Team Owner's Association/NuRock: USL1 super-thread

Discussion in 'United Soccer Leagues' started by wjarrettc, Aug 31, 2009.

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Should USL league structure have ownership involvement?

  1. Yes

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. No

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Mr. Bandwagon

    Mr. Bandwagon Member

    Terremotos
    May 24, 2001
    the Barbary Coast
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    That's kinda the point though. A weak league that has nothing to offer is not going to force anyone "into line" b/c no one needs them.

    So:

    Team owners = egotistical?
    League owners = not egotistical?

    Link?
     
  2. Keystone FC

    Keystone FC New Member

    Apr 10, 2007
    Kettering, OH
    Club:
    Toronto FC
    exactly!
     
  3. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm not saying league owners aren't, but there's usually only one person or group running a league, as opposed to a dozen or more owners or ownership groups, each with the own ideas about what the league's direction should be, etc... It ends up being rule by committee, which usually doesn't work all that well particularly for a business.

    That's why leagues like the NFL, MLB, etc... have a strong league leadership that the owners have agreed to kowtow to. Even egotistical maniacs like Al Davis end up having to follow what Roger Goddell says unless he convinces enough of the owners he's right and the no confidence vote the commish (which very rarely happens. I think Fay Vincent was the last one it happened to in any major sport). Now granted USL is a bit more formal in that "leadership role". But the principle remains the same in that that owners are subservient to the league.

    I just don't see the TOA able to do that. Not with so many disparate personalities involved and so many levels of "breakaway" among even the USL teams interested in going with the TOA.
     
  4. WhiteStar Warriors

    Mar 25, 2007
    St.Pete/Krakow
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    No wonder Rochester Rhinos are not part of the TOA, the owner is a proponent of penalty shoot-outs:

    he talks about in 29:00.......

    http://cdn.cloudfiles.mosso.com/c58802/KG-09-28-09.mp3

    also about the new league:

    32:50........

    Actually he is right about Aaron Davidson, that a infant team and owner shouldn't decide about the new league.

    Looks like MLS2 could happen if a owner talks about it.

    36:00....
     
  5. aimorris

    aimorris Member

    May 2, 2007
    Orlando, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    And that's exactly what TOA is saying - they don't even have the opportunity to "no confidence vote the commish" because they have no official say on what Marcos and Holt want to do for the USL because the owners have nothing to do with the league office.

    You're right, there is one person running the NFL, MLB, NBA... in the interests of the owners. The way you make it sound - if TOA had their way, they'd all sit around a round table and shout ideas on what they wanted to do until something happened. I'm sure they're just looking for the chance to appoint a president/commissioner/board who serves the owners and have the opportunity to vote on league matters. It's not that complicated.
     
  6. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Just because a USL owner talks about it doesn't mean it's going to happen. Not until the MLS starts talking about it is there anything really to discuss.
     
  7. virginfootball

    virginfootball New Member

    Mar 17, 2009
    Club:
    Finn Harps
    Yo Morris...are you reading this in your tea leaves? opportunity...no confidence get your head out of your a#*. There is a new sheriff in town and he is from Nurock..Marcos is GONE yes he has a title and assignment and a lounge chair with a drink on the other side of the ocean. Holt will be back in California in 6 months. I am told that the new sheriff was with the MLS last week. TOA - miami last in the league in attendance a high school volleyball team gets more fans. carolina they do okay. tampa? tampa who? minnesota..read the st.paul newspaper the own money all over town. montral and vancouver are off to MLS in 2011. These 6 teams of which 2 are leaving..the 4 left I suggest the read chapter 11 before they start living it..
     
  8. panicfc

    panicfc Member+

    Dec 22, 2000
    In my chair, typing
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Why is Holt off to California? He's from the Northeast?
     
  9. SoccerPrime

    SoccerPrime Moderator
    Staff Member

    All of them
    Apr 14, 2003
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Marcos and Papadakis are buddies. Everyone knows Marcos brought in NuRock at the last minute because with Cooper or Traffic in control he wouldn't be. Now he is in the same position as he was. His buddies own the majority of the league. He owned a minority stock in the League before NuRock (with Nike/Umbro) and he controls a minority share now.

    As for dismissing all the TOA teams, I think we can point to failures like Cleveland as counter balance to some of the weaker TOA teams. Sure teams like Miami drew like flies, but their owner was rich and it didn't bother their bottom line. Besides aren't percieved pro-USL teams like Portland gone for MLS too?

    It works both ways fella.
     
  10. SoccerPrime

    SoccerPrime Moderator
    Staff Member

    All of them
    Apr 14, 2003
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Philadelphia to be exact. His dad is a founder of the famous youth academy FC Delco. I am sure there is always a job for him there.
     
  11. panicfc

    panicfc Member+

    Dec 22, 2000
    In my chair, typing
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I wasn't going to post that in case Tim didn't want it out there.:p
     
  12. SoccerPrime

    SoccerPrime Moderator
    Staff Member

    All of them
    Apr 14, 2003
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Its public knowledge. I knew it from Google or something like 5 years ago, then when I actually spoke to the man, he just confirmed it.
    I know a lot of pro-TOA don't like Holt, but he is a really nice guy. He is just doing a job and representing his boss. I think we have all been there.
     
  13. panicfc

    panicfc Member+

    Dec 22, 2000
    In my chair, typing
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Heck if Tim wanted he could probably have pretty good job with Philly Union. He's a sharp guy, but I suspect NuRock will want to keep him in place and see what changes he recommends.
     
