Tuesday 19 Mar 2019

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by Stuart95, Mar 18, 2019.

  1. Stuart95

    Stuart95 Member+

    Mar 11, 2012
    NoVA
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Colorado Rapids 1, Sporting Kansas City 1 | 2019 MLS Match Recap
    https://matchcenter.mlssoccer.com/m...colorado-rapids-vs-sporting-kansas-city/recap

    Three takeaways from Colorado’s 1-1 draw with Sporting Kansas City
    https://www.prosoccerusa.com/mls/co...colorados-1-1-draw-with-sporting-kansas-city/


    MLS Week 3 review: FC Cincinnati’s incredible home opener and more

    https://www.prosoccerusa.com/mls/ml...pener-sounders-d-c-continue-to-roll-and-more/

    The MLS XI, Week 3: Good Things Happen in 3s; Altidore's Instant Impact
    https://www.si.com/soccer/2019/03/1...land-jozy-altidore-jordan-morris-wayne-rooney

    Seattle Sounders move to top of MLS Power Rankings as D.C. rises and SKC tumble
    http://www.espn.com/soccer/major-le...mls-power-rankings-as-dc-rises-and-skc-tumble

    The best tackles, passes and more from Week 3 in MLS | Matchday Central
    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2019/03/18/best-tackles-passes-and-more-week-3-mls-matchday-central

    Frustrating start to season shows Whitecaps still have growing to do
    https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/frustrating-start-season-shows-whitecaps-still-growing/

    After collapse in New York, San Jose Earthquakes search for complete game performance
    https://www.prosoccerusa.com/mls/sa...s-collapse-4-1-loss-new-york-red-bulls-recap/

    Report: DC United set to sign Griffin Yow as Homegrown player
    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2019/03/18/report-dc-united-set-sign-griffin-yow-homegrown-player

    Fort Lauderdale commissioners listen to proposals to redevelop disused soccer stadium
    https://wsvn.com/sports/fort-lauder...roposals-to-redevelop-disused-soccer-stadium/

    Tennessee State Fair to find new home, citing Nashville Fairgrounds 'not adequate'
    https://www.tennessean.com/story/ne...ir-location-nashville-fairgrounds/3204620002/

    MLS Expansion Update: It’s down to Sacramento and St. Louis
    https://www.thebluetestament.com/20...o-sacramento-and-st-louis-major-league-soccer

    Decision on Yedlin transfer solidarity payments from Sounders to Spurs delayed
    http://www.espn.com/soccer/major-le...arity-payments-from-sounders-to-spurs-delayed
     
    Namrog The Just repped this.
  2. footballfantatic

    Mar 27, 2008
    Ontario, California
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  3. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not sure that's what they are saying.. It seems to be more in relation to this year specifically as there is going to be a lot of construction going on at the fairgrounds related to the stadium and other associated improvements. Once construction is complete, it very well could come back.
     
    jack sticker repped this.
  4. jack sticker

    jack sticker Red Card

    Rangers
    United States
    Jun 5, 2018
  5. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  6. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That seems.. Harsh. But if making a deliberate play on the ball is the measure they want to go with, I hope they stick to it.. There seem to be a number of instances per week where a "deflection" isn't counted and a player is called offside.
     
    CeltTexan and VioletCrown repped this.
  7. TheRealBilbo

    TheRealBilbo Member+

    Apr 5, 2016
    #7 TheRealBilbo, Mar 19, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
    Keep in mind that a deliberate save does not reset offside. Had the same play been made on a shot, offside would not have reset, and the player receiving the ball would have committed the offside offense.

    Many of the instances each week are of the deliberate save variety - a defender attempting to block a shot. This one is a little unusual because it was a pass on the wing, and the defender misplayed the ball.

    The words of interest are save vs. play. There is also a distinction between the ball being played (or misplayed) and the ball deflecting off of a player. In this case, he played the ball, just not very well.
     
  8. onefineesq

    onefineesq Member+

    Sep 16, 2003
    Laurel, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Great point.
     
  9. GunnerJacket

    GunnerJacket Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 18, 2003
    Gainesville, GA
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Was it really a misplay, though, as opposed to an attempted play where the ball proved a little too far/fast to effectively control?
     
  10. TheRealBilbo

    TheRealBilbo Member+

    Apr 5, 2016
    I think the question we are looking for is whether a misplay of the ball is a play of the ball. The link from PRO covers that.

    There was a time when played by a defender meant "possessed and controlled," but that interpretation changed a few years ago.
     
  11. BostonRed

    BostonRed Member+

    Oct 9, 2011
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    GunnerJacket repped this.
  12. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I miss those days so very much.
     
