The 100 Greatest X of All Time Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by comme, Nov 19, 2009.

  1. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    For example:

    Skillset:
    Pelé 5-1-3
    Di Stefano 4-2-3
    Maradona 5-2-2

    Performance:
    Pelé 4-3-3
    Di Stefano 4-3-1
    Maradona 4-1-3
     
  2. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Jun 11, 2012
    Great! What about the other 97? ;)
     
    msioux75 repped this.
  3. hurricanekeith

    hurricanekeith New Member

    Chelsea
    England
    Jan 22, 2007
    Auckland, NZ
    Nat'l Team:
    England
    I think that would be truly fascinating as we've seen, over this time, some players fail to live up to the incredible potential that they showed in their early 20s, whereas others have far outdone theirs. A few examples, just off the top of my head come to mind: Cristiano Ronaldo and Wayne Rooney are very similar in age and were considered - colleagues at club level, at the time of course - international rivals for some years there. I remember Alex Ferguson describing them as "potentially becoming the best two players in the word" by their mid-20s. There's no question, however, who will finish their career having outshone the other by a massive margin.

    Perhaps a more contentious example, but one that came to mind nonetheless, would be Maicon and Lahm. Both of them looked truly outstanding at a very similar time, but whereas Maicon became something of a journeyman (much maligned at Man. City, for example), Lahm went from strength to strength, becoming a utility player of sorts and the outstanding leader of a world cup winning team (as well as everything else he achieved).

    Let the debates begin!
     
  4. hurricanekeith

    hurricanekeith New Member

    Chelsea
    England
    Jan 22, 2007
    Auckland, NZ
    Nat'l Team:
    England
     
  5. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Jun 11, 2012
    I felt like adding best-suited positions.


    Below is a ranking of a hundred players that came to mind, based on a simplified point system :
    Effective skill/productivity(excluding penalties)>influence>success

    1 Pelé, forward, 10,9,10

    2 Di Stéfano, box to box forward, 9,9,9

    3 Maradona, attacking midfielder, 9,9,8, Cruijff, box to box forward, 9,9,8

    5 Schmeichel, keeper, 9,9,7

    6 Messi, forward, 9,8,9, Müller, striker, 9,8,9

    8 Yashin, keeper, 9,8,8, Nordahl, striker, 9,8,8

    10 Sárosi, poly-functional, 9,8,6

    11 Stojkovic, attacking midfielder, 9,8,5

    12 Scarone, forward, 9,7,10

    13 Meazza, forward, 9,7,9, Walter, forward, 9,7,9

    15 Nasazzi, center back, 8,10,10

    16 Suárez-Miramontes, central midfielder, 8,9,8, Rijkaard, attacking defender, 8,9,8

    18 Sindelar, forward, 8,9,7, Laudrup, attacking midfielder, 8,9,7, Moreno, attacking midfielder, 8,9,7

    21 Cristiano Ronaldo, forward, 8,8,9, Zidane, attacking midfielder, 8,8,9

    23 van Basten, striker, 8,8,8, Platini, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Romario, striker, 8,8,8, Ronaldo, striker, 8,8,8, Charlton, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Matthäus, box to box defender, 8,8,8, Baresi, attacking defender, 8,8,8, Sivori, forward, 8,8,8 Puskas, forward, 8,8,8, Riquelme, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Passarella, attacking defender, 8,8,8, Sastre, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8 Leônidas, striker, 8,8,8, Kubala, forward 8,8,8

    37 Netzer, attacking midfielder, 8,8,7, Kopa, attacking midfielder, 8,8,7, Eusebio, forward, 8,8,7, Spencer, forward, 8,8,7, Mazzola, box to box forward, 8,8,7, Moore, center back, 8,8,7, Suárez, forward, 8,8,7, Zsengellér, forward, 8,8,7, Robben, forward 8,8,7 Navas, keeper, 8,8,7

    47 Orsi, forward, 8,7,9, Garrincha, forward, 8,7,9, Buffon, keeper, 8,7,9, Rivaldo, attacking midfielder, 8,7,9

    51 Ronaldinho, forward, 8,7,8, Best, forward, 8,7,8, Zico, attacking midfielder, 8,7,8, Liedholm 8,7,8, attacking midfielder

