The Avram Grant discussion thread.

Discussion in 'Chelsea' started by The_ChelseaSupporter, Feb 24, 2008.

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  1. slipereypete

    slipereypete BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2003
    Gig Harbor, WA, USA
    Very interesting last night... I was watching the 2nd half again, and if you look at when Alex is being subbed on, it is Clarkey who is giving him the instruction to go where and do what. Ten Cate is there berating him, pretty clear that he diddn't agree with the decision. And when you see Spudz score, he has the look of, "I told you so" right at Clarkey. And if I am honest, the reactionary tactic of putting an defender on when the opposition puts on an attacker reeks of old, British tactics.
     
  2. limpidrock

    limpidrock Member

    Mar 19, 2008
    Really? I didn't notice that. Perhaps that's why the media reported that when spurs equalised at 4-4, Drogs went over to Clark and appeared to ask "what are we supposed to be doing?"
     
  3. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    Interesting about the whole Clarke, Cate and Drogba circle going on...what was Grant doing the whole while - observing, studying?

    Well, with all the foundations and NGO's and benefit organizations out there and in the same spirit as Barcelona teaming up with UNICEF, Chelsea have found a new sponsor - one that sums up everyone's thoughts during the last 10 minutes of yesterday's game.





























    [​IMG]
     
  4. lobomojo

    lobomojo Member+

    Jul 17, 2004
    santa fe
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    I just watched that and Clarke is next to Cate as Grant is in front holloring at Joe Cole to come over and Grant issues instructions to Cole and says something to Alex and looking like he is taklking to someone in his coat, Roman??, and Alex is talking to the 4th official. It really is quite a stretch to blame Clarke or the "British" for the sub. :rolleyes: Looked more to me like Cate was asking Clarke wtf is Grant doing and Clarke saying who the f knows.

    The camera did not even show Alex next to Clarke though it is usually Clarke who does give the player instruction but in the end it is the Manager who is in charge.
     
  5. slipereypete

    slipereypete BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2003
    Gig Harbor, WA, USA
    Clarke was talking to Alex before the sub was made.
     
  6. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    If anyone finds any clips of this, please post them.
     
  7. lobomojo

    lobomojo Member+

    Jul 17, 2004
    santa fe
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    I am sure he was as he almost always does with every player going on, but it was not on my Setanta feed and still think it is a tremendous stretch to blame Clarke for the sub(and a further stretch to say that Clarke decided he wanted Alex and called him over to go in for Kalou while Grant and Cate thought otherwise) or do you credit Clarke for every good tactic and decision as well?,
     
  8. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    It's like the three of them at any time can call in a sub or a play. Maybe Roman has awarded them one sub each per match, that was Clarks.

    Let's be realistic. There has got to be some communication betwen Clark, Cate and Grant. I doubt they would just go out and make calls out of the blue without any conversation with the other two. As far as the final desicion, i am guessing that should come from Grant...not even the little voice that speaks to him out of his coat.

    Anyway, ff that is the case, the club is going down and some real changes including a set of balls need to be coming in next season.
     
  9. slipereypete

    slipereypete BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2003
    Gig Harbor, WA, USA
    Fair enough about blaming it all on Clarke and the British thing, but it was quite clear that Ten Cate didn't agree with the sub. And I am not of the opinion that it was a Clarke vs. Grant/Cate thing. I am merely pointing out the division we have in our management team and its detriment to our club.
     
  10. yasik19

    yasik19 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 21, 2004
    Daly City
    I think Roman needs to get his head out of his ass soon. Even a rookie soccer fan can see something is not right.
     
  11. lobomojo

    lobomojo Member+

    Jul 17, 2004
    santa fe
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Could not agree more with that last statement, seems like all 3 are on different pages, Grant is not really as in charge as he should be whether that would be better or worse and Clarke is the only ones that the players respect and like and we are still missing a fitness conditioning coach and I doubt our scouting is anywhere near Jose's teams. I like best the cohesive coaching systems of Jose, Cappello, even Big Sam who had too little time with the Geordies, where you do not just hire a manager you hire an experianced cohesive team with a clear cut leader.
     
  12. Kazuma

    Kazuma Member+

    Chelsea
    Jul 30, 2007
    Detroit
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
  13. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    Grant: "We wanted to play more in midfield, have one more in midfield because we knew they would play a direct ball. We wanted to pass the ball better. That's why we took him off."

