The Green Card Queue: Who Could Be Next?

Already cap-tied, so it doesn’t really matter.

 

Yeah, it dawned on me what is off about the thread. Green card is more relevant to MLS. I think you need the final passport for USMNT. And if you're already cap tied, give or take the "switch," a green card makes you relevant to MLS but a NT longshot or nonentity.

Given the length of time involved in getting a passport by naturalization, I'd think what you really want are people immediately passport eligible because they were born here (AJ was born in Alabama) or born to American citizens abroad (J. Jones). Bypass the green card.

I get that the green card can be a leading signal of a coming passport for NT purposes but to me it's more of a MLS roster rule consideration.

 

I think it might be useful to have a thread for unaffiliated or switchable (in terms of national team) players pursuing American citizenship.

But it's muddled to death by discussion of MLS type players who have caps elsewhere getting their paperwork in order, which is more or less irrelevant to USMNT. Shalrie Joseph was capped for Grenada before he kicked an MLS ball. I'm wading through lots of that trying to see who is potentially actually worthwhile. Jack Harrison was England U21 and now plays there. Roland Lamah is cap tied to Belgium. Calvo is CR. Ibisevic is Bosnian. Martinez is Venezuelan. The useful discussion you're touting is buried by stuff of vague interest to perhaps MLS roster obsessives. The majority of the players being discussed are already committed.

Just about anyone in MLS already could also pursue some sort of more permanent status. Calvo went to college in Houston. He plays for Costa Rica and that's been the case for several years, like dating back to college. If he happens to secure dual status that's a footnote. I wrote him off when he played that Gold Cup years ago. Kind of like, as a Dynamo fan, I know Quioto got his green card. Other than that frees an international slot, since he is dyed-blue-Honduran team, so what.

The relevant nuggets to me, even if some of them are past it or retired, are more like the Collin/ Barrios/ Le Toux types briefly discussed. But with the way the thread has gone you almost have to run your own research over those mentioned to double check if it's even possibly NT relevant.

Sorry, not meaning to be a jerk, it's just like an interesting thread idea that should probably split in two, with the NT relevant ones here and the broader green card discussion in MLS.

 

I think you are the only person who thinks about it this way.

 

The problem with those types of players is that timeline to citizenship almost makes it unworkable.

Folks make a big long list of these types of foreign players that come to the states, and by the time they get their citizenship they're in decline. Le Toux was the perfect example. If he was eligible in his prime, we would have called him up to check him out. Barrios just got his green card, so when he gets his actual citizenship he's going to be 32-33 (at best). There's really little point. He probably will have gone back to South American by then. [Plus, he's playing like garbage this season for some unknown reason.]

The dual-nationals who are the most likely to have timelines that work are those like Jesus Ferreira of FC Dallas. He moved here in 2009 with his father. Last I heard he was "close." Have to move here as kids like Darlington Nabe did, and not be called up by their nation of citizenship (a la Diego Fagundez).

 

I think I am being misunderstood. Two posts up from my "rant" I said "Given the length of time involved in getting a passport by naturalization, I'd think what you really want are people immediately passport eligible because they were born here (AJ was born in Alabama) or born to American citizens abroad (J. Jones). Bypass the green card." So we basically agree in the sense that time is of the essence. You're suggesting also pursuing dual nationals with faster timelines who aren't automatic, I wouldn't disagree.

I mean, if I remember right, Mastro had to wait a few years. Nagbe too I think. A lot of it would be when you start the process. I agree on Collin or LeToux, a passport or green card for them is more of an asterix or MLS interest point. It matters whether this is happening at 15, 20, 25, 30, 35.

I just mentioned them in the "rant" because in reading a few of the most recent pages of the thread, they were the few people mentioned who were uncommitted and could play for the team, even "in the abstract." I get they are either retired or past it. I am not touting their merits. I'm just constructively criticizing the thread in the sense that those are the only players in the recent portion of the thread who would even be eligible. I feel like this should be re-focused on people who have a snowball's chance in hell of even playing for us.

Otherwise, it effectively becomes a MLS thread. MLS cares about green cards. USA requires a passport and give or take the switch that you're uncommitted elsewhere. When the thread becomes laden with MLS players already committed to another country, the interesting and nominally titular part of the thread -- who might be on the road to being eligible for the national shirt -- gets buried. It's an interesting thread idea, just the useful part is buried beneath "Blah Blah Foreign NT Player got his green card." Like I was saying, that Honduras' Quioto got his green card means nothing to us because he plays for them and even scores on us. It's only interesting to a Dynamo fan intrigued by a cleared MLS international slot.

 

@bshredder wrote a nice piece on Timothy Tillman: http://www.americansoccernow.com/ar...r-an-international-decision-looms-for-tillman.

Also, Efraín Alvarez is not as tied to Mexico as some make him out to be. Better outreach could flip him.

Ramos is not a good recruiter. I still question how he holds onto his job.

 

He's held his job because he's almost been the only one there on a full-time job. We've had no technical director, no full time USMNT coach, no U23 coach, no U19 coach, no U18 coach, we now have no U17 coach, etc. So he's been doing everything. He's our youth technical director, he's running the USSF development academy, he's the U20 coach...….etc. etc. People seem to think he has time to do EVERYTHING. He can't also be recruiter of every dual-national. There's only so much time in the day. He was essentially the only person who was actually making an effort with Jonathan Gonzalez, and everybody seemed to blame HIM for that kid's defection.