    55 Zizinho, forward, 8,7,7, Figueroa, attacking defender, 8,7,7

    57 Baggio, forward, 8,7,6, Hagi, attacking midfielder, 8,7,6

    59 Charles, poly-functional, 8,7,5

    60 Henry, striker, 8,6,9

    61 Haynes, attacking midfielder, 8,6,5

    62 Juninho Pernambucano, attacking midfielder, 7,10,7

    63 Cafú, box to box defender, 7,9,10, Beckenbauer, attacking defender, 7,9,10

    65 Desailly, defender, 7,9,9, Schiaffino, attacking midfielder, 7,9,9

    67 Redondo, defensive midfielder, 7,9,8, Francescoli, forward, 7,9,8, Cubillas, attacking midfielder, 7,9,8, Piola, striker, 7,9,8, Mauro Silva, defensive midfielder, 7,9,8

    72 Drogba, striker, 7,9,7

    73 Artime, striker, 7,9,6, da Guia, center back, 7,9,6

    75 Gilmar, keeper, 7,8,10, Gento, attacking midfielder, 7,8,10, Xavi, central midfielder, 7,8,10, Iniesta, attacking midfielder, 7,8,10, R. Carlos 7,8,10, box to box defender

    80 Djalma Santos, defender, 7,8,9

    81 Maldini, defender, 7,8,8, Dalglish, forward, 7,8,8 Falcao, central midfielder, 7,8,8, Raumdeuter, forward, 7,8,8 Gullit, poly-functional, 7,8,8, Figo, attacking midfielder, 7,8,8

    87 Inzaghi, striker, 7,8,7, Juan Ramón Verón, forward, 7,8,7, Nedvěd, attacking midfielder, 7,8,7

    90 van Hanegem, central midfielder, 7,8,6

    91 Rummenigge, box to box forward, 7,7,8, Keegan, box to box forward, 7,7,8, Didi, attacking midfielder, 7,7,8, Modric, central midfielder, 7,7,8

    95 Cavani, striker, 7,7,7, Weah, striker, 7,7,7, Masopust, central midfielder, 7,7,7, Jair da Costa, forward, 7,7,7

    100 Sá, center back, 6,8,10
     
    peterhrt repped this.
  6. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Interesting list with a decent proportion of pre-1950 names. A few observations:

    Nearly a third of the players are from Brazil or Argentina.

    Only four goalkeepers, including Gilmar.

    Omissions include Bozsic, Dzajic, Krol, Matthews, Nilton Santos, Pedernera, Rivera.

    There appears to be a player missing between 95 and 100.
     
    annoyedbyneedoflogin repped this.
  7. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Jun 11, 2012
    Thank you for your observations.
    I did not consider all players, just the first hundred that came to me.

    Which one player would you like me to add to the current 99?
     
  8. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    Perhaps a goalkeeper. The one that gains most points from your scoring system!
     
    annoyedbyneedoflogin repped this.
  9. annoyedbyneedoflogin

    Jun 11, 2012
    I added European pre 50's goalkeeper Ricardo Zamora


    Below is a ranking of a hundred players that came to mind, based on a simplified point system :
    Effective skill/productivity(excluding penalties)>influence>success

    1 Pelé, forward, 10,9,10

    2 Di Stéfano, box to box forward, 9,9,9

    3 Maradona, attacking midfielder, 9,9,8, Cruijff, box to box forward, 9,9,8

    5 Schmeichel, keeper, 9,9,7

    6 Messi, forward, 9,8,9, Müller, striker, 9,8,9

    8 Yashin, keeper, 9,8,8, Nordahl, striker, 9,8,8

    10 Sárosi, poly-functional, 9,8,6

    11 Stojkovic, attacking midfielder, 9,8,5

    12 Scarone, forward, 9,7,10

    13 Meazza, forward, 9,7,9, Walter, forward, 9,7,9

    15 Nasazzi, center back, 8,10,10

    16 Suárez-Miramontes, central midfielder, 8,9,8, Rijkaard, attacking defender, 8,9,8

    18 Sindelar, forward, 8,9,7, Laudrup, attacking midfielder, 8,9,7, Moreno, attacking midfielder, 8,9,7

    21 Cristiano Ronaldo, forward, 8,8,9, Zidane, attacking midfielder, 8,8,9

    23 van Basten, striker, 8,8,8, Platini, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Romario, striker, 8,8,8, Ronaldo, striker, 8,8,8, Charlton, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Matthäus, box to box defender, 8,8,8, Baresi, attacking defender, 8,8,8, Sivori, forward, 8,8,8 Puskas, forward, 8,8,8, Riquelme, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8, Passarella, attacking defender, 8,8,8, Sastre, attacking midfielder, 8,8,8 Leônidas, striker, 8,8,8, Kubala, forward 8,8,8

