top 10 strikers of the 21st century so far

Yes, I see what you mean. Maybe Baggio's role was even Bergkamp/Messi hybrid in some ways. Thinking about it maybe even at times for the Dutch NT Bergkamp did play a false-ish 9 role though (between two wingers, including in the 1994 WC) but still he was the main scorer and target too at those times probably.

I'd say since support strikers are much more common, that I define false 9 as a player that lines up seemingly as the only main central forward, but during play he drifts all over the place regularly and especially drops deep into midfield and acts as a playmaker, possibly the main one of the team even, while other players move into the centre-forward space vacated often too. So Cruyff as in WC74, Laudrup when he lined up in that formation for Barcelona pre-Romario, Messi at times in 08/09 certainly I think.

Historically deep-lying centre-forwards maybe also fit the idea of a false 9 (often literally wearing number 9). Nandor Hidegkuti, Alfredo Di Stefano, Raymond Kopa, maybe even Matthias Sindelar according to what we can read, some might say Bobby Charlton as he wore 9 and his role might have come about after the example of Hidegkuti but I think Charlton was really a proper midfielder and not even nominally a forward. But I don't know if the false 9 term existed at those times (deep-lying centre-forward was referred to to describe Hidegkuti and another Hungarian Peter Palotas, and maybe a bit later Florian Albert too although he played with less forward colleagues by then but still at least one player who acted more like a striker than him from inside forward). And the difference is that other forwards operated in the central areas of attack, so the team wasn't missing central attackers in the same way as the teams more modern false 9's played in (but when Eto'o went to the right, maybe he still came infield a lot to act as striker even compared to a Johnny Rep from the Dutch 1974 team? Puck might have a view on that comparing say the 1974 WC to the 2009 CL Final I guess).

 

False 9

Quite ambiguous term. Think we'd have to ask the author of term to explain himself what he meant by it

It could be

A playmaker (and/or midfielder) taking up a centre forward position in a secondary role. Or vice versa, a centre forward taking up the role of a playmaker in midfield. Gosh! it does my head in

 

Yes, I see what you mean. Laudrup might be more the first and Hidegkuti more the second maybe. But it is confusing, but I also stick by what I said (thought it's not easy to follow probably!).

Examples (though getting off topic as basically these are not 'strikers' and nor did they play in this century lol!):

 

I don't want to take this too off-tangent (and stick to strikers in the main although not all discussed strikers are 'striker-strikers' if you know what I mean). But maybe this is something for you. A series of articles.
http://apranchetatica.blogspot.com/2014/11/especial-holanda-1974-parte-4-2-modelo.html
And this
And this
This as well

As discussed very often before: in the successful 1978 Copa del Rey final he played expertly as a sweeper. To an extent John Motson was right, that more than any other legend he's difficult to pigeonhole. In the 1972EC final he played as a striker or 'false 9' though, as he himself commented.

Either way, the link might be nice for you.

 

Thanks - I can see it is a nice descriptive page about Total Football and Cruyff's role in it, although I can't translate actually (I tried to copy and paste the URL into google but no results were returned).

 

I had a thought today that brings this nicely back to the subject of 21st century strikers;

It is my impression that followers and 'experts' of other sports are more aware of that a body can take a finite number of hits.

This is in particular true of big and large bodies like Drogba and Cristiano had or have (study here). Cristiano moved away from the Premier League to prolong his career. I remember also FCB fan celito saying that Cristiano gets quite a bit less protection than most other stars.

Mourinho said once: "Ronaldo is protected by nothing and no-one. His opponents see that he has the body of an animal and they give him a kicking, and they only get a yellow card if they give him a proper kicking. That's not true for Messi. If you foul him you get booked straight away, and then can't foul him again or you'll be sent off."

The last few years there's maybe Bale to absorb this 'for him' so to speak. There is plenty of evidence around showing a decrease in contact injuries, better treatment of ACL injuries etc. (example) but there is still a limit.

I think this concept is better known and appreciated in other sports. A brief search found a very recent example, mentioning basketball and American football. Also touching upon that paradoxically that big forwards and centers (strikers in football) don't have it easier necessarily. If you like to watch it, here it is.

In relation to 21st century strikers, I saw this overview:



Of course, both RvP and Henry had also a significant number of assists on top (53 and 74 assists, the latter predominantly from wide areas) and Shearer played perhaps for the least capable teams.

 

Yeah, sorry to just add one thought (and a 'repetitive' one after discussion re: Messi/CR7 and 'inflated' stats etc etc) but I guess Aguero might have the advantage in team edge and also era (re: penalisation of fouls and offside laws) and maybe GPG for top sides is the best way to try and measure that - not that things can be 'equalised' as such by any calculation and it's all subjective. Shearer obviously played at quite a late age (although still scoring pretty well) so that affects the overall average I guess too in terms of mins/goal.

