Which players are you thinking of? De Jong or Van de Beek didn't play too many games before they were 20 years old, and they are now also careful with the next crop like Unuvar, Talor and Gravenbergh. They were, tragically, even careful with phasing Nouri in. The only example I can think of is De Ligt who has indeed a huge amount of games before he turned 20 (he can withstand the comparison to Rooney or VDV in that regard) - further boosted by playing a Europa League final with Ajax and CL semi final - but it is also a less demanding position. I mean, VDV scored 25 goals in all competitions in the year he turned 20 (incl. Champions League, national team) and that's just more demanding than defending, dribble infield from time to time and sending a nice pass. De Ligt has played 17 caps before he turned twenty, six more caps as the next in the list (Jan van Breda Kolff). Furthermore, he is the youngest player ever with 20 caps behind his name, but the player he succeeded wasn't exactly burned out early (and remains the youngest with 50 caps). He'd be the first I think of but who do you have in mind?
No one specific, but a worry about the pressure from the circumstances we as Dutch clubs are in could lead to over using young players by playing too long or too much. My main concern is about the trens too physically prep players faster by making them stronger at younger age than a decade ago. In those days youth players most of the times still were boys physically, but now are more matured at the same age. No one knows how that turns out at later stages in their careers.
Yes but what I've seen is that the clubs have learned from this. Around 2007-2008 we have had a few where it went wrong (Aissatti, Affelay, Marcellis) exactly because the clubs entirely neglected physical exercises and stability training. The ones where it went right (Wijnaldum) are physically strong by default, played 100 pro games before he was twenty without many problems. Articles like this ("Holland goalkeepers need to work on their physical strength"): https://www.trouw.nl/nieuws/nederlandse-keepers-moeten-vaker-het-krachthonk-in~b825d4564/ When De Vrij was at Feyenoord he lost his captaincy because he started to do weight lifting exercises. https://www.rtlnieuws.nl/sport/voetbal/artikel/2358101/extra-training-breekt-de-vrij-op https://www.ad.nl/nederlands-voetbal/privetrainer-de-vrij-noemt-feyenoord-dit-topsport~a355d4f7/ "When Dutch clubs play in European competition, you have long had the feeling of watching men play Teletubbies. That may be what awaits them at the World Cup. Part of the problem is a simple lack of muscle. In the showers after an international game last year, some of the Dutch players who play with clubs abroad were teasing Feyenoord center-back Stefan de Vrij, 22, about his weediness. Look at the muscles of his fellow center-back Ron Vlaar, they said. Indeed, Vlaar, who plays for Aston Villa, is one of the few Dutch internationals built like a modern international player. De Vrij got the message. Since Feyenoord did hardly any strength training, he hired his own trainer and began building himself up. But when Feyenoord found out he'd been doing secret training, the club was irate. It stripped him of his captain's armband. Now he's probably about to start the World Cup, and he's still weedy." https://www.espn.com/soccer/club/name/449/blog/post/1864047/headline The clubs and KNVB have moved on since a bit. Now we only need to arrange some FIFA, WADA waivers and free passes (or FIFA friends who do the cover-up, like in 1966 and 1986 for the usual suspects) for HGH and testosterone and we might go for gold It will be important what draw we get. When we finally had a favorable draw in 2010 we 'suddenly' reached the final (same for when Portugal was 'suddenly' seeded in 2004 and 2016 as opposed to all the other tournaments except 2018). It's important for recovery, injuries and suspensions.
https://nos.nl/artikel/2306619-de-toekomst-van-oranje-de-20-grootste-talenten-van-nederland.html Looks to me all of those are phased in gradually. Ajax has debuted their gems at 16 yes, but they don't rush them. Clubs have learned from the past and also cases like the original Ronaldo.
Sadly, one of Ajax's talents has chosen to play for the USA (the one with a Guardian article before playing a single game). Which is on the one hand strange because he was born here and grew up here, with a dutch mother and a Surinamese father (with a dutch passport, but also an usa passport because of living there). On the other hand, it shows the power of money. The Ajax director said recently him choosing for USA is both for his clubs and the player more interesting from a commercial perspective (the reason why he had that The Guardian article in the first place). Sad reality. We have some problems at the right-back position. Another country traitor. Hopefully he will be booed and whistled whenever we play him. Not to mention all those under-16 Moroccans who are loyal to Meccah and not the place that gave them an education, a relatively safe home (with their europe born supporters causing riots and chaos the last time we played them). At the same time, those old talent lists from 2001 and 2007 show how hard it is to predict (see this).
