UEFA 2018 World Cup Qualification

Discussion in 'UEFA and Europe' started by Italy-Azzurri-Fan, Sep 5, 2016.

  1. benficafan3

    benficafan3 Member+

    Nov 16, 2005
    Yeah, and that was a year ago. Today, they lead France in qualifying. I tend to favor current results over those of a year ago. Even less relevant are the qualifying stages of the Euro. Sweden has players like Lindelof that have already developed considerably relative to a year ago. And that's showing now. Did you know Lindelof and other players made up a Sweden team that won the Euro U-21 2 years ago? Weird, it seems that they're starting to develop. But I'm sure you already knew that, right?
     
  2. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    Yet, you just ignored the results from a year ago to point to Sweden being joint-top in the Euro qualifying stages.

    Iceland holds an equivalent position in their group I might add. But I'm sure you're going to go on about how France' group is so much tougher, as it includes the Dutch and Bulgarians. Unfortunately its not the 1990s so nobody will buy it. :p

    Well I know you're Portuguese so you want to make a big deal about youth tournament results, but unfortunately it involves alot of speculation. We already know that the Iceland NT is a close-knit group that plays well as a unit. We don't know yet how Sweden's young talent will gel as a group unless you're willing to make grand conclusions from one singular match result last weekend.

    PS...Iceland reached the final 8 of the U-21 Euros in 2011 and some of those guys are now absolute fixtures in the Iceland NT. Given that was 6 years ago, they're now in their prime. :geek:
     
  3. benficafan3

    benficafan3 Member+

    Nov 16, 2005
    You clearly didn't understand. I was discounting the fact that Euro qualifying happened years ago, not the fact that it happened in Europe Lolol.

    And France and the Netherlands are tougher than Croatia/Turkey/Ukraine. Your delusions to believe otherwise have no bearing on reality.

    lol okay. We don't know how Sweden's young talent will gel as a group, even though they seemed to gel well enough to win a U21 Euro. I'm Portuguese and drinking ginja so clearly I overestimate youth tournaments, P.S. here's some facts about Iceland in youth tournaments.
     
  4. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    So all we have to compare teams is two matches (the grand total of competitive matches played by UEFA teams this year)? Or is March too long ago also? You've just taken the results of actual competitive football matches and thrown them out the window so that we can argue based on our feelings? Great...

    France, yes. Netherlands clearly No. I'd use results to prove why they're not but ... you know... facts = no good

    lol You're talking about 2 hugely different groups/. Or do you actually think that the entire U21 squad is just gonna be shifted to the full Sweden NT? :notworthy:
     
  5. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    You are correct about the fact that Sweden is better than they were in Euro 2016 and last qualifying as well. They did improve as a team and developed some young players. However they still are not better than Iceland.

    And back on the matter of fact regarding France, you did realize that they couldn't even beat Belarus away right? If you cannot even beat a team like Belarus home or away, you are not top 5. Sweden is a growing team, but saying they are better than Iceland just after one game where they beat France? That is way too much.

    Iceland are a great team too. They beat Turkey, they beat Croatia, and they managed a draw vs Ukraine in Ukraine who are also a growing team. And no Sweden does NOT have a tougher group than Iceland.

    France = Croatia
    Netherlands < Turkey
    Bulgaria < Ukraine
    Belarus = Finland
    Luxembourg < Kosovo

    And if Sweden are that good of a team, why couldn't they beat Netherlands at home too who lost to France in their own home?
     
  6. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Country:
    Chile
    o_O

    ELO ratings of today (14th of June)
    France 5th
    Croatia 17th

    FIFA current rating (June)
    France 6th
    Croatia 18th

    Both rating systems have over 10 spots of diference between them both.
    Francly I don't know which rating list you are using to even consider them anything close one to the other, as in both systems France's superiority is overwhelming over Croatia.

    Oh and btw, France reached quarters last WC, while Croatia was eliminated at group phase.
    And at the Euro, which you like so much, France was finalists, while Croatia got eliminated at round of 16.