    37 Zamora, keeper, 8,8,7, Netzer, attacking midfielder, 8,8,7, Kopa, attacking midfielder, 8,8,7, Eusebio, forward, 8,8,7, Spencer, forward, 8,8,7, Mazzola, box to box forward, 8,8,7, Moore, center back, 8,8,7, Suárez, forward, 8,8,7, Zsengellér, forward, 8,8,7, Robben, forward 8,8,7 Navas, keeper, 8,8,7

    48 Orsi, forward, 8,7,9, Garrincha, forward, 8,7,9, Buffon, keeper, 8,7,9, Rivaldo, attacking midfielder, 8,7,9

    52 Ronaldinho, forward, 8,7,8, Best, forward, 8,7,8, Zico, attacking midfielder, 8,7,8, Liedholm 8,7,8, attacking midfielder

    56 Zizinho, forward, 8,7,7, Figueroa, attacking defender, 8,7,7

    58 Baggio, forward, 8,7,6, Hagi, attacking midfielder, 8,7,6

    60 Charles, poly-functional, 8,7,5

    61 Henry, striker, 8,6,9

    62 Haynes, attacking midfielder, 8,6,5

    63 Juninho Pernambucano, attacking midfielder, 7,10,7

    64 Cafú, box to box defender, 7,9,10, Beckenbauer, attacking defender, 7,9,10

    66 Desailly, defender, 7,9,9, Schiaffino, attacking midfielder, 7,9,9

    68 Redondo, defensive midfielder, 7,9,8, Francescoli, forward, 7,9,8, Cubillas, attacking midfielder, 7,9,8, Piola, striker, 7,9,8, Mauro Silva, defensive midfielder, 7,9,8

    73 Drogba, striker, 7,9,7

    74 Artime, striker, 7,9,6, da Guia, center back, 7,9,6

    76 Gilmar, keeper, 7,8,10, Gento, attacking midfielder, 7,8,10, Xavi, central midfielder, 7,8,10, Iniesta, attacking midfielder, 7,8,10, R. Carlos 7,8,10, box to box defender

    81 Djalma Santos, defender, 7,8,9

    82 Maldini, defender, 7,8,8, Dalglish, forward, 7,8,8 Falcao, central midfielder, 7,8,8, Raumdeuter, forward, 7,8,8 Gullit, poly-functional, 7,8,8, Figo, attacking midfielder, 7,8,8

    88 Inzaghi, striker, 7,8,7, Juan Ramón Verón, forward, 7,8,7, Nedvěd, attacking midfielder, 7,8,7

    91 van Hanegem, central midfielder, 7,8,6

    92 Rummenigge, box to box forward, 7,7,8, Keegan, box to box forward, 7,7,8, Didi, attacking midfielder, 7,7,8, Modric, central midfielder, 7,7,8

    96 Cavani, striker, 7,7,7, Weah, striker, 7,7,7, Masopust, central midfielder, 7,7,7, Jair da Costa, forward, 7,7,7

    100 Sá, center back, 6,8,10
     
    PuckVanHeel and peterhrt repped this.
  10. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord

    I like your independent thinking :thumbsup: I will finish the top 50 but then probably take a break. I get too annoyed (no pun intended) by all the propaganda that's going on, and I don't have the illusion it will stop, or that Holland will cease to be on the short end of the stick ("Kopa greater world cup player than Cruijff!", "Zidane the greatest football personality!", "Germany and Vic Buckingam played total football before Holland did!", "no infighting in the dutch squad in 1990!" andsoforth). All that nonsense and propaganda (which are sometimes not just opinions or stories about chosen protagonists but false facts) will not stop. Time to close myself off from the Burson/Marsteller and Hill/Knowltons of this world.
     
  11. darov81

    darov81 New Member

    FC Barcelona
    Poland
    Oct 5, 2017
    Puck, do You publish your top 50 , when it will be complete?
    I'm very curious, You are one of the most unbiased person here
     
  12. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Hello :) I'm afraid I'm not entirely neutral (too) but when I claim something I try to.

    It is not my own top 50 but the one of Voetbal International (they did a top 100 for the world in 2017, which wasn't too bad).

    Sometimes I indicate I'd do the ordering in a different way.

    :)
     
  13. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    I thought I’d drop this in here since it pertains to the greatest players.

    Former South American confederation president, Nicolas Leoz, in a 1994 El Gráfico interview chose the top 4 greatest players he had ever witnessed in order.