 

I do admire your never ending defense of the status quo.

 

I don't think Ramos' job touches the DA. Despite the grandiose "Youth Technical Director", his job responsibilities are fairly limited — much like our dearly departed "Technical Director" / manager. Ramos coordinates the YNTs and that seems to be pretty much it. I'll guess he has some input into new YNT managerial hires, but not final say.

According to the USSF org chart, the DA is under the joint purview of Mooney and Romeijn (along with coaching education and YNTs). The boys' DA director is Aloys Wijnker.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/contact-us

And as I looked that up, I learned that one-time US U20 Peri Marosevic is an Academy Coordinator.

 

Who said every dual national?

Efrain is one of our most elite YNT eligible players. If you don't have time for a 10 min convo every few months, you're an excuse maker.

 

We need to stop this conversation/keeping in touch nonsense. Play them. Put him in the u20 team right now. Bring him in for Mex and Brazil for all I care- it's not like Parks or Weah had "earned" caps in the spring. It's what friendlies are for.
But texting every few months that they're in the plans someday while they're watching an agudelo get his 30th chance, or Ibarra, or whatever try-hard MLS journeyman we fill rosters with? Why would anyone wait around for this clown show?

 

You're making the assumption that nothing is going on behind the scenes.

I'm not going to do that..............................

Keep in mind that this is a kid that was already in the US programs, was called up to just about every US youth camp we could call him up to prior to the U17 level, and then he switched. Efrain isn't a new recruit.

This is also not the right thread for him. He's not in the "green card queue." He's a US citizen that chose to play for another team. We can and should keep trying. Ultimately this is the kid's choice, however.

 

US fans can't accept that he prefers to play for another country right now.

Harassing the kid isn't going to do any good. Tell him his stance within the US program, and let him make his own decisions. He wasn't snubbed for any US teams or anything of that sort. A year later we hear a very questionable story from his club coach that blames US Soccer. Easy thing to do. Probably isn't even true or is hugely exaggerated. It lets Alvarez off the hook in the US media for his decision. I suspect that was the exact reason for it.

This is not a game. You aren't going to brainwash Alvarez into wanting to play for the USA. He'll make his own decision. I'm sure he has all the info he needs and just prefers the Mexican set-up. There's been a lot of info pointing to this being the case.

I'd also like if Pierie or M. Tillman preferred to play for the USA. If they don't, what can you do other than tell them their place within the US program and continue to keep on good terms with them in case they change their mind?

 

Someone like the post you are saying that about and three people liked a post earlier on. But onward hyperbole.

 

wut?

 

People liked the posts he is saying only I think that way.

And I honestly quit looking at the forum lately and I come back and the post above mine is people touting a 30 year old dual national Mexican who would have to move to MLS and play nearly 2 years to be eligible, and who would be 34 next world cup.

But compared to what I was seeing before, at least in some theoretical plane he is eligible and not committed elsewhere and just getting a green card for his convenience, family reasons, or to help the team GM out on international slots.

 

Oh..ok. Then I will change my statement to "A majority of people don't feel that way". Thanks

 

If you really wanted to commit him, U20 is tepid and not even in the spirit of the experimental senior callups being done now. To me if you REALLY want dual nationals truly in demand elsewhere, you cap them for the senior side in the next two months. The real coach may not be hired soon, this is all going through the motions and experimenting right now. So rather than the weak sauce of U20, how about come play for the full national team. it worked for Green, AJ, etc.

Once we get them in, as with all the other kids being trialed, ok, show me what you got. Maybe they disappear for years. But nominally we can claim allegiance.

I also think you're more likely to get these in demand kids to play in something like U20 by working backwards, ie, cap them senior, and then say, can you help us out and play U20 coming up also.

I definitely agree though, that I think our problem right now is with several senior and age group jobs open, and a new GM with other fish to fry, and a caretaker of unknown energy and duties, whose responsibility is it to recruit? I am sure Ramos could be called upon to help as an add on but be real, if you were trying to nail down a senior team player, being offered another senior team, sending the U20 coach would be weak sauce. They are going to want to hear from senior coaches or people with authority, here is where we see you fitting in on the senior team. Sending the U20 coach in is pinchhitting and isn't the answers he's looking for. It's really an emotional ploy for someone who is probably looking for a concrete call up. You know, the one Sarachan passed over.

Personally I think if we have to work too hard meh it wasn't worth that much. Shouldn't take a bunch of convincing or competition if they really want our shirt. But if they need a little convincing who is even responsible for it.

 

Majority of who?

That's a cute backhand slap but thing is people have barely posted here in months, and when they did it's like there's a fairly committed Mexican dual kid, and a 30 year old playing for Toluca.

But at least they are eligible as opposed to Dom Oduro or some of the committed or even retired players on prior pages. That's at least headed back in a useful direction.

Like I said, for US purposes it should be passport. MLS is who cares about green cards and many getting them aren't even US eligible. Romell Quioto recently got a green card that plays for my Dynamo. He's not only ineligible but scored on the US. So what.