Yeah. However a yeat ago we were talking like that about the whole team, from the back line to the front. Now Koeman has choices to make in every line. So I'm not worried about the rb spot (actually I for years oppose the idiots that with a little headwind for the Orange team start screaming for changes this, changes that) as candidates will come up for it.
Good enough to hold the first position according the Elo method for another decade? I hope so. Brazil's Generation Next.Four XIs with some of the best Brazilian U21s.The future looks bright.🇧🇷🇧🇷🇧🇷 pic.twitter.com/sci4fZEol4— Football Talent Scout - Jacek Kulig (@FTalentScout) October 25, 2019 And there are many, many more such as Jean Pyerre, Gustavo Assunção, Fernando, Jonas Toró, Gabriel Silva, Marrony, Igor, Brenner, Arthur Gomes, Andrey, Lazaro, Tuta, Roger Ibañez, Marquinhos Cipriano, Arthur Cabral, Kaio Jorge, Vinicius Popó, Ramires, Diego Rosa, Juan.— Football Talent Scout - Jacek Kulig (@FTalentScout) October 25, 2019
People putting felix ahead of sancho are deluded. Felix has done nothing of note so far in his career. A couple of decent performances for Atletico. That's it. Compared to sancho who has broken records in the Bundesliga. Plus hes done far more at international level
English footballers rarely live up to the hype. If this list was made in 2016 then Delle Ali would probably be near the top, look at him now. Also remember how back in 2004-2006, most people were rating Rooney ahead of Ronaldo.
That willnot be often. Most likely shot is in a WC group stage. Wonder if US fans would like that idea. If it's in the 2026 WC we could try to get him booed by his own fans by trying to destroy the USA.
Nigel de Jong knows how it is done: Without kidding; maybe there is a problem in that 'we' (and others) are not nationalistic and patriotic enough in this. On schools, even the orthodox christian schools, we don't do anthem singing and a sizable chunk of history lessons is about what went wrong and our own role in this. See surveys as this and this. The more hierarchic schools lean their identity on religion rather than nation. Our FA also doesn't do active recruitment of dual nationals and there are suspicions other FAs (not the USA one, but Spain, Morocco and Turkey) are paying people. Michel Houllebecq his recent observation on the low country was: "a race of polyglot and opportunistic traders. It doesn't exist as a nation and country, it is at best a business". The national team could have been stronger with the likes of Ziyech (Perreira of Man United is a comparable case). On the plus side though, it's a positive how bombardments of fake news have been less effective here than on other countries of a comparable or bigger size. The reality is stronger than the pet project of billionaires... That's the plus side of not rallying around the flag so easy.
None of them are fully proven yet, but what you guys think of some of the young Italian talents coming through? Federico Chiesa Niccolo Barella Stefano Sensi Niccolo Zaniolo Sandro Tonali Moise Kean Gaetano Castrovilli Chiesa for me has a high ceiling if he can develop properly. Sensi is linked with Barca after hitting the ground running with Inter. Barella is consistently impressive. Zaniolo could be a star. Already has a brace in a UCL knockout tie. Tonali is going from strength to strength and could maybe be the pick of the bunch.
That list is just copypaste behaviour without real meaning (edit: from the site, not you) https://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/performancezone/teamoftheweek/ You're more valuable when you mean something for the team in matches.
