The Future of Carli Lloyd?

She's clutch in the big matches and she's grown into a leadership position on the team. I wouldn't ask her to leave unless injuries continue to plague her value to the team. What I wouldn't do is keep her on the team just to be a cheerleader. No way I waste a valuable roster spot for that.

 

My problem with her isn't really with her it is with the mindset that she embodies.
She has been successful because she "has a big boot".
I am hoping is soccer especially women's soccer evolves to seek out to play a more skillful, sophisticated and entertaining style. She does not play that type of game and while she's occupying the ACM spot which should (in my style of play anyway) be owned by a creative, skillful player picking apart defenses we will not achieve an advancement in our tactics.

 

Well, the problem you described is certainly not going to be resolved before the next women's world cup and/or before Lloyd retires. That requires big moves to the whole administration, then you can worry of individual players.

 

That's why I said she embodies the issue. I didn't say she is responsible for it.

 

You didn't address the questions of the OP.

 

I suppose Carli Lloyd will be around for the next World Cup -- and will retire thereafter -- but I think she will be a marginal player, inserted for a few minutes here and there.

I rewatched the 2011 World Cup game with Japan recently. Japan was lucky. The US has several good chances early in the game that we failed to convert Japan hung on and ended up winning. S--t happens.

The difference in 2015 was that Lloyd converted 3 chances in about 15 minutes.
Luck happens....

That's not taking anything away from Carli. She's scored a lot of important goals.

 

not really.

she has been successful because, as many have pointed out, she scores big goals in big games. (if that is the same as having a big boot, then ignore this opening statement). but, in my thinking, you have to have more than a big boot to do what carli has done.

those creative, skillful players are here (press?), and are coming (sanchez?). (remember carli plays up front a lot, and sanchez moves back sometimes, performing creditably in the middle for ucla in fleming's recent absence). but if you can't score the big goals in big games, as some people complain about press, all you are left with is the pretty passing of recent arsenal teams.

i want the creative, skillful player as much as the next fan, but like many coaches, i also like the physicality of players like romelu lukaku, as long as they can get the ball in the back of the net on the important occasions. a good balance is key.

as to the op's question...

...old players recede in an instant, it seems. lloyd may still have limited use as a late sub in 2019. the coaching staff seems to be elbowing her in that direction. but if, as so often happens, she falls off the map as she ages, then she likely won't retire gracefully, and will have to be pushed out, as has to be done with so many top, competetive players.

 

Carli Lloyd was underrated for a long time, then was overrated. Most of her 2015 goals, for instance, were off set pieces. But they were still goals.

Her accomplishments are one thing. But we saw with the men's team and the Italian men's team, that when players in their thirties are still starting it is indicative of a problem. That nobody has pushed them out shows a lack of player development. The CBA with USSF probably lets players hang on easier, but a national team needs 24 yr olds to push out the 34 yr olds.

There is a lot of money for the women to continue on the USWNT; so I expect Lloyd to continue in a substitute role when we need to poach a goal. She could also rotate in against teams where her lack of pace will not be exploited. But I don't think she will be starting against the top teams unless JE is as dumb as some think.

 

focus on age makes it a crapshoot, no?

argentina made it to the final with the oldest team (avg. age of 28+) of the tournament in the last world cup.

the uswnt won the whole thing with the oldest team (avg. age of 29+) of the 2015 tournament which was also the oldest team in the history of all wwc tournaments.

it''s really how well the players are playing that's the key.

 

Argentina barely qualified for the tournament this year. It took a Messi miracle to get them there in the last game. The USWNT did not play that well in 2015 until Wambach (Age 35) sat and Morgan Brian (Age 22) got into the starting line up.

Except at Forward, the USA has gotten younger. Morgan and Press will both be 30 at the next WC and Rapinoe will be 34. Who is Jill working in there? I think she will leave that problem for the next cycle/coach and hope Morgan continues her current form. Sauerbrunn and O'Hara are also older (34 and 31 next WC) and I think Brunn has definitely lost a few steps and seems to get beat once or twice a game (ok for a midfielder or fullback, but not good for a CB). I don't think JE has any thoughts about replacing Brunn; but she should.