    1. Ersenio Erico
    2. Di Stefano
    3. Pelé
    4. Maradona


    A98CE260-0CFA-4AF3-A3CC-62A5A3339524.jpeg 2FB3BF41-1875-4008-B0C5-7595832DE247.jpeg
     
    Perú FC and comme repped this.
  14. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    The top rankings of players of Alfredo Di Stefano in mid 1979.

    6C1CF866-79DD-49A8-9B57-6D9ABB8A1660.jpeg

    Source: El Gráfico
     
    annoyedbyneedoflogin repped this.
  15. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
  16. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel Member+

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    His own comments don't fully match with his point assignments?? :confused:
     
  17. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    A question to anyone who is qualified to answer
    Arsenio Erico was highly regarded in his time in fact some consider him the best ever (like Di Stefano for example)
    He is a undisputed legend of the Argentine Primera División but how is it possible he never made top 100 all time lists?
     
  18. peterhrt

    peterhrt Member

    Oct 21, 2015
    Club:
    Leeds United AFC
    In the IFFHS poll in 1999, Erico was ranked 49th in the worldwide vote and tied 8th in the South American vote, one place behind Zico.
     
    carlito86 repped this.
  19. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    I was referring to lists compiled in the 21st century (which players like zizinho and meazza made but Arsenio did not)
    Judging by his record and what has been said of his footballing ability there can’t be too many footballers who have played since 2000 who were his equal
    A commonly cited reason is he apparently choose to not play in a World Cup which would mean his talent was not exposed to a world wide audience
    Another similar case could be Angel Labruna who was too old when he played in a World Cup

    It is not an exaggeration to say many South American legends became overrated because they played on a world stage while those who did not (Moreno,Arsenio,Labruna etc) were equally if not more talented
    Even a a defender like Figueroa is it certain he was inferior to Scirea or baresi who are widely considered the best defenders of all time
     
  20. comme

    comme Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 21, 2003
    I included him as number 12 in my list of strikers.

    The problem is two fold. He was never an international because he played his whole career in Argentina. He also scored a lot of goals in an era where goalscoring was generally very high. There was a season in which two sides conceded over 100 goals in 34 games and one of those teams conceded 135 goals!
     
  21. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid

    Outrageous.do you have a source for this
    In any case was his record high within the context of his own era
    Just a quick check shows his gpg was considerably higher than immy McGrory and but considerably lower than fernando peyroteo

    Also Brazilian striker mario Jardel had one of highest gpg ratio over the past 20 years
    294 goals / 310 games = 0,95 goals per game
    In Brazil,turkey and Portugal (he was finished by the time he came to England)
    There is a case he was the best Brazilian striker after the decline of R9 (even better than Romario post 1999)
    His record for Porto was outrageous and he had a few solid showings in the champions league.
    He should imo warrant a mention if not in the top 100 than the honourable mentions list for sure
     
  22. comme

    comme Moderator
    Staff Member

    Feb 21, 2003
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1939_Argentine_Primera_División

    It was actually 148 goals they conceded in 34 games!
     
  23. carlito86

    carlito86 Member+

    Jan 11, 2016
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    LMFAO
    Crazy because this was one of his highest scoring seasons
    This comfortably puts Swindon town 93/94 in the shade (conceded 100 league goals)
    This has to be one of the worst for sure conceding 4.4 goals per match
    Here is another from the cricket score era of football

    1933 Peruvian Primera División
    Bottom place Sportivo Unión conceded 40 goals in 9 matches:4.4 goals conceded per match
    Surely these teams are the worst teams to play in a top tier league ever
     
  24. poetgooner

    poetgooner Member+

    Nov 20, 2014
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Surely you can't take mainstream rankings at face value. I find the likes of Erico and Figueroa ranked quite highly in the better researched lists.

    However, while it is neither ideal nor fair, I do favour players who have had chances to prove themselves than those who haven't. The likes of Erico, Moreno, and Julinho (considered first choice above Garrincha in 1958, but didn't play in World Cup) are classic examples. They didn't get the kind of chances to prove themselves that they would if they were playing today. It is unfortunate, but without those opportunities, it wouldn't feel right to place them above the people who have proven themselves.
     
  25. msioux75

    msioux75 Member+

    Jan 8, 2006
    Lima, Peru
    I agree.

    Just, to saying that Julinho played at WC 1954, where he was the best winger in the tournament. He proved his class at South America (Copa America) and Europe (shining at Serie-A).
     

Share This Page