 

Drogba has no case for being in the top 5(Henry,R9,ibrahimovic,eto'o,Shevchenko,suarez all rank above him and if considering only peak level van persie and Falcao would also be included)

Raul was a non factor from 2004 onwards
He was great at the beginning of the 2000s no doubt(and also in the late 90s playing a very crucial role in madrids 2 cl campaigns)
Based on consistency Raul should be nowhere near a top 10 striker of the 2000s list(he was only top class 2 maybe 3 years max)

On peak level you may have a point(he could've in fact he shouldve won the ballon dor in 01 instead of Owen)
having said this 2001 was one of the worst ever ballon dor years
(None of the real stars of the day really turned up that year)

How the hell would Raul rank over suarez and R9 in the 2000s?
suarez has been top 5 undisputed player from 2013-2016 in the most competitive era of all time, Raul never managed this in his career
(Your whole propaganda about Raul winning a gazillion club titles in his career is misleading - yes it is true Raul won 7 L titles and 3 CL but 5 of his league titles and 2 of his CL trophies came in the 1990s)

Raul is a borderline top 20 player of the last 2 decades nothing more and nothing less.

It is so typical of you to underrate r9 (no wonder why)
Little did you know R9 was voted player of the decade in serie 1997-2007 despite playing only 2 seasons there
His comeback performance in WC 2002 was legendary especially after having been on and off the operating table for 2-3 years 99-02
(Most "experts" had written him off saying he would never be force again...little did they know he would score 8 goals in the world Inc 3 in the SF and final)

 

They showed this yesterday and a brief article from friday.

Teams reaching the semi final of the Champions League (since 2000-01 season, when four teams got allowed)





Among other things it is mentioned that in almost all Champions League groups the two teams with the highest wages are also the top two finishers. The only exception, on paper at least, is AS Monaco.

This situation has also clearly an effect on the development and progression of the individual players itself. Belgium has adapted very well to the new situation however whereas the traditional Dutch approach isn't necessarily worse but in the current landscape a failing one (Holland used to perform very, very poorly in youth tournaments but then players grew into maturity at the age of 20-21, having internalized the playing strategy; this isn't working any more though for obvious reasons and that's sad. They're struggling to adapt to the new realities and in accepting/embracing a sub-optimal situation to work with). Think also about what's often said for Ronaldinho and what they hope Ibrahimovic will effectuate on Rashford.

Anyway, sorry for the rant (as they also said when they showed above picture: it isn't surprising that ambition and motivation is lost) and hopefully either of Hazard or De Bruyne will grow further into 'best of Europe' category, but yes the first graph supports what you say. There are fewer and fewer teams who make the semi final, since the 'four teams per country' era started.

 

2004 inflated the number a bit. It was a wacky year, both in club and international football. 2004 alone provided 3 one-time semi-finalists, and also 2 one-time finalists.

 

2004 doesn't inflate the "15 different teams" number.

2004 was a strange year with a Porto vs Monaco final, but in this respect it isn't that extreme an outlier compared to the surrounding years. 2005 had two one-time semi finalists and 2003 had two as well. You say that it inflates the number but that is not really true. 2010 had three one-time semi finalists as well.

2002: 2 one-time semi finalists
2003: 2
2004: 3
2005: 2
2006: 2

This results in 15 different semi final teams.

2007: 1
2008: 0
2009: 1
2010: 3 (Bayern, Inter and Lyon)
2011: 2 (Real Madrid, Schalke)

This results in 11 different semi final teams.

2012: 0
2013: 1
2014: 0
2015: 1
2016: 1

This results in 8 different semi final teams.

If anything it is rather the 2006-2011 years ("11 different teams") that are inflated because it includes two teams that are undeniably transferred over to the new period (LvG Bayern and Mourinho Real Madrid). The year 2004 isn't an inflated year for the five year span it is a part of.

This was also the time of the 'second group stage' (until 2003), which reduces the chances for upsets considerably.

 

I think the division of the "eras" above, is possibly misleading or inflated – perhaps not intentionally (with an agenda in mind), but arguably at least coincidentally.

Juventus played Semi Finals in 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, and 2003. AC Milan played Semi Finals in 2003, 2005, 2006, and 2007. Different dynasties, from different eras, that passed each other off in 2003. In other words: Italian clubs that are as dominant as that, help increase the probability of big teams eliminating big teams early in the competition, and with a bit of luck, teams like FC Porto, Monaco, Deportivo Coruna, etc., can find themselves in the Semi Finals.

On the other hand, when Calciopoli (2006) came around, you suddenly no longer had AC Milan and Juventus as strong Champions League opposition, and arguably the frequency of big teams eliminating big teams early in the competition, declined.