 

Questions for me are how does she handle a smaller role if that's the way it goes, who is she keeping off a WC roster and does having her on the roster give us the same hopeful Ellis situation we got with Rapinoe at Rio 2016?

On a 23 player WC roster I could see her being useful in a bench role. Clutch doesn't tend to get old but if she refuses to accept that type of role it could cause detention on the team. There is also the question of who she blocks for that roster spot. I don't want to see another situation where 23 YO Dunn stays home for a player getting ready to retire as in 2015. Then there is Ellis who tends to be less trusting of her young players as the games get bigger. Would she be inclined to give Lloyd a bigger WC role than she can handle at her based on memories of Christmas past?

 

Carli Lloyd is not Abby Wambach. She is not a cheerleader, and not the same type of leader and inspiration from the bench.

If Carli is not a starter or a super sub goal scorer in 2019, then she needs to be working studio coverage on Fox Sports during the World Cup.

it's easy to think that she can still be at least a super sub goal scorer, needed late in a close match.

Odds she'll be on the 2019 roster >= 51%.

 

I'm in the very small minority on this point, but I was fine back then with the decision to cut Dunn from the WC roster. Ellis got that one right. At the point the roster was named, Dunn hadn't really accomplished much with either the NT or the Spirit, and was a bit prone to injury. There was nothing that screamed "Take her to the WC". And she doesn't have that superb 2015 season without the motivation to improve that getting cut gave her.

 

If u take Dunn then she has a WC under her belt for the Olympics and 2019. Taking Boxx and Chalupny didn't help them at the Olympics or for 2019

 

So instead of rewarding veterans for past performance, you'd rather reward projects for future potential

 

Id maybe call it investing in the future instead of rewarding the past.

 

I dislike her because she’s overrated ever since 2015 and not that great of a player. Winning Ballon d’or in 2016 and top 3 2017 annoys me more than Peter and Henning at the pitch for Germany lol

I think her prime age’s over but she seems like a leader for the US team so she should get benched at the next WC
but then I don’t know with Jill Ellis either as she strikes me as a coach doing a lot of weird stuff as Steffi Jones

 

I agree -- that Dunn had not at the time earned a spot on the National Team. Boxx likewise had not earned a spot -- but I think Chalupny had.

Regarding Carli Lloyd, I don't see her breaking into that midfield starting lineup of Mewis, Horan, and Ertz. She's a late game sub for the rest of her career -- less than 50/50 she makes it to the 2019 WC.

 

I could see Sullivan replacing one of those 3, likely Horan.

 

But how much of that was manipulated? From the beginning of the year to to the time the roster was announced in the Spring (7 matches in total) Dunn played 11 minutes against England. Sounds like Ellis made up her mind before she saw either Chalupny or Boxx play.

Barring injury I think Lloyd is 100% to make the roster

 

Lloyd is likely to make the roster. Becoming a bench player would not surprise me based on her lack of speed and ball handling. She could play a useful sub role if she does not sulk; she has to be like Wambach in being willing to accept a sub role if warranted (based on someone else's decision, not hers).

The more important question is who will comprise the midfield in 2019. Soccer is a midfield game these days. Having players who can turn defensive takeaways into offensive forays is crucial. Until Morgan Brian entered the lineup, nobody was doing that for the USA consistently in 2015.

 

One of the best things Brian did in 2015 was offer support in the midfield. Too many players running away from each other instead of providing easy outlets to complete passes.

 

Some might call it living in the present. If only they'd won...

 

Just listening to Hope Solo talking about how "three time world player of the year Carli Lloyd" isn't as popular as Alex Morgan because she doesn't wear makeup on the field or didn't get a boob job. Im convinced Solo will make USSoccer great again.

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