The All-Encompassing Pro/Rel Thread on Soccer in the USA

Discussion in 'Soccer in the USA' started by bigredfutbol, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. DanGerman

    DanGerman Member+

    Aug 28, 2014
    New York City
    Club:
    New York City FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Not when it doesn't involve pro/rel. You see having stability and growth takes a back seat to something that can only raise the sport to heights unseen. I mean the second it happens the NFL, MLB, NHL AND NBA will all cease to exist and soccer will reign as the top sport in this land. The only thing stopping it from happening are the NFL schills that are holding it back from happening.......


    P.S Man these scrooms I took are BANGING!!!
     
  2. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #23452 Paul Berry, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
    Pretty good for the players too.

    Seattle Sounders 2015 base salaries > $100k

    $ 3,913,008.00
    $ 2,400,000.00
    ---------------------
    $ 748,000.00
    ---------------------
    $ 276,665.00
    $ 275,000.00
    ---------------------
    $ 180,000.00
    $ 165,000.00
    $ 165,000.00
    $ 165,000.00
    $ 165,000.00
    $ 160,000.00
    $ 130,000.00
    $ 108,000.00

    Seattle Sounders 2019 base salaries > $500k

    $ 2,502,500.00
    $ 1,800,000.00
    $ 1,087,500.00
    ---------------------
    $ 772,000.00
    $ 740,000.00
    $ 619,600.00
    $ 600,000.00
    $ 600,000.00
    $ 596,542.00
    $ 564,365.00
    $ 528,671.00
    $ 500,850.00
    ---------------------

    And all credit to FC Dallas today for dressing 8 home-grown players in their 16 man squad today.
     
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  3. CrazyJ628

    CrazyJ628 Member+

    Jul 16, 2007
    The center of the Earth
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    But they can’t get relegated so all the money going into growing the game here and building a legitimate league is vaporware because we all know that getting kicked out of a league for one bad year trumps everything
     
    Paul Berry repped this.
  4. M

    M Member+

    Feb 18, 2000
    Via Ventisette
    Is the sport stable? I see a lot of USL and NASL teams that have gone out of buiness this decade.
     
  5. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #23455 Elninho, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
    And how many of those teams that folded were in the USL after 2015?

    How many were victims of the NASL being destabilized by the Cosmos?

    Pro soccer in the US is as stable as we have any reason to expect given both the popularity of soccer and the high travel expenses. About the effect of travel expenses, see: the high rate of clubs folding in the Russian lower leagues even with government subsidies. In the third division, the average lifespan of a club appears to be about 4 years.
     
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  6. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    USL and MLS are very stable over the last decade. The “disruptor” NASL was doomed from the getgo as is its heir apparent NISA. But just because two bit leagues fail doesn’t mean the sport isn’t healthy. I mean no one is accusing the NFL of being in serious trouble because the AAF folded this spring or MLB because the Golden League failed. Third rate leagues fail, it’s their sole purpose for existence.
     
  7. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    5 US based teams went "out of business" after their first season. Enforcing pls will help prevent that scenario going forward.

    4 teams failed after more than one year of which 3 were competing against another team in the same market.
     
  8. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Even so, some of the teams from the disruptor NASL still exist.

    They include North Carolina, Minnesota, Edmonton, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, Ottawa, New York and Miami.
     
  9. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    True, a few wised up and stopped fighting reality. A couple continue to piss money away trying to break the paradigm that’s got almost a century and a half long proven track record in the US.
     
  10. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Ok, now do Houston.
     
  11. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Not even counting the Puerto Rican expansion clubs that never played, you have 12 teams in the USL in the last decade that no longer play professional soccer.

    Let's put to bed this myth that USL is somehow more stable than NASL: they were both insanely turbulent when they both existed because you had two lower division leagues competing against each other in a time when most Americans simply didn't pay much attention to soccer. It's actually kind of testimony to the clubs that played in NASL as to how many still exist despite having been in a doomed league run by crooks and charlatans.
     
  12. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Still significant increases over 2015.
     
  13. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Name them.
     
  14. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Name which?
     
  15. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Not really!
     