    Bill Archer repped this.
  13. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    This is moronic by PRO and completely against the spirit of the game. Only reason he "deliberately tried to play the ball" was because he knew a player behind might score if he didn't. Same reason why the keeper deliberately plays the ball on a shot. This is like a guy making a back pass to the wrong team because didn't realize an opponent was there, or a guy hitting a shanking a cross field switch due to being pressured.
     
  14. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    Completely disagree - hope the realize they screwed up and don't double down on stupidity.
     
  15. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    This is not PRO screwing up anything. The correct call was made.

    Direct your complaints to the IFAB since they're the ones who wrote the Laws and decided this situation was not an offside offense.
     
    JasonMa repped this.
  16. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    It is the same thing - the only difference is that the ball was further, but because the height was so awkward, the level of difficulty was much higher. The resulting outcome is just a slightly unusual deflection. It is very poor officiating completely against the spirit of the game by extremely consistent inconsistent officiating in the league - with a doubling down of stupidity to try to justify a poor decision. They should get centralize VAR and have a team of elite guys make all the calls so you have consistency.
     
  17. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    Nonsense. Good officials would not have called that. They completely understand the difference between the letter of the law and the spirit of the game. You can make the claim they do on any attempt to block a shot or pass where a defender moves to the ball.
     
  18. ManiacalClown

    ManiacalClown Member+

    Jun 27, 2003
    South Jersey
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm going to make this absolutely clear to you.

    It was 10,000% the correct call in every single league in the entire world.

    Don't believe me? Here's almost the exact same situation in Europe, home of "elite referees." This clip comes directly from UEFA's instructional materials for referees.



    And here is UEFA's verdict:


    NO OFFENSE


    THIS IS NOT AN OFFSIDE OFFENSE

    I don't like it. You don't like it. Our opinions don't matter. Law 11 is what it is.
     
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  19. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    Thanks for the clip. I didn't believe they could be that moronic, but if this is a clip they are training officials with, then I somewhat stand corrected. It still is completely against the spirit of the rule and the game, however the interpretation does comply with pedants that created the ATR. Next time they might want to consult some players and fans.
     
  20. TheRealBilbo

    TheRealBilbo Member+

    Apr 5, 2016
    The pendants that created the ATR were at USSF, and that was where the "possess and control" wording for the reset by a defender came from. It was not in the actual IFAB/FIFA laws of the game.

    I also don't think that is against the "spirit of the game." Its not within the " spirit of the game" to reward a player for a bad/ill-advised play. Heck, I'd say that the "spirit of the game" wants the defender to be punished for a bad play. That's what this was. He wasn't going gonzo to try and made some sort of great save to keep the ball out of goal. He tried to stop a through ball. He misplayed it, allowing a cross that his opponents put on the back of the net.
     
  21. NashSC

    NashSC Member+

    Nashville SC
    United States
    Jan 3, 2018
    That is not at all how I read it. Sounds like they are saying even after the construction there won't be space. Sounds like it says they are planning to use it this year but not in the future.

    "Friday, voting for the move to "accommodate the future growth and goals" of the fair. "

    "The association is continuing to move forward with plans at the Nashville Fairgrounds for this year's event"
     
  22. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'll just put this here.. A-League game, where the mic up the referees, had a similar situation where a ball "glanced" off a defender and the attacker scored. Having the referee explain the play as it was happening would have been huge on Toronto's goal.

     
  23. scoachd1

    scoachd1 Member+

    Jun 2, 2004
    Southern California
    Not be be pedantic, but I doubt they were pendants and since the tweet appeared to be in French showing a EUFA clip it doesn't seem like the advice would be coming from the USSF.

    Why is it ill-advised for a defender to try intercept a ball played to a player behind him for an almost certain goal? Is it a defender responsibility to know stare down the line like an AR to whether a player behind is in an offside position? Explain the logic why a player cannot benefit from when a player reaches out with a "poor touch" to prevent a possible shot from going in the goal but it is ok do so when a player attempts to block a pass that would lead to an almost certain goal? If a player is going to block a goal with a poor touch, why shouldn't the attacking player in an offside position be able to benefit? After all the basis of your argument is the lack of skill, not the intent of trying to prevent the opposing team from scoring.

    It is unfortunate so few officials played the game at any level. I'd hear these guys that probably would struggle keeping the ball up with 5 touches making ridiculous comments about players technical ability.
     
  24. TheRealBilbo

    TheRealBilbo Member+

    Apr 5, 2016
    The current laws specifically say off side is not reset by a deliberate save. Take that up with IFAB. I am sympathetic to that argument.

    I also never said anything about player skill. He misplayed the ball. It happens all the time to even the best players. The game tests the skill of players and asks them to play at levels above their ability all the time. Top skilled players miss hit the ball from time to time. Same thing with player judgement, even top players use bad judgement - do ill-advised things from time to time. The laws of the game shouldn't forgive them for it.
     

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