Post-Calciopoli (2006-2016): AC Milan (1), Juventus (1), Inter (1).
Pre-Calciopoli (1996-2006): AC Milan (3), Juventus (4), Inter (1).

Long story short: the Serie A no longer really produced any “big teams” to eliminate the big teams from Spain and England, and so FC Porto no longer enjoyed the benefit of AC Milan (4th place in the league, 2nd place in their group) eliminating Barcelona (1st place in the league, 1st place in their group), early in the competition, thereby allowing FC Porto to not play any big teams at any point before the Quarter Finals, or even before the Semi Finals. The 2006-11 era and also the 2011-16 era, do not enjoy that same inflation, in that regard.

But overall, the increased gap between the rich and the rest, will probably increasingly transform the Semi Finals into a rather exclusive club. That being said, I do think that the eras as divided by the above photo, are misleading, because Calciopoli is not acknowledged. And particularly misleading against the 2006-11 period (fresh after Calciopoli, and an era that did not included 2 dynasties from different eras passing each other off).

 

00/01 - 19/20

Criteria: major trophies won, big game record, champions league record, iconic moments, p90 ratios, peak season, influence, consistency, ballon d'or placements, general play

1. Suarez
2. Henry
3. Lewandoski
4. Eto'o
5. Benzema
6. Ibrahimovic
7. Drogba
8. Rooney
9. Shevshencko
10. Aguero
HM: Cavani, Torres, Higuian, Kane, Villa

 

1. Suarez
2. Lewandowski
3. Henry
4. Eto’o
5. Benzema
6. Ibrahimovic
7. Shevchenko
8. Rooney
9. Villa
10. Aguero

 

I have always found van Nistlerooy overrated. He was limited, maladaptive, selfish and had his goal tallies inflated by penalties. He only scored one goal outside the box for Man United from 150. He averaged fewer than 3 league assists a season.

He never scored 20+ NPG in a league season or 30+ NPG in all competitions in neither England or Spain. The best thing he has going for him is his great CL record, but 50 of his 56 goals came in the group stage, and he only reached the Quarter-Finals twice.

‘If we’d won 3-0 and he’d missed a decent chance, afterwards he’d sit in the corner of the dressing room looking miserable,’ said Ryan Giggs. Similarly, Paul Scholes said ‘If he didn’t score, he’d sit on the back of the bus and sulk, even if we’d won the game,’. He played for himself and the expense of the team.

There is a great paragraph about van Nistlerooy and his limitations in Michael Cox's The Mixer; Paragraph 10 - One Up Font
https://archive.org/stream/MichaelCoxTheMixer/Michael Cox - The Mixer_djvu.txt

Ibrahimovic is let down by his poor Champions League record (only played one SF), his league titles haul is impressive and consistency is ridiculous (4 decades), but apart from 2010/11 he was always with the title favorites. Also his time at PSG massively inflated his goal record.

Elsewhere, Rooney and Drogba was a toss up, but I felt Drogba's peak 05/06 - 09/10 was slightly better than Rooney's 09/10 - 13/14. I have them both over Aguero and Shevchenko because they were more complete.

 

Did you see young Shevchenko?

Do you feel Drogba was more physical & more a target man, making him more complete in your view (I don't see it otherwise, and at Chelsea together isn't the best place tp judge I think, although Sheva did set up some Drogba goals to be fair there too)?

I think Shevchenko gets under-valued nowadays. Maybe before it could even be some over-valued him in historical terms potentially when his star was brightest (maybe because he was seen as a modern player) but now I think it went the opposite way for sure.

 

Although to be fair, the 90s at least would be excluded from consideration here (not saying that means I'd be going along 100% with the proposed list but then we all would go with slightly different ones to each other I suppose). Maybe that period, when he was called the 'White Ronaldo' (which perhaps as alluded to can be going over the top a bit if taken literally, but for sure he had pace, could dribble, was a good scorer vs top teams, could interact well with team-mates etc...so like I also allude to quite a complete 'modern striker') would provide a better case for what I suggest (and maybe factoring it in at least adds to consideration of body of work within the time period). After all Michael Fabzio, you don't put in Ronaldo himself at all (due to the 90s being irrelevant I guess, although he must have some chance to be in based on this century too I'd think so along with Van Nistelrooy could be a surprising omission that could be pointed out like he was).

I do vaguely recall that Drogba did score a nice solo goal or two himself back when playing in France (I mean when dribbling or taking the ball past players etc, rather than power shooting or holding players off like he used for some Chelsea 'solo goals'). I still do think (and to an extent it can apply to this century in Sheva's prime during it too I think) that Shevchenko was more mobile, agile, fluid in moving with the ball, accurate in finishing, and more of a 'footballer' in terms of participating in team play in general, even if on some days it wasn't always so evident as on others I think (and purely in terms of assists Drogba does have a decent tally, but like I say some of that will be due to the hold up play, use as target man etc, rather than combining with team-mates in passing moves or carving out chances using skills).

