Yes? Ha.

    Going back to your earlier point, "Meola couldn't have beaten out Vanole if he hadn't been called up and given a chance." We should also note that Meola was actually better than Vanole. He got called in/got a chance/played better because he was better. It's not like he was some young gun that may turn out to be one of the better US gks of all-time or might not. He was on a track that JTM and JK are not.
     
  2. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    TxEx repped this.
  3. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    Amazing game by Gonzalez. He is so much more talented than Steffen and Horwath. Hopefully he is on GC roster.
     
  4. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #829 xbhaskarx, May 20, 2019
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
    This is better than 90% of the comedies currently airing on network television... never change BS.

    Edit: Let me clarify that I would never push for Hamid’s inclusion, but he’s “a bit ahead” (as JK might say) of those other two beyond a doubt.

    I’m trying to decide which “in a heartbeat” candidate is worse. It has to be Alex Bono, Klinsmann hasn’t shown anything as a professional whereas Bono has already proven to be subpar.
     
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  5. xbhaskarx

    xbhaskarx Member+

    Feb 13, 2010
    NorCal
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As an Earthquakes fan who has/had high hopes for JT Marcinkowski... he doesn’t look all that good even in USL at the moment. So maybe slow down the hype train on guys who aren’t doing s*** and who you probably aren’t even watching (seriously when was the last time anyone here saw Klinsmann in action?).
     
  6. ifsteve

    ifsteve Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jul 7, 2013
    MS and ID
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The point isn't who I would include as my 3rd keeper. We can debate all day long who may or may not be better down the road. My point is simply that I see zero reason to include Hamid any more. I don't think he has an down the road upside that numerous others might.
     
  7. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I am sorry to hear you are a fan of a crap team in a crap league. There is no hype here. I included those two because others had mentioned them. My view is simple, call in the top prospect(s) to train with the team as guys like Hamid have consistently shown they arent good enough at relatively low level.
     
  8. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Luchi emphasizing possession even from keepers is really helping Gonzalez making a case with Berhalter who values that from his keepers too. Jesse is also very good at stopping penalties. I might have him on the Gold Cup just to bring in at the end of a game going to penalties. Isn't Steffen good at that also?
     
  9. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    Five GKs are included on the 40-player provisional Gold Cup roster:

    Guzan
    Horvath
    Johnson
    Miller
    Steffen
     
  10. Pegasus

    Pegasus Member+

    Apr 20, 1999
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I guess Berhalter prizes Miller's field player holding skills over Gonzalez's pk stopping skills. Probably no big deal as 3rd keeper is a boring task.
     
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  11. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    Thats what I gathered. Glad Johnson is still there.
     
  12. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Speaking of goalies, am I the only one that is worried about Steffen and his seemingly already being the assumed starter? My worry is around his signing with City, where he will very likely never play. He's going to be farmed out to places unknown and he may not end up in an ideal situation. Heck, a poor loan situation and he may not end up getting much time on the field. How much does he have to play if Horvath keeps getting regular playing time before he falls behind? Am I the only one worried about our supposed starter signing for a team that won't play him? Am I the only one wishing he would have signed not with the biggest club he could but with a club actually interested in playing him right away?
     
  13. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    You have a great point. Maybe it's naive of me, but I'd assumed he'd sketch out a career similar to a Ben Foster (of Birmingham/West Brom/Watford fame). And if not him, tons of no.2/no.3's from big clubs who found their stride in the Championship.
     
  14. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Personally, I hope we can field a guy in goal who is better than someone who has to drop down to a second tier league to get games, but I think we have to consider that with Steffen signing to City this is a very likely scenario for him. Has anyone heard who they expect to loan him out to?
     
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  15. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    6 months ago, the likes of Girona and Nice were thrown in the air. I'd wager probably the same or maybe they settle for Vitesse. He's a worthy no.2 at the club since Bravo seems on the way out and the other guy hasn't the experience. I concur though I'd be happy if Steffen was no.1 at a club like Ajax or Galatarsaray or Porto. CL every season and fighting for the title as opposed to a big club in the Championship or relegation fodder in the Premier League.
     