Good news, Ihatarren has chosen to represent Oranje. Really like him as a footballer from what I've seen and how he supports his team. 73% - Since his debut (Januari 2019), @PSV had a 73% win percentage in the Eredivisie with Mohamed Ihattaren in the starting eleven against 53% without him. Lion. pic.twitter.com/9OT5E4Repe— OptaJohan (@OptaJohan) November 3, 2019 Most valuable U17s by @Transfermarkt:🇬🇼Ansu Fati 25M€🇳🇱Mohamed Ihattaren 15M€🇪🇸Pedri 5M€🇧🇷Reinier 5M€🇦🇷Matías Palacios 5M€🇧🇪Jérémy Doku 5M€🇳🇱Ryan Gravenberch 5M€🇦🇴Eduardo Camavinga 4M€🏴Harvey Elliott 4M€🇨🇿Adam Hlozek 4M€🇳🇱Ki-Jana Hoever 5M€— Football Talent Scout - Jacek Kulig (@FTalentScout) September 26, 2019 Most talented U17s in the World by @FTalentScout!🇳🇱Mohammed Ihattaren🇧🇷Reinier🇳🇱Ryan Gravenberch🇦🇴Eduardo Camavinga🇳🇱Naci Unuvar🇮🇹Sebastiano Esposito🇫🇷Lucien Agoume🇧🇪Jérémy Doku🏴Harvey Elliott🇹🇷Ömer Faruk Beyaz🇨🇿Adam Hlozek🇬🇼Ansu Fati🇫🇷Rayan Cherki🇵🇹Ronaldo Camara— Football Talent Scout - Jacek Kulig (@FTalentScout) September 6, 2019 It's understandable he took his time given the death of his father a month ago "I thought about it for a long time," Ihattaren says. "I have talked a lot about it with my family. A lot has happened in the meantime. In the end we decided to choose the Netherlands team. Because the KNVB did a lot for me in the youth teams. For my mother it was also directly a good feeling. She became emotional about it. That says a lot and then the choice is fairly easy." https://www.omroepbrabant.nl/nieuws...oekomst-in-Oranje-Mijn-moeder-werd-emotioneel https://www.onsoranje.nl/nieuws/nederlands-elftal/77157/mohamed-ihattaren-kiest-voor-oranje Also positive is De Ligt stepping out and becoming the youngest derby scorer in 60 years (the 5th youngest), the winner for the 1-0. I suppose that shows the Serie A is a league for old players, lol. https://www.ad.nl/buitenlands-voetbal/italiaanse-media-vol-lof-na-eerste-goal-de-ligt-de-reus-is-opgestaan~a7784377/ The way he continues to have unlucky bounces against his arm is Murphy's law I suppose. Last week there was a close range ricochet and deflection from Bonucci and he couldn't do much about it. Shame we lost Dest to the USA but rather prefer Ihattaren to be honest. He has in potential that special ingredient imho, the technical ability and also the team ethic/awareness (maybe we can start with playing him as the right-back ).
Sensi and Tonali are almost always brilliant when I watch them. Chiesa is hyped a great deal but I don't see him as one of the best wingers in the world in future and I hope Juve don't break the bank. Zaniolo could also be a star. Kean should never have left Juve of course
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Today this brief article appeared on VI about FdJ. It shows the vulnerabilities of his future standing (will not copy all the pictures). Valverde lets Frenkie de Jong roam around in Busquets-less midfield against Atlético Frenkie de Jong is now a fixture at Barcelona, with the second most playing minutes [behind Ter Stegen; league + CL combined]. But it still hasn't come to a fixed role in midfield. Also in the topper at Atlético Madrid (0-1), Barça trainer Ernesto Valverde just keeps on shifting, moving and weighing things out with the Dutch technician. NO REPEAT 'ON 6' In the first domestic top match of the season, Sergio Busquets is missing on his regular controlling site in midfield. The Barça vacuum cleaner is suspended. But trainer Ernesto Valverde does not opt for a second chance for Frenkie de Jong in 6. In the absence of the ever-important Busi, the former Ajax player also plays in the top match in the Estadio Wanda Metropolitano as a left half, with the Brazilian Arthur as a righthandman and a surprising basic spot for Ivan Rakitic at the Busquets spot. At the forefront, Antoine Griezmann - who is treated to a whistling flute concert with every ball contact - again plays on the left flank, so that Lionel Messi (hanging on the right) and Luis Suárez (center striker) are allowed to stay in their most familiar places. At Atlético Madrid they are delighted with the return of the record purchase João Félix. The young attacker was recently crowned Golden Boy of 2019, as the best teenage talent in the world. The Portuguese shadow striker has been on the sidelines since mid-October with an ankle injury, and was quite missed. Atlético, which as usual under Diego Simeone is still world top in defensive terms, yearns for some offensive impulses and inspirations. Los Colchoneros scored sixteen times in the first fourteen La Liga rounds; in the last ten duels it even came only twice to more than one goal. TECHNICIAN IN SERVANT ROLE Although Barcelona wins its matches this year, sparkling did not happen too often this season. A selection that has cost almost a billion in total transfer fees is still particularly dependent on the brilliant