  16. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    An average of 50% per position on the roster.
    2019 _______ 2015
    $1,100,050.00 $750,000
    $1,100,000.00 $400,000
    $650,340.00 $350,000
    $506,668.00 $325,000
    $335,004.00 $304,000
    $300,000.00 $247,500
    $275,000.00 $245,000
    $275,000.00 $203,500
    $268,008.00 $190,000
    $250,000.00 $150,000
    $250,000.00 $145,000
    $225,000.00 $142,000
    $168,000.00 $140,000
    $165,000.00 $115,500
    $165,000.00 $105,000
    $160,000.00 $90,000
    $160,000.00 $78,750
    $155,004.00 $71,250
    $145,008.00 $60,375
    $72,361.00 $60,000
    $70,875.00 $60,000
    $70,250.00 $60,000
    $70,250.00 $60,000
    $57,225.00 $60,000
    $56,250.00 $60,000
    $56,250.00 $60,000
     
  17. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Name the teams that are no longer playing, or the teams that are no longer in business.
     
  18. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    Antigua Barracuda
    Austin Aztex
    Charlotte Eagles (PDL)
    Dayton Dutch Lions (PDL)
    FC Montreal
    FC New York
    Penn FC
    Phoenix FC
    Rochester Rhinos
    Vancouver Whitecaps 2
    VSI Tampa Bay
    Wilmington Hammerheads
     
  19. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    A decision as to whether or not to field B teams doesn't reflect the stability of the league.

    Rochester and Penn FC are still in business according to their owners, while Charlotte and Dayton self-relegated.
     
  20. Elninho

    Elninho Member+

    Sacramento Republic FC
    United States
    Oct 30, 2000
    Sacramento, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    USL being stable over "the last decade" is a bit of an overstatement. Five years is more accurate. The thing that stabilized the USL was the introduction of MLS reserve teams in 2015 which finally gave the USL a critical mass of teams to allow regional play and cut travel expenses. The last clubs to fold or self-relegate did so around that time as the league raised its stadium and financial requirements in the reorganization that year. (Austin was put out of business by a natural disaster at the same time.)
     
  21. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As for the teams that went bust after one season, the league now insists that each team ownership group must demonstrate the financial capacity to operate the team for three years.
     
  22. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And note that the EFL Championship loses 25% of its teams every year.
     
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  23. jaykoz3

    jaykoz3 Member+

    Dec 25, 2010
    Conshohocken, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Seriously?? C'Mon Paul, you're better than that.........

    I realize that technically you are correct. That said, the EFL Championship is part of the EFL league system, or fully integrated pyramid. Teams move up and down by design. A closed league losing a team is not by design.....
     
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  24. Expansion Franchise

    Chattanooga FC
    United States
    Apr 7, 2018
    My statement was the 12 teams are no longer playing professional soccer. I don't see how it makes any difference if they're MLS reserves or not.
    All of that is true. I really don't care what Rochester and Penn FC say, until they come back, they're not playing professional soccer.

    It doesn't really matter the reasons why the teams aren't playing, the fact that they aren't means it's not stable. It should be far more stable now: the conditions are the best that they really could be for USL, so hopefully this is mostly a thing of the past. There will almost certainly be some more "hiatuses". Teams will run into financial difficulties. Owners will decide they don't want to lose any more money. That's fine, as long as the overall health of the league is fine.
     
  25. Paul Berry

    Paul Berry Member+

    Notts County and NYCFC
    United States
    Apr 18, 2015
    Nr Kingston NY
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    It's relegation, whether you self-relegate or are relegated on merit.

    5 teams failed after one season. They didn't have the resources to play professionally. These days they wouldn't be allowed in the USL-C in the first place.

    Other teams self-relegated after USL was given D2 status, so Richmond Kickers for instance, are back in the division they've played in since 1993.

    Reserve teams will come and go depending on financial decisions made in MLS board rooms.

    And of course the foreign teams have disappeared with the exception of TFC II, who could end up homeless, and Ottawa, who are bound for CPL.

    The core of the USL Championship is very stable. The biggest threat to that stability is MLS expansion.
     

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