U.S. Soccer's player development plans

Discussion in 'USA Women: News and Analysis' started by lunatica, Dec 8, 2014.

  1. lunatica

    lunatica Member+

    Nov 20, 2013
  2. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Thanks for making the separate thread.

    From reading the press release, it seems some of those changes will affect both men's and women's program, for example the new U-16 and U-19 teams. Also, I'm guessing if changes are going to be made to the NCAA soccer season, it will affect the women as well.

    Now I'm curious which additionally changes will be announced that affect the women only. Any guesses? Does it involve NWSL??
     
  3. BrooklynSoccer

    BrooklynSoccer Member+

    Jan 22, 2008
    It will be interesting to see the changes made. Specifically, for youth WC's we've seen the rest of the world catch up with American women/girls quickly, partially because they are playing professionals. at the last U20 WC, US faced off against teams of young women who are already playing at the very top of their profession...where we only had Horan who was a pro (and it showed).
     
  4. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Well we did play all our professionals as well :)
     
  5. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    If I were USSoccer Id help the women by placing two teams in the NWSL. The teams would consist of players in the U18-U20 programs and would play an abbreviated schedule, say June & July. They could train at US training facilities. The matches wouldnt count in league standings.

    This would give US Youth players experience playing against quality teams in a club environment. It would also give NWSL some extra home matches to help with revenues and give NWSL fans a look at US up and comers.
     
  6. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    #6 holden, Dec 8, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2014
    Here's my crazy idea for what should change:

    * The NWSL draft changes so players are eligible to be drafted after their first season, so the January NWSL draft would be mostly freshman, but also any older college players that are still undrafted. (The reason I say after freshman season is two-fold: 1. So NWSL doesn't have to change from scouting collegians and 2. the current college recruitment system remains in place so NWSL isn't stepping on any toes)
    * College players then spend their summer training and playing with their NWSL team's reserves/academy to help them develop.
    * College players can be called up as amateur replacements when the NTers are away (similar to the exemption allowing college players to play with their NT team and keep their amateur status) to give them experience playing at a higher level.
    * NCAA adds exemptions to their eligibility rules to allow this to happen (they have some for ice hockey, so this isn't completely unheard of).

    This basically covers 2 birds with one stone: improving youth player development and providing quality amateur replacement players for NWSL teams during WWC and Olympic years.

    Edit: Actually, did this ever happen: NCAA looking at playing-with-pros rules? If this was allowed, that would make college recruitment of foreign players easier and my above suggestion easier. Heck a really good player could even spend the whole summer playing with the full NWSL squad, not just the reserves.
     
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  7. BrooklynSoccer

    BrooklynSoccer Member+

    Jan 22, 2008
    holden, i like your plan..i don't know how compensations work, would NWLS be able to pay for the room and board of those NCAA player it had on their teams?
    I could see some very elite players choosing to leave college after a couple years.
     
  8. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    They would be allowed to cover expenses, I believe. Similar to what's already in place for W-League and WPSL teams. Here's the WPSL statement on the matter:
    It doesn't really mention housing, but I know W-League teams have provided homestays for players. So there are ways to provide housing.
     
  9. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    I like that as well Holden.

    I would also propose a parallel reserves league (how expansive will this be?) to ensure that these college players to get meaningful minutes. Given how some coaches (I'm looking at you Harvey) where stingy with playing their entire bench in actual games, I'm not sure if these players will ever get the chance to play otherwise.
     
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  10. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    I like the idea of having a parallel reserves league if by parallel you mean what I think you mean. I suggested that sort of concept in Feb. Send a few extra reserves along with the first team and play the reserves game after the first team game, so any unused players can still get a game in (they wouldn't even necessarily have to have a full game, if they wanted to save on costs, even just having like a 45 minute scrimmage or some reduced time thing without refs would probably be beneficial). Of course this concept would require amateur players to be allowed to play on the same team as professional players.
     
  11. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Yes that is sort of what I mean.

    And I also think it is time NCAA soccer got rid of the amatuer vs professional player rule especially in soccer.
     
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  12. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    While I like the idea of funneling college players into NWSL reserves type programs, Im not in favor of dividing up the rights to freshmen for the same reason Im not much in favor of the other seemingly endless rights rules the NWSL has.
     