flashes of Messi. In the mid-week Champions League duel with Borussia Dortmund (3-1), Barça played the best football it has shown this season, but a visit to Atleti soon makes it clear that this duel will not result in one continuous Barcelona roundabout. From the usual 4-4-2 formation under Simeone, Atlético keeps the mutual spaces according to tradition extremely small. But this does not only work on the own half. The defensive block of the home team often moves far, halfway through Barcelona's half. Nevertheless, the Simeone team defends very compactly: in the situation shown below, look at the distance between the right-hand man and the left-hand man on the four-man midriff of the home team, when Barça starts on the next set-up. Strikers Álvaro Morata and Félix hunt as a duo for the three Barcelona builders, center defenders Gerard Piqué and Clément Lenglet and the '6' Rakitic settled in between them. De Jong and his midfield partner Arthur end up in an uncomfortable situation early on the ball, flanked by both a central midfielder and a flank player from Atlético. Atlético Madrid has the upper hand in the first half. With fierce, direct football it is easier to come up with opportunities than the visitors from Catalonia, who bite numb remarkably often on the pressing of Simeone's team. Even if Barcelona succeeds in getting over the center line, De Jong's role is still ungrateful. The technician is (too) often between shore and ship, locked in a zone between the two co-defensive Atlético attackers and their four-man midfield behind it. De Jong is a player who wants to get to the ball as often as possible, trainer Valverde does not succeed with this occupation in midfield. After an hour of play there are only three Barça players with fewer passes sent than De Jong (43 passes in the first hour): keeper Marc-André Ter Stegen and strikers Griezmann and Suárez. And you can hardly say that the players who do get the ball in the Barça structure do a lot of good things with it. The situation below is typical of the game of visitors in Madrid. Ter Stegen resumed the game quickly, with a ball through the middle of Arthur - so the intention for the 'footballing solution' is definitely there. But in a direct duel to the ball, the finely cut Brazilian childishly trumps the ball to Atlético-midmid Héctor Herrera, who, completely in line with the plan of his trainer Simeone, recognizes the right moment to leave his defensive position as soon as the opportunity presents itself and put pressure on the ball. PROGRESS ON THE RIGHT After a hectic first half hour for Barcelona, we suddenly see De Jong more often in the right half of the midfield than in the left half. After half time, this provides a greater role for the Dutch midfield architect in the competition image. On the same side as Messi, De Jong has more possibilities to roam inside and outside the defense block of the Madrid home team, as the Argentinian naturally demands the necessary attention from the Atlético defenders. In the phase on the right, De Jong also proves his usefulness a few times when he does not control the ball himself. Up to three times after the break he creates space for a Messi dribble action with a walking action away from the ball. In the example below, De Jong leads left mid-mid Thomas Partey with a walking action to the right sidelines just two seconds away from his sight on Messi, allowing the Argentinian to slide towards the sixteen-meter area with a diagonal dribble solo. It's a prelude for what happens at the winning goal. But the perfect place on the diaphragm for De Jong is clearly not the number one priority in the team composition of coach Valverde. That appears in the 73rd minute, when De Jong has to switch midfield again when the duel-powerful Arturo Vidal replaces the more delicate Arthur. The Chilean plays the game as a right half, De Jong ends up on the left, where the interaction between him, back-up left back Júnior Firpo and Griezmann playing in an unnatural position still leaves something to be desired. Ultimately, the top match between Atlético Madrid and Barcelona culminates in the final phase like so many matches of the Catalan superpower led by the pragmatic Valverde. It is wobbling enough that point loss would not have been inconceivable or unjustified, then persists, and still has the best footballer of all time at the forefront. Barça's number ten makes the difference in the 86th minute with the kind of infield drive that appears like the most normal thing in the world. After a one-two with Suárez, and Griezmann in the role of decoy on the left, Messi slots the ball in: 0-1. De Jong has excelled enough in his first months in Catalonia to become a permanent basic force at Barcelona. The next leap: to be established and heralded enough as a star that Valverde also designs the midfield to his best qualities.