    (Oh yes, they were probably, missing some players......:rolleyes::D)
     
  7. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    OMG are you kidding me with FIFA Rankings? They have a particular calculation system based on last 4 years, and I am not even sure if that system is really the best way to calculate it. You really think Peru is better than Mexico, Croatia, and Uruguay? They are not even close. And before Euro 2016, France was rated 22 in FIFA Ranks with teams like Romania, and a few others better than them. That was never true. And before 2006 world cup, Italy was ranked #13. No way were they that low before, and no way were the USA and Czechs better than the Italians.

    In Euro 2016, Portugal knocked both Croatia and France out. Its just that they had to face Croatia first, and Portugal were the champions. When teams get knocked out by the champions, you cannot necessarily be sure that the team they knockout last is the second best, because its a matter of draw and how the format is setup.
     
  8. calabrese8

    calabrese8 Member+

    Feb 9, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    where is this croatia top 5 team talk coming from?

    I rate croatia as one of those teams that could win a tournament and would not be as big of a shock as lets say Norway but are more likely to not win.
     
  9. calabrese8

    calabrese8 Member+

    Feb 9, 2008
    Vancouver
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    yea you did say that.. i believe your quote was "italy has no importance to anybody" lol

    i'm agreeing with you that we have sucked at the past two world cups after winning the one before ;)

    i know you didn't mention the euros but i feel it should be mentioned. it gives a more accurate representation. Just like if i were to argue in favour of Italy..i can't leave out our dreadful world cup performances and say those dont matter.
     
  10. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    That's a bit of a false equivalency. Only in 2016 did Italy really look impressive at the Euros. ITs not as though Italy in Euros were the exact opposite of Italy in WCs. They've been just "okay" at the past 3 Euros overall, nothing to write home about.
     
  11. Rickdog

    Rickdog Member+

    Jun 16, 2010
    Santiago, Chile
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Country:
    Chile
    You got to learn how to read posts. In context, what I was talking about when I said "has no importance to anybody", I was talking about some of the friendly matches that Italy could have played. I wasn't talking about Italy in itself.

    Here's the whole parragraph of the refered post (I bolded in black, that sentence) :

    To the issue in itself, I recognize in other posts, Italy as an important team within Uefa, but what I do also say (my opinion that is), is that at present times there are about 4-6 teams better than them only in Uefa (if we also include other teams round the world, figures would be round 8 -10 teams better than them).
     
  12. Kung

    Kung Member

    Nov 3, 2014
    Club:
    Hammarby IF
    Country:
    Sweden
    Regarding Sweden, people here do realize that the team we have now is completely different compared to the euros 2016?

    Our problem before was that we had a Zlatan who pretty much dominated our national team and the press focused more on Zlatan rather then what was Sweden’s former strong point, the collective.

    We also had one of Sweden’s worse coaches in our history who people had like to get sacked since the euros at 2012. People’s faith in him was rocket low at the euros 2016 people were just happy that we made it and knocked out our biggest rival Denmark in the playoff for the euros.
    Former players who also left was Kim Källström and Andreas Isaksson.

    At the moment our new coach has made Sweden play like we always used to as a strong collective. His rather famous in Sweden for doing a "Leicester" with the team IFK Norrköping making them take their first league title since the 80s and making them a top team in the league from a bottom one.

    We do have a few good players as well whose been mentioned before in Emil Forsberg who broke the record of most assist ever in the Bundesliga and Lindelöf who just signed a contract with Manchester united after a rather successful time in Benfica.
    We do have a solid defense at the moment, our weakest point is that we really do lack good strikers, my hope is that Alexander Isak 17 years old who's in Dortmund at the moment and was very good in the Swedish league at the age 16/17 will bloom out to be a good striker.

