Ronaldo will win ballon dor again and that will make it 4 of the last 5 Ronaldo has surpassed Messi in the last few years .
This guy is world class. Spain's next big thing. It will be Real Madrid over Barca for many many years to come.
The difference between Messi & CR7 is that Messi needs the structure around him to be stable and in-tact to succeed. It's why he's only truly flourished during Barca's peak time and his performances have gone down as Barca continues to degrade. CR7 says '******** your structure' and makes his own. That's where they're different and why he succeeds everywhere and always.
haha Madrid is clutch. The sharks don't have a single clutch bone in their bodies. Never have. I do like Madrid'a way kit this year as opposed to last year's horrendous away kits.
Well CR is peaking from 2014-2017, when madrid has the best midfield in the world, the best attack in the world with the biggest payroll in the world.
Yes, that's why his influence has been more pronounced, but he was still extremely consistent, during other periods, in ways Messi has not been.
I'd disagree. Messi won the golden boot on a shittier team just last season. Consistency isn't really a factor to me. Their both extremely consistent, look at the goal scoring and assist numbers. The knock you have on Messi is actually one that should be on the club, Barcelona. Messi is consistent: Barça ain't. Theyre going thru their issues like Madrid pre Mou
Disagree, CR7 didn't win the Golden Boot, yet clearly we don't need to discuss who was better between the two last season. Messi's performances in big games, Champion's League particularly, have been markedly lower relative to prior periods in his career. That one game last season where he scored the winning goal in Madrid was what he used to do, but has not done consistently. CR7 has gone up in recent years, but he didn't have a period where he declined like Messi has.
I don't think Messi has declined, but I DO think CR has evolved the last 3-4 seasons into the player he is now. Hes also a few years older so it's not out of the question that Messi doesn't evolve as well. My example is that Ronaldo is now, hands down, the best off the ball player in the world and I've ever seen. That wasn't his game 4-5+ seasons ago. If Messi realizes he can't take on 4-5 guys alone anymore, drops into the Xavi position and dominates from there until he's 33, 34, then did he all of a sudden get consistent? I'd say no. CR had to evolve his game and he did it perfectly. It looks like it's Messi time to evolve his, and I'd like to see what he does with it.
Pretty sure we're misunderstanding each other in relation to what we mean on declining. I do not believe Messi, in terms of his overall ability to do what he does, has declined. I'm fully aware that a player who has previously scored 90+ goals in a calendar year, whose true ability lies in how he can see the game relative to everyone else, has a way of thinking that continuously develops as he grows older. Essentially, my belief is, in terms of looking at this from a 'nature' vs. 'nurture' example, I believe if both CR7 & Messi had the best environments to play in, the ones that would let them show their natural gifts to their maximum ability, Messi edges it. Edges being the key word, because CR7 was never afforded such a luxury, of having the best environment, early in his career, as Messi did. So yes, you're correct, the strength of Real Madrid as a whole has strengthened CR7. Messi brought Barcelona to new heights, but they were already a high level of greatness prior to being the world's best player. The guy's career has been accompanied continuously by genuine legends of the game. CR7 was never afforded that luxury. Manchester United, Portugal, and Real Madrid, he brought each of them to new levels relative to when he first entered those teams. Brought all three to the top of Europe, and nobody questions that he was the main player to each. Messi cannot do that, because of how he is. He cannot impose himself on his environment the way CR7 can, as a result, you arrive to the point I meant in decline, which means lowered level of performance/output. This much is a fact, the data is there. Take a look at Messi in CL knockout stage games over the course of his career, rather than games against La Liga Fodder. Let me know what you see. His talent has not fallen, his performances have. For the first time, Messi has a worse environment to play relative to Ronaldo, and it doesn't look like it'll stop declining any time soon.
@benficafan3 I get your point, and it's well thought out and reasoned, but to say that Ronaldo has never has the luxury of playing with genuine legends of the game is, convenient at best and misjudged. Hes played for 2 of the, if not THE greatest club coaches of all time...SAF and Mou. At United, he played with the best domestic English team of all time. I also genuinely believe that Scholes is a better midfielder than Xavi, as an example. Not to forget Van der Sar (better than Valdes), Vidic (puyol was better), we talked about Scholes. There's no one at an Iniesta level, I agree. Now, at Madrid, aka the greatest club in the history of club football, hes played with Casillas, Ramos, Bale. The firepower they have now is among the best I've ever seen, their midfield the past 4 seasons, since Kroos came over, is the best midfield since Xavi, Iniesta and Busquets but depending on the style of play you like, it's better. (IMO, Xavi is vastly overrated). The level that Madrid is at now is because of Ronaldo, Ramos, Marcelo, Carvalhal, Modric, Kroos,Bale, Benz, Isco, Asensio. Ronaldo is the focal point but so was Messi with Henry, Etoo, Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol and Dani Alves. And the la liga fodder is the same for both Ronaldo and Messi. They play the same teams. The championships there tell the story to me. My opinion. It comes across as hating Ronaldo and that couldn't be further from the truth. I love Ronaldo. I just think the other guy is a little bit better.