  14. Dustinho

    Dustinho Member

    May 12, 2000
    So Cal
    I was quite shocked Clark mentioned the possibility of MLS2! Also seems like Saputo is teaching Clark a few things about the birds (TOA) and the bees (USL).
     
  15. jasontoon

    jasontoon Member

    Jan 9, 2002
    Seattle, WA
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Everything except the bolded part is ridiculously naive. The commissioner in any of those leagues serves at the whim of the team owners. The only thing Al Davis, or any other owner, "kowtows to" is the collective will of the majority of the other owners, as enforced by the commissioner. Yes, no-confidence votes are rare because the commish is the owners' guy to begin with - hell, in MLB, he's an actual team owner!

    Let's also remember that membership in the NFL/MLB/NBA/NHL offers teams huge revenue streams and legitimacy that cannot be matched outside those leagues. To put it mildly, the USL does not. If the St. Louis Cardinals decided to join the Frontier League, they'd collapse, and there'd be a rush of ownership groups vying for the rights to put an MLB team in St. Louis. If the Montreal Impact joined some other league, would anybody even notice?

    It sounds like the TOA owners are asking, legitimately, what they're getting from USL1 in return for those league fees. NuRock better come up with a great answer pretty damn quick, because right now it looks like the TOA could do it just as well themselves with Cooper's and Traffic's money.
     
  16. GOALSeattle

    GOALSeattle Member

    Oct 13, 2007
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  17. chapka

    chapka Member+

    May 18, 2004
    Haverford, PA
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You don't see the TOA being able to elect a commissioner? Even though they've been begging the current league owners to let them elect a commissioner for years? Even though the current breakaway started because the league refused even to appoint a commissioner itself?

    You said it yourself: even Al Davis and Jerry Jones are smart enough to know that they need a commissioner to run the league they own. Why exactly don't you think the TOA will be able to see the same thing?

    As for "independence"...here's what you don't get.

    The commissioner's job is to be independent in disputes between the owners, and otherwise to represent the interests of the owners. Period. The last sports commissioner who thought his job was to represent the interests of the sport rather than the owners was Fay Vincent. Which is why he was turfed out and replaced with a commissioner who is a team owner himself.

    What you're not getting is that there is no "league" in any other major sport that is separate from the "owners." What there is is a mechanism that allows the individual owners to resolve disputes among themselves in the way the benefits the maximum number of them.

    That is not something the TOA will be frightened of or upset about. It's what they've been trying to get for years. Your idea that an independent USL would be run like a consensus-based facilitation meeting at a collective farm is a straw man, pure and simple.
     
  18. aimorris

    aimorris Member

    May 2, 2007
    Orlando, FL
    Club:
    Orlando City SC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Could have kept it in the Seattle area thread as it's not really relevant to anything in here but um, thanks.



    I think a structure like the Premier League and the FA is really what the TOA is looking for, except probably a little less independent.

    The Premier League is operated as a corporation and is owned by the 20 member clubs. Each club is a shareholder, with one vote each on issues such as rule changes and contracts. The clubs elect a chairman, chief executive, and board of directors to oversee the daily operations of the league. The Football Association is not directly involved in the day-to-day operations of the Premier League, but has veto power as a special shareholder during the election of the chairman and chief executive and when new rules are adopted by the league.
     
  19. Mr. Caca

    Mr. Caca Member

    Oct 2, 2009
    Montréal
    Club:
    Montreal Impact
    Nat'l Team:
    Canada
  20. jmb321

    jmb321 Member

    Oct 9, 2008
    Based on this article, Papadakis' comments and other information I have access to it is very likely there will be a new second division league playing in 2010.
     
  21. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If that's true either USL 1 or this new second league need to kill the other off fast, as in before the 2011 season. If one or the other lingers it's just going to create an unnecessary divide in US soccer among fans, sponsors, owners, investors, etc... that we don't need at this stage in the game.

    Particularly since it looks like they're not dividing the potential new league and USL one in an East/West manner, which to my mind is the only way they could coexist.
     
  22. WhiteStar Warriors

    Mar 25, 2007
    St.Pete/Krakow
    Club:
    FC Tampa Bay Rowdies
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I translated the page and it looks like that Saputo will have it's own group? and MLS another league?

    If the future of the Impact in the USL ends, the Montreal club would still have two options. First, the impact could choose to form their own league with other owners who support Joey Saputo. Secondly, the impact could evolve into a second division of the MLS that would be created.
     
  23. jw07

    jw07 Member

    May 19, 2008
    Club:
    Colorado Rapids
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Rumor or truth, anyone know about this:

    Tim Holt has sent an e-mail to Players from Minnesota, Carolina, and Miami telling them that they are no longer in contracts to their teams because the three teams have not re-newed their team status by not paying next years league fees by the due date, which are now 30 days past due.

    ??? Anyone...
     
  24. athletics68

    athletics68 Member+

    Dec 12, 2006
    San Diego & San Jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    If that's true it's an interesting twist. But just to play devil's advocate (if I'm correct), weren't those 3 of the teams that were in trouble financially?
     
  25. VioletCrown

    VioletCrown Member+

    FC Dallas
    United States
    Aug 30, 2000
    Austin, Texas
    Club:
    Austin Aztex
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don't. But it makes me wonder why Vancouver and Montreal aren't in your list, as they've been listed as members of the TOA and made strong statements in support of it.

    *sigh*

    I'm really looking forward to all this stupidity being done.
     

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