  16. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Yeah, I think it looked to a lot of people like Steffen signing for City as opposed to Horvath being in Belgium gave him a big edge, but for now I see it as Horvath has a solid and high quality club position and Steffen is a giant question mark. Just based on the eye test, I do like Steffen and he just has a more confident posture back there and I can see why so many are excited about him. But, a whole lot is going to depend where he actually ends up. A lengthy spell on the sidelines is not out of the question, especially if City were to decide to keep him as a back-up and he has to cross his fingers he gets some time in cup games and such.
     
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  17. nobody

    nobody Member+

    Jun 20, 2000
    Something like Girona or Nice would actually be quite good I'd think. Somewhere he is likely to win a starting spot in a strong league.
     
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  18. mattjo

    mattjo Member+

    Feb 3, 2001
    Washington DC
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    Horvath did a great job mentally this year in regaining the starting position. That said, he really has to improve his footwork to challenge Steffen.

    I agree that Steffen must play though to retain his position. Actual match fitness cannot be replicated in practice (as Tim Howard has publicly commented).
     
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  19. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    I recall that when someone stated Girona (or maybe it was Nice) where their current no.1 was so-so and that Steffen could potentially unseat them.
     
  20. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    I concur. Horvath has proven himself in the last 7 months. And he deserves a chance at being no.1

    Though Steffen needs probably all 6 games to get the work permit. Gonna be awkward.
     
  21. ifsteve

    ifsteve Member

    Manchester United
    United States
    Jul 7, 2013
    MS and ID
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Don't forget between the EPL, FA Cup, League Cup, and UCL, Man City plays a TON of matches. If he doesn't get loaned out he may well still get plenty of playing time and of course he would be getting great training.

    But at the end of they day they do need minutes. I don't think its as critical for a keeper vs field player but still.
     
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  22. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    let's say he gets the 6th CL groupstage match and let's say he gets like 4-8 cup matches (City usually goes very far in them). That's not bad. And if Ederson picks up an injury (that's a few matches at least) or if he gets a Red card or goes with his wifey for the birth of a kid (1 match).

    He could potentially see 10-15 games next season. A reliable no.2
     
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  23. TimB4Last

    TimB4Last Member+

    May 5, 2006
    Dystopia
    And even more awkward if we only play 4 or 5 games.
     
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  24. bsky22

    bsky22 Member+

    Dec 8, 2003
    I dont see anything to worry about at this point. I'd be fine and think it might actually be good for him to spend the first half of the season training with City before finding the right loan for him. It would give him time to settle in and just focus on his game. He would likely improve significantly. He might not be game sharp, but we dont need him to be in the second half of this year.

    I dont think we have a presumed starter. Steffen would be my pick based on playing style but we have true competition and Horvath could easily win the spot. Given club situations, I have suggested giving the first half of this year through the gold cup to Steffen and then the rest of the year to Horvath. This should have been communicated up front with the goal of each guy being given a chance to get experience and rhythm playing. Then based on their performance and current form a #1 and #2 is picked with true competition.
     
  25. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Yup. At this point in the cycle there really is no NEED to have identified the clear pecking order of #1, #2, #3. If its a competition, then its a competition.

    I'd think that after all of the games this this summer/fall (with the Gold Cup, League of Nations, friendlies, etc.), the staff will want to solidify their #1 as they prepare for WCQing.

    I always remember Bob Bradley saying that his first job was to identify his starting keeper and CB combo. Then he wanted them to play as many games together as possible prior to the games becoming important. So for him that was Boca/Gooch/Howard.

    And we saw what happens when the opposite strategy is taken.................Klinsmann chopped and changed, chopped and changed the during his 2nd cycle.
     

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