Please point out where I said this. I stated he played for Real Madrid and Manchester United, not Feirense and Arouca. Clearly he's going to be surrounded by legendary players and coaches playing for such a clubs, but that doesn't mean the teams at the time were of a certain, high level nor that it was to the extent that Messi. I said Messi "edges" Ronaldo overall, implying this is a manner of degrees, not absolutes. CR7 came to Man U when they were getting knocked out of the group stage by Benfica and out of the Round of 16 by Porto. He went to Real Madrid when they hadn't passed the Round of 16 in years. Messi started playing with players in their prime such as Ronaldinho, Deco, etc. that made that club of a level arguably higher than the Manchester United & Real Madrid teams that Ronaldo took to CL glory. Can you imagine starting your career in such an environment, and then after that, establishing yourself alongside the likes of Xavi and Iniesta? To claim CR7 had anything close to such a luxury is simply incorrect.
Messi pushed Ronaldinho and Deco out of Barça. You have some revisionist history. In 03, Ronaldo started for United with Gary Neville, van Nistelrooy, Giggs, Scholes, Keane. Those are a good freaking group to start your career with. When Ronaldo went to Madrid in 09, they had Casillas, Pepe, Ramos, Kaka, Benzema, Marcelo, Guti, Higuian & Xabi Alonso. He was set up nicely at both places and obviously both clubs got better adding arguably the best player of either clubs history.
Revisionist history? You're not understanding my points, if you did you wouldn't have listed players after I myself stated Ronaldo did play with great players like you listed. What you clearly overlooked was my main argument, which is that, despite all those quality players you listed, the teams did not reflect that quality. When Real Madrid went years and years without passing the around of 16, did they not have world-class players throughout that time? Did Manchester United not have great players when they were struggling to make any impact of note in the Champions League? You are conflating having great players and having a great team, they are not the same. Ronaldo clearly brought them to the level of great teams. Clearly he needed the raw materials, including great teammates to get there, but it was through him that this happened. Not alone clearly but mainly.
nbstriker is such a loser, normally I would understand and accept this as typical benfiquisa idiocy but, Benficafan3 is absolutely destroying you, and he is also a benfiquista so its not an excuse. Messi played on ONE team the entire time , even since he was a youth.. .a team who dominated soccer in the 21st century. He hasn't won either a Copa America or World Cup, despite playing for one of the traditional football powers, which has much more pedigree than Portugal does. Ronaldo succeeded on three teams winning major trophies (Man utd, Portugal Real Madrid).. breaking records, he is all time Real Madrid top scorer (most successful club of all time) , all time Portugal top scorer, all time CL top scorer.. he also just led Real Madrid to back to back CL titles and 3 titles in 4 years.. being clearly the star player each time..... When has Messi done that? Barcelona without Messi + a couple dudes from Madrid like Casillas basically won a World cup (2010) and two european championships (x2). Messi really only has more La Liga Titles, but CR7 has 3 Premier Leagues... and will equal Messi soon in Ballon Dor. and I dont see Barca winning la liga this year with that crap coach, in fact Real Madrid may very well do the CL + La Liga double AGAIN this season. Ronaldo has won playing with Eliseu and Eder FFS....
Messi had Suarez ad Neymar, arguably two for the best supporting strikers in the world, and he still didn't win shit last year. Doesn't help that's he has rather every other supporting strike out of town. Ibra, Alexis Sanchez, Neymar, Eto'o.
Ronaldo had Bale, Benz, Morata, Isco, Asensio & Vasquez (who's better than anyone attacking on Barça after those 3). Those are just attackers. Never mind Barça's midfield sucks balls and Madrids is the best in the world. Madrid's attack was on a different level than Barça or anyone last year.
Bro. He said that Messi edges Ronaldo. So you finally agree with me! Nice. Ronaldo succeeded on the best English club and the best Spanish & European club of all times. Whoop-te-do. What was Barça before Messi? Crap. 1 CL (more than Sporting). Always second fiddle. Then Messi comes up, they win 7 La Ligas, a couple trebles ( Ronaldo has NEVER won 1). And Ronaldo is a stud for Portugal I hope he wins the world cup and actually plays in the final. Id only want Messi to win a world cup if Portugal and USA were eliminated. And I'd argue that since 2000, Portugal has had more talent all around than Argentina. But typical guy on internet can't make an argument without name calling because he knows his point is dumb.
But bud, you can make the same argument about Messi. Barcelona years prior to Messi: 00-01; 4th la Liga, 1/4 Uefa Cup 01-02; 4th la Liga, 1/4 CL 02-03; 6th la Liga, 1/8 CL 03-04; 2nd la Liga, 1/16 Uefa Cup 04-05; Champs La Liga, 1/16 CL Messi; 9 apps, 1 goal 05-06; Champs La Liga; Champs CL Messi; 25 apps, 8 goals I don't believe in coincidence. Barça got to be Barça because of Messi.
Busquetts and Iniesta are 2 time Euro Champs and World Cup champs., albeit Iniesta is older now. Rakitic is also world class. Bale is a bust. Asensio and Vasquez are relatively recent revelations.
And what I meant was Messi has ran every other striker he's played with out of town. No one likes playing with him. Ibra, Alexis, Eto'o, Neymar.