Toni Kroos: #3

Discussion in 'Germany: National Teams' started by Dead Fingers, Sep 1, 2008.

  1. F96

    F96 Member+

    Oct 24, 2002
    Skåne
    Club:
    Hannover 96
    The 4-1-4-1 is so much better suited for him.
    Was happy with the way he played even though he still doesn't seem to trust his shot as much as he used to.

    He needs confidence. Hope he gets some in the CL. ;)
     
  2. Leinad

    Leinad Member+

    Jun 13, 2006
    Düsseldorf
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think he is one of the players who just needs the experience that is required as CM (see Xavi) and people are far too impatient with him.
    He showed yesterday that he has the potential to be a top class player and just needs to mature his overall game, especially in the defence but his passing and vision is already among the best.
     
  3. Equilibrium

    Equilibrium Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    None of your busines
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    He won't get it with Heynckes, Heynckes atm wants to win with 0-0 results no matter who they play.

    His best hope is Robbery getting injured to play in CL. I agree with more time if he was a starter at Bayern (CM, not AM or out wide), we would all see a cocky, confident player many of us enjoyed when he was 3-4 years younger.
     
  4. ForeverRed

    ForeverRed Member+

    Aug 18, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Kroos at CM for the NT could be a great compromise to fit the other talents in and nothing so far has indicate that he isn't up to the task.
     
  5. Equilibrium

    Equilibrium Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    None of your busines
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    That's still not saying much.. :p
     
  6. Thomas T.

    Thomas T. Member

    Jul 24, 2011
    Hamburg
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    He was more than great at the U17 WC in 2007 in Korea where he was awarded the golden ball as player of the tournament.
    His main strength is that he is a genius at passing the ball (and, to a lesser degree, at shooting the ball and ball control). At this, he is not merely good, but, as I said, a genius, with the potential to reach the level of the all-time greats. He is also strong and intelligent.
    He has, admittedly, only shown flashes of that genius in his games for Leverkusen or Bayern so far, but still more than enough to support the hope that he will finally make the break-through. He has way more potential than all other German players except Goetze and maybe Oezil.
     
  7. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München

    Chances are he will get to play in the CL. He just needs to start more games, looking at things each game at a time, Ribery or Robben look like they'll be out the next game, giving him ample time to prove himself.
     
  8. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    I would love to see him partner Schweini with Gotze and Oezil with them. Gotze does a fair bit of running, and might compromise defensive duties as well since he always puts pressure on players. We'll have to see.
     
  9. Equilibrium

    Equilibrium Member+

    Sep 21, 2007
    None of your busines
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    So what, he shouldn't even play AM imo he is better as a CM than AM. You need to be a whiz kid, fast and all over the place to be a good AM these days with the style football is today. Kroos needs to play deeper, and Heynckes doesn't seem a fan of having Kroos and Basti there.

    He is a bit wasted there imo.
     
  10. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Him and Schweini in the middle looks like a failing plan. He can't defend, counter attacks will destroy us.
     
  11. ForeverRed

    ForeverRed Member+

    Aug 18, 2005
    NYC
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Well that's not entirely dependent on just our CM's but the rest of the team as well. We need collective defending, pressing from all three lines and a coordinated defense.
     
  12. Thomas T.

    Thomas T. Member

    Jul 24, 2011
    Hamburg
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Counterattacks didn't destroy Germany in their game against Brazil, despite having often only Schweini in the middle, and Kroos in front of him, in a 4-1-4-1. Brazil managed a few dangerous counterattacks, but how many? 2? 3? If Brazil is not able to steal the ball and get it quickly to their forward players who is? The (little bit of) added vulnerability to counterattacks was more than set off by the added offensive impact of Kroos and the dominance in midfield.

    This game has shown that attack and ball possession is the best defense. You don't need destroyers in the midfield, if you keep possession and, if you happen to lose the ball, swarm the opposing player so that he has no time on the ball to pick a pass and has to play backwards, or - even better - loses the ball. This is the way Barcelona play.
    For this, you need players who don't lose possession - for which they need to be extremely comfortable on the ball, and able to play their way out of pressure without having to resort to risky, blind passes. In other words, they must be able to play tiki-taka. Kroos is ideally suited to such tactics.
     
  13. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    JESUS! This was a friendly and not that big a deal, Brazil have been faltering under that new coach for a while now AND we conceded 2 goals! Think the netherlands, spain, portugal - you can't base such a grandiose conclusion on the basis of one friendly against a world class team.