  13. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Well I'm not too happy about the many rights rules but I think they can make it work. For example, if you had the rights to a Freshman, they have to play X amount of games per year (if health) or else you forsake your rights to the player. That way they can ensure that teams are not just hoarding players.
     
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  14. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    Well, I was trying to work within the frameworks already in place and not be too disruptive. If I get hired to be NWSL commish and I can just toss aside any regulations I want, I could come up with some really innovative ideas.
     
  15. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    I always wondered what was better: A entire youth team playing against professionals or have the youth players integrated with professionals.
     
  16. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    I think to make this work ud need to get hired as head of the NCAA with NWSL Commisioner as ur night job.
     
    holden repped this.
  17. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    I think the later. By having them integrated with the professionals they get to see what pros do at times other than just during the game. Seeing how they practice, train/workout, relax, etc are things you can't really pick up from just playing against them.

    True. They just need to make me overlord of all sports! ;)
     
  18. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Well u can already play against professionals but ud need the NCAA changes to integrate...But, Im always willing to modify my plans. While I dont see a big advantage to playing with professionals (tho certainly small ones), I do see the advantages of training with professionals. So what if my two US Youth team were just nomads. If ur playing Seattle this week the whole team shows up for the week before the match and just has coordinated practices...then, like locust they move on to the next team.

    While I wouldnt be opposed to dividing up the youth players between the NWSL teams Im not sure ud get the NCAA to go for it. The other problem would be the Mexican conundrum. U can throw 5 US Youth players on Seattle but there is no way to guarantee how much Harvey will play them. If u keep them all together in two teams u have control of their playing time.
     
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  19. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Sepp Blatter has that job.
     
  20. holden

    holden Member+

    Dundee FC, Yeovil Town LFC, Girondins de Bordeaux
    Oct 20, 2009
    Los Angeles
    Club:
    Dundee FC
    Hmm... that would be interesting. That way they get to experience the training environments at all the NWSL teams. I think if the practices were integrated, they would still have to modify the NCAA eligibility rules... @Cliveworshipper would probably know for sure, though.

    Hmm... have they posted a job opening that? Wonder if I'd met the requirements... I expect they'd be a little tougher than the NWSL commish requirements. They might even require you to have some experience with sports management.
     
  21. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Hence the parallel reserves league. Have a rule that for each reserve game each team should field no less than 3 pros and no more than 6. This benefits the team as well because take someone like Brigman, I'm sure Harvey would have liked to have her in more games than she played last year
     
  22. Blaze20

    Blaze20 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Seattle Reign FC
    Sep 22, 2009
    Club:
    Philadelphia Independence
    Given that the discussion have so far focussed on how best to integrate college players in the pro ranks, does everyone think that going through the NCAA system is going to continue being the optimal way forward?
     
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  23. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Another way to look at this would be to expand on what they do now. Generally, if ur on the breakers reserves it means ur in the Mass/Conn areas. U could expand on that and replace ur draft with fours years of territorial rights. Each NWSL team would have the rights to players within there plus additional assigned regions. Then for four years they could develop those players. Then maybe each year u have a territorial draft and allow each team to sellect two seniors from their development territory before u have the rest of the college draft
     
  24. kernel_thai

    kernel_thai Member+

    Oct 24, 2012
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    and graft.
     
  25. Cliveworshipper

    Cliveworshipper Member+

    Dec 3, 2006
    #25 Cliveworshipper, Dec 8, 2014
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2014
    Well, if it were a YNT there is no problem.
    Youth club teams is no problem, but why would the pro team do that?

    If it is an entire college team each day of participation counts towards one of the 5 off season games.
    But otherwise practices with more than five players from any one college team is a no-no, and if a player plays on a pro team they burn their NCAA amateur status, possibly without regard to their FIFA amateur status. It hasn't been tested yet.

    Several coaches I know are even hesitant for their players to play on WPSL teams because they have no control over what kinds of contracts the WPSL teams sign with other players. You can't play on a team with pros. There probably needs to be an agreement between the NCAA and the USSF for it to work out.

    If you recall, the year with no league had pros playing on WPSL teams with college players. That was pretty shaky in NCAA terms.


    Right now several programs coordinate summer league with each local college team providing five players to each summer league team. Those teams can include future prospects.
     
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