    This actually makes good sense. Only he took off the wrong player while bringing the wrong one in. His idea (if it was his idea at all to begin with) and intention was good, but his execution sucked. Chelsea is in the lead, clock counting down - time to control the midfield and thus, the match, from here on till the 90+ minute. No sweat, right?

    J Cole was on his game, as he has been lately. Having a player on the pitch like that generates the chemistry that produces motivation for the whole team. His inspiring performance, not to mention two goals set a work ethic on the pitch. Yet, off he goes.

    And on comes Ballack. He is not really a 15 minute player. It takes him a bit of time to get into the pace of the game before managing to control it. Sure, he might score, but that was not his intended role when the sub was made. Start him, play him with 30 minutes to go or don't play him at all, play someone else.

    But in the end, what really gets me, is that a true manager in control would never make this statement; That's why we took him off. It clearly shows he is not the man in command of the team. He is not the desicion maker. Any manager with balls would have said; That's why I took him off!

    That is the difference between a JM, del Bosque, a Hitzfeld, a Capello, a Ferguson or Wenger and a Grant or a McLaren.
     
  14. BridgeMonkee

    BridgeMonkee BigSoccer Supporter

    Jul 25, 2002
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    My friend is a lip reader and she said Clarke Said and then Ten Cate....:rolleyes: Actually that is not to true, what happened is my mate is a body language expert and a mind reader and he said that Clarke and Grant. . .:rolleyes:

    Ten Cate and Drogba in a big dressing room bust up [apparently] :rolleyes:

    Joe Cole Calls for unity....which means there isn't unity

    http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,2267213,00.html

    He [Joe Cole] was one of those replaced towards the end of the match, with Grant saying the midfielder was tired after an evening of furious endeavour.
     
  15. Naughtius Maximus

    Jul 10, 2001
    Shropshire
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Country:
    England
    The point is that Joey was one of the few people we had that threw them back on their heels a bit. After he went off they flooded forward.
     
  16. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    Kid's got great attitude!

    "But we defend together, we attack together and we need to get back to doing what we do best now on Sunday. I can't think about England. My only focus now is beating Arsenal."
     
  17. slipereypete

    slipereypete BigSoccer Supporter

    Nov 29, 2003
    Gig Harbor, WA, USA
  18. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    Pathetic! Right on, Drogba for questioning the incompetence of these guys!!!
     
  19. Passage

    Passage Member

    Feb 25, 2007
    USA
    That picture sums up this entire thread.
     
  20. BridgeMonkee

    BridgeMonkee BigSoccer Supporter

    Jul 25, 2002
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    in a nutshell

    sigh

    The players have no confidence in the man Grant and his harpy Ten Cate.
     
  21. I-Got-The-BLUES

    May 1, 2006
    Orlando, Florida.
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Country:
    Jamaica
    Well, finally 'The Clueless One' gets a win over a team in the Top 7.
    Now he still has NOT won me over, but kudos to him.
    I questioned the Ballack switch, but allowing Essien to move up, and Belletti to take his place (who's pretty effective going forward himself), was a smart move.
    Though I do question what he's doing with Belletti, who bar 2 notable mistakes, has been immense this season...I see no reason to start Essien over him at RB....but he fixed that.

    Finally he's showing signs of actually reading the game, kudos.
    But one sign of brilliance isn't enough, this has to be consistently done time after time. The defense was very well organized, kudos to the backline.

    Avram even showed some enthusiasm and some fire in the match.

    So Avram, you're still in the hot seat, but we're turning the temperature down temporarily. Still want to see you go, but good stuff today :)
     
  22. Clan

    Clan Member

    Apr 23, 2002
    Doesn't matter what he does, it will always seem that the team wins despite the manager, not thanks to him.

    Remember when it was fun to laugh at the tool in charge of Liverpool?

    Ah...those were happy days.
     
  23. Cris 09

    Cris 09 Trololololo

    Nov 30, 2004
    Westfalenstadion
    Club:
    Borussia Dortmund
    Country:
    Germany
    I still think Belletti should have actually started this match but everything kinda fell into place in the end with his subs. The starting lineup was great and yes, taking Ballack of with 4 shots on goal (kudos to Almunia - hell of a match) took a lot of balls.

    Paid off THIS time. I still don't think he is the man for Chelsea but regardless...GOOD JOB!
     
  24. adri

    adri Member

    Jul 3, 2004
    Vancouver, Canada
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Country:
    Netherlands
    'pool's current tool or the previous tool? ;)
     
  25. Clan

    Clan Member

    Apr 23, 2002
    Benny Hill of course :)
     

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