    You must be capable of retaining possession everytime you lose it to follow through with such tactics, as Barcelona are so adept at doing. With Oezil in the lineup, and Trasch out - you lose that ability almost entirely, even with Mueller, Gotze and Schuerrle playing. There is no comparing the fact that Pedro, Messi, Xavi, Busquets, Villa and Iniesta are all pressers and don't stop running.

    Compare those to Schweini, Kroos, Oezil, Schuerrle, Gomez and Muller and you can begin to understand why we can't yield such a lineup.

    Kroos is exceptional at playing creative balls, and will be one of the best, but we don't really need that as much as we need another destroyer.

    If Leow can make Kroos a Xavi type player, who does press and create opportunities like he did against Brazil, that'll be perfect because we'll be a more fluid team - till then however, he is just not up to the task.
     
  14. Thomas T.

    Thomas T. Member

    Jul 24, 2011
    Hamburg
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Only one of those goals came after a counterattack. The other was a defensive error that can happen in any tactical formation.
    The game was a friendly, but Brazil were highly motivated because they wanted to defuse criticism and regain the respect they had lost at Copa America.
    And Brazil may "have been faltering", but they are still one of the best teams in the world and have quick, technically gifted players and therefore should be more able to counterattack than most other teams.
    Also, what if the opponent is not "netherlands, spain, portugal" - would you concede that at least against weaker teams this formation with Kroos could work?

    I assume you mean "capable of regaining possession".
    You say the German players are not capable of pressing, constant running and regaining possession quickly. But they just did against Brazil! They are capable of it! And they hadn't even rehearsed it in training much because this was the first time they played these tactics!
    If you see Gomez regularly in Bayern games you will find out that he is no longer only a target man but does a lot of pressing and defensive work. If Klose plays instead of him, then there is even less of a question mark because Klose, along with Mueller and Schweini are the ultimate tacklers and pressers. Schuerrle and Goetze are good at it, too. And why do you assume that Traesch will not be playing when Oezil returns?
    I admit, that Oezil is not very good at regaining the ball. But I think that the tactics still work with one weaker defensive player. If not, then Oezil could be benched for Goetze in those games.
     
  15. deleted

    deleted Member

    Aug 18, 2006
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Is it me or is Toni Kroos getting his swagger back?

    :cool:
     
  16. Viper87

    Viper87 Member

    Oct 13, 2008
    It's not just you. Loew also praised him very highly. Everybody is talking about Oezil and Goetze, but Kroos really left an impression in his last several games for the NT.
     
  17. Leinad

    Leinad Member+

    Jun 13, 2006
    Düsseldorf
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    and it's not just the NT, he had also very good games in the CL against top teams while Özil's and Götze's performances were decent in the CL but not really outstanding either.
    I think he is starting to show why he was rated so highly in the past and he has definitely everything to become a worldclass player, I just hope he continues to develop like this until the EC because then he might even be a starter for Germany.
     
  18. shap_half

    shap_half Member+

    Oct 17, 2010
    New York
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Seems like even Clark Whitney is singing Toni's praises as a soon-to-be permanent fixture on the DFB's starting XI.
     
  19. odd1234

    odd1234 Member

    Mar 2, 2011
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
  20. Epitome990

    Epitome990 Member+

    Jun 27, 2013
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    Nat'l Team:
    Austria
     
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  21. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    only trophy missing is the Euro with Germany and he'll have won every tournament/trophy he ever participated senior level. World class player who accomplished a ton. 1st German to win CL with 2 different clubs and 1st to win 3 CL.
     
    Epitome990 repped this.
  22. nekkibasara

    nekkibasara Member+

    Apr 12, 2004
    Fairfax, Virginia
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    He won the U21 EC with Germany as well.
     
  23. Ger90

    Ger90 Member+

    May 13, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I was talking about senior titles and Kroos was left out of the 2009 U21 EC team so he never won that. His only success at youth from what I remember is 3rd place at the U17 WC.
     
    nekkibasara repped this.
  24. Thomsen

    Thomsen Member+

    Aug 6, 2016
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Imagine which player he would've been if he worked a little bit more defensively... :whistling:
     
  25. Epitome990

    Epitome990 Member+

    Jun 27, 2013
    Club:
    SV Werder Bremen
    Nat'l Team:
    Austria

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