    If we played Iceland today I’m pretty sure we would be the better team. Iceland do also play quite a lot like we used to before since their tactics are set by a former coach of the Swedish national team.
    With that said we still might not make it to the world cup since we’re extremely unlucky with the draws since both France and the Netherlands are better teams on paper. That we even can fight for the first spot (with some luck) is a major achievement for a team that is being rebuilt
     
  13. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    Yes I agree that Sweden is definitely better and has improved since Euro 2016 and are a team to be taken seriously now. However Iceland is too, and I think they are also growing and getting better, as they learn all the time, and keep growing on how to play as a team, and make less and less mistakes each game. As of now, I would still say Iceland is the superior team, but Sweden is not far behind though.

    If I would rank all the teams in Europe it would be this as of now:

    1. Germany
    2. Italy
    3. Spain
    4. Portugal
    5. Croatia
    6. France
    7. Belgium
    8. Poland
    9. Switzerland
    10. Iceland
    11. England
    12. Sweden
    13. Republic of Ireland
    14. Turkey
    15. Serbia
    16. Netherlands
    17. Wales
    18. Northern Ireland
    19. Greece
    20. Slovakia
    21. Ukraine
    22. Albania
    23. Austria
    24. Russia
    25. Bosnia-Herzegovina
    26. Slovenia
    27. Denmark
    28. Czech Republic
    29. Romania
    30. Hungary
    31. Scotland
    32. Norway
    33. Montenegro
    34. Bulgaria
    35. Belarus
    36. Finland
    37. Israel
    38. Armenia
    39. Kazakhstan
    40. Azerbaijan
    41. Macedonia
    42. Georgia
    43. Moldova
    44. Faroe Islands
    45. Lithuania
    46. Estonia
    47. Latvia
    48. Cyprus
    49. Andorra
    50. Malta
    51. Kosovo
    52. Luxembourg
    53. Liechtenstein
    54. Gibraltar
    55. San Marino
     
    benficafan3 repped this.
  14. GreekAttackSux

    Jun 23, 2014
    Club:
    Olympiakos Piraeus
    I stand to my comment about Portugal having a mediocre defence. Theri defneders are highly overrated. If u watched hte match yesterday vs mexico ud understand.
     
  15. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    Nevermind the defense, their whole team is overrated. Look above your post: even @Italy-Azzurri-Fan ranks them #4!
     
  16. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    But literally though, who in Europe has a better defense than Portugal besides Germany, Italy, and Spain? I cannot think of any other team who can even defend that well.
     
  17. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    France.
     
  18. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    Really?

    Who usually starts for Real Madrid, Pepe or Varane? Pepe

    They are very similar, but I don't think France's defense is superior. France have conceded in every world cup qualifier game except vs Belarus and Netherlands. Even conceded to Luxembourg. Portugal only conceded 3 in their group, and 2 were by Switzerland who is better than anyone else in France's group.

    I think both defenses could be comparable, and France could be better on their day, but overall they are about the same.
     
  19. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    No, its inconclusive because both of them had many injuries last season. Looking ahead to next season, Varane will start regularly if healthy while Pepe is on the way out.

    Then Umtiti is Barca's best defender by a mile. N'Golo Kante is also a level above Carvalho imo.
     
  20. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    Kante is a midfielder, LOL. Yes France has a great midfield, but we were talking about their defense. I am not sure Umtiti is better than Mascherano and Pique by the way in terms of being Barca's best defender.

    As for next season, Pepe is leaving, so yeah obviously Varane will start. However in 2015-16 Pepe always got the nod.
     
  21. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Brooklyn, NY
    Well, yeah because Varane was still quite young. It's not 2015 anymore.

    I know Kante is a midfielder. We're talking about which team has the better defense, right? Well, Kante contributes to that. And I compared him to Carvalho so I'm comparing apples to apples
     
  22. Italy-Azzurri-Fan

    Nov 15, 2014
    Club:
    Juventus FC
    Country:
    Italy
    Yeah you are right, but I was looking at the back 4 specifically when I said that. Everyone contributes to defense in a way.
     

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