 

https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/4...ngland-Premier-League-2010-2011-Wigan-Chelsea

 

Yeah I can't argue with Shevchenko>Drogba, to be fair the bottom 4 of my list is interchangeable. What went against Shevchenko is he only won one league title in 9 seasons for Milan and Chelsea (both teams won the league the season before him if that means anything).

Shevchenko like Torres I feel had their legacy tainted by their failures at Chelsea, where they were really bad and came with record transfer fees, both were the best in the world in the prime. Statistically Torres 05/06 - 09/10 (0.57 NPG p90) was very similar to Shevchenko 00/01 - 05/06 (0.56 NPG p90).

Shevshencko never scored more than 25 NPG in a season (all competitions) certainly nothing comes close to Drogba's 09/10 season where he scored 36 NPG. By the way Drogba is the only Premier League player to score 33+ NPG in a season twice (06/07 & 09/10). Aguero has never scored 30+ NPG in a season for example, Henry's best is 32.

R9 is overrated, unbelievable talent but tactically inept and a complete egoist, there's a reason he won 1 league title in Europe, I don't put too much stock in national team performances because its unfair on players like Lewandoski, Eto'o etc., who play for smaller nations while at club level the playing field is level. I've explained why I omitted RVN (useless without service and useless outside the box).

Its fallacious to both limit Drogba's assist record to his hold up play and argue Shevshencko was better at linking play, this is Drogba's strong point as opposed to finishing and is reflected by his assist ratio, his 0.28 Ap90 ratio is only bettered by Henry in terms on striker in PL history and Henry took set pieces. He got 10+ assists in 3 different PL seasons (Rooney, Bergkamp, Cantona only forwards with more). Have a look at Drogba's assist in 2009/10 league season they are all play making assists, Shevshencko never reached those heights in his general play. If you want I can name/show 20+ Drogba assists uncomparable to anything Shevshencko ever done.

 

0:14
1:07

 

Torres at Atleti never was amongst the top 10 Non-Penalty/90 in La Liga. They were an average team to be fair league positions from 02/03 - 06/07 show this (12th, 7th, 11th, 10th, 7th). It's interesting I wonder what happened for him to explode at Liverpool? Because what he done at Liverpool was extraordinary, people who watched Atleti in the early 2000s could answer what type of was he? was it clear that in a great team he would be very good?

I feel like people only talk about Torres' first season at Liverpool, but he was exceptional in all his three seasons, injuries cost him in his 2nd and 3rd seasons (made only 20 league starts). In terms of consecutive 3 seasons peaks Torres 07/08 - 09/10 is the best I've seen in the PL in terms of out and out striker (Henry was better overall 03/04 - 05/06 & RVP was more decisive 10/11 - 12/13), I've always maintained this and it's always been a controversial opinion, even though the stats back it up.

Its a shame he never won a trophy, they would've won the league in 08-09 had he been fit all season. Its important to remember Torres took zero penalties at Liverppol, which is rare he is similar to Drogba and Suarez in that regard, he could have won back to back PL golden boots had he took them.

Look at Torres' peak compared to the other PL greats.

PL Non-Penalty Goals/90
2007-2008 Premier League 0.85 (2nd)
2008-2009 Premier League 0.73 (1st)
2009-2010 Premier League 0.95 (1st)

131 - Between his first top-flight season at Atletico Madrid (2002-03) & his final full season at Liverpool (2009-10), only 3 players scored more goals within the top 5 Euro leagues than Fernando Torres (131): Thierry Henry (151), Samuel Eto'o (150) & David Villa (140). Memories. pic.twitter.com/1LoecMsEmM

— OptaJoe (@OptaJoe) August 23, 2019

5374 - Mohamed Salah took 5374 minutes to reach 50 Premier League goals in his career; only Alan Shearer (5337 mins) managed it quicker. Fernando Torres (5483), Ruud van Nistelrooy (5600) & Sergio Aguero (5710) complete the top 5 quickest to 50 Premier League goals. Clarification pic.twitter.com/OdpACiSNQ8

— OptaJoe (@OptaJoe) January 21, 2019

121.3 - Fernando Torres' mins-per-goal rate at Liverpool was better than Thierry Henry's at Arsenal (121.8). Halcyon.

— OptaJoe (@OptaJoe) January 6, 2015

5 - Top 5 PL mins/goal (excl pens) at single club:
Sturridge (Liv) 114
Torres (Liv) 121
Cole (NU) 121
Aguero (MC) 125
Shearer (BR) 128
Open.

— OptaJoe (@OptaJoe) August 29, 2014