Sweeping changes to US Soccer? What would you do?

Discussion in 'USA Men' started by CyphaPSU, Oct 10, 2017.

  1. Crawleybus

    Crawleybus Member+

    Oct 18, 2013
    Club:
    Chelsea FC
    Yes blame your failures on the British, how very original, what you need is a German coach, then he would turn you into 'world beaters'.
     
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  2. Mahtzo1

    Mahtzo1 Member+

    Jan 15, 2007
    So Cal
    Agree. didn't mean to imply you meant anything different. There is absolutely no reason to give the other team an unnecessary advantage by scheduling Mexico at the Rose Bowl (for instance) but we don't need to schedule desperately by looking for one of the most inhospitable locations for a soccer game either. Anchorage would be a nice place in the summer but I don't think that is what the poster was suggesting.
     
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  3. HomokHarcos

    HomokHarcos Member+

    Jul 2, 2014
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've seen Brazilians say they decided that it would be best to sacrifice the quality of the local league in order to have all the best Brazilian players in Europe in order to strengthen the national team.
     
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  4. Mahtzo1

    Mahtzo1 Member+

    Jan 15, 2007
    So Cal
    Assuming, of course, that is the actual result, that is not an illogical response. I would guess that citizens of numerous countries share that opinion. I would guess that there are quite a few Guatemaltecos, for example don't mind their players going to MLS if they believe it will help their team get to a world cup. I assume, however, that he is referring to players that are fully developed, or at least developed enough so that they mainly need a higher level of competition than would be availiable at home.

    We have a development problem which we have been addressing with varying levels of success (especially dependent upon who you talk to). MLS, USL and all of the lower levels provide that platform for development. We absollutely need MLS, USL and NASL to be of high enough quality so that it provides the player the proper training and preparation for the next level. I don't get the impression that the argument is about whether or not players should go to Europe but rather when. What is best for the individual may or may not be best for the USMNT and what is best for the USMNT in the short term may or may not be the best long term. If for instance, Pulisic adn ALL of the other top young US youth players stayed in MLS, (they could still move after a period of 2-4 years) it would most likely benefit MLS, be a short term disadvantage for the USMNT and would probably be a poor career choice for SOME of the top young players. It may, however, prove to be a long term benefit to the USMNT and, of course, to MLS. After a period of time, when the quality and overall depth of the young US player continues to improve, having the best of the best go to Europe first may be the best choice. Projecting further, as USL and the quality of the lower leagues improves (and numbers of teams increases as well), there may be no need for the best of the best to travel overseas. (this final scenario most likely would take a very long time...)
     
  5. Marius Tresor

    Marius Tresor Member+

    Aug 1, 2014
    Yes, and failure by the federation to do that is incompetence, and should be grounds for dismissal.
     
  6. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Have 4 ideas...

    Create a position between the coach and the president of US Soccer who could take a long term view.

    Create a culture in the US National team that carries over from player to player regardless of where they were born and if they play in Europe or MLS. Little things like practicing the anthem and learning the history of the sport here and having certain routines when they meet up for training.

    Decide on a primary system and way that we play. Personally would like to see a 4-2-3-1 but open to other ideas. Have this be our "go to" system and everyone who is called in has a role in that system and knows their role.

    Take a long hard look at youth development. There were a lot of issues with this team but at the core this team wasn't as good as the '14, '10', or '06 teams. Go player for player and not a lot of guys you would take from the current crop over those.
     
  7. Poachin_Goalz

    Poachin_Goalz Member

    Jun 17, 2002
    Athens, GA.
    1. Youth Development: our country is so vast and diverse that it is difficult to make sweeping uniform changes. After years of studying the issue, I think that we are losing kids at the middle school age group. My personal experience back in the day was that I played park district soccer up through 6th grade. Starting at 7th grade, the middle schools offered sports where you could represent your school playing against other schools in the city (football, basketball and cross country). Soccer wasn't one of these sports. I would like to see soccer offered as the competitive sports option for middle school vs middle school sports for the Spring quarter. This might be more common now since my day but I don't think so.

    2. MLS Youth Development: It goes beyond just financing a youth academy. I wish that teams would each sponsor a youth league network. The outlay for each MLS team would be $2 mil per year. They would identify 10 counties around the team's area. Each county would get $200K of the 2 mil. The $200K would be divided 4 ways with a U10, U12, U14 and U16 team each receiving $50K. Each team would have 20 players. The $50K would be divided so that each child receives a $1000 college scholarship account. The remaining $30K would go for equipment and travel. This would drastically cut into the expense that each child would have to pay (if any). If a child started at age 8-9 years old, he would have 8-9 grand saved for college by the end. The MLS club would scout the league and cherry pick the best players for their youth team.

    3. College Soccer: I know that people gripe about college soccer's role in player development, but it plays an important part. Bottom line, parents want their kids to go to college. Unfortunately, the combination of gridiron scholarships and Title IX really puts a limit of men's scholarships on offer. MLS clubs can combine to support the Power 5 Conference soccer programs. Example...Atlanta Utd and DC Utd could sponsor the ACC. Rounding off, there are approximately 10 men's teams with 25 players per team= roughly 250 players. They could each throw in $500K and this would give each player a $4K scholarship bump.

    Secondly, each MLS squad could house and sponsor a college All-Star team over the summer that could train along side the MLS team. Atlanta = ACC Atlantic all-stars, DC = ACC Coastal all-stars, New England and New York handle the Big East, Columbus and Chicago = Big Ten, etc. These ALL-STAR teams could play double headers with the MLS squads at select games. Maybe the players would be awarded additional scholarship $$$ for making the team (and to keep the NCSAA at bay)

    4. MLS: I said this on other threads before, but I think that the Beckham rule has hurt the USA player development. The rapid expansion hasn't helped either. Teams were given the green light to go sign foreigners. I think that MLS teams should be given 3 years to implement a "Line Rule." Every position group (defense, midfield, forward) can only have one player that isn't eligible to player for the USMNT (the Canadian teams would be allowed to have USA or Canadian players). This would give our national team coach more players to chose from. In the long run, more players would be produced for export.

    5. USMNT Coach: We need to get somebody on the job who will completely ignore the MLS Hater contingent of the USA fan base. Our program was at it's zenith between 2001-2005. During that time, we had a strong nucleus of MLS players as well as a strong group playing abroad. This is the situation that every future USMNT coach should strive for. Coach Arena effectively had two national teams functioning in parallel at that time. Whenever we play CONCACAF minnoes, we should not have to call in overseas players. Our own league should be strong enough to handle it. When we play a friendly in Europe, we should have enough good players playing there that we don't need to call in MLS players. The best of the two teams are summoned when we play Mexico, Costa Rica, Gold Cup, World Cup. From 2001-2005 we had the closest that we have ever had to this situation. Kids can go directly to European clubs to try out. More power to them. But it is necessary for MLS to develop players too. Get used to this fact or please get off the bandwagon. Klinnsman's biggest sin was he never fully grasped or embraced this. When you are trying to build and hit above your weight, you have to have a fighter's mental edge. You can't have a coach that is inferring that your league (and by extension you as a player) is inferior. This might be true behind the scenes but the coach's job is to build the players up any way he can (mentally, physically, technically etc). Of course if the national team coach is the one who is providing technical training them our system has already failed.

    Anyway...just a few pie-in-the-sky ideas. They will never happen. We need the $$$$$$.
     
  8. miketd1

    miketd1 Member

    Jun 14, 2007
    Make all the player development materials free online:
    • ball mastery drills and videos
    • practice session ideas
    • all coaching licensing materials (actual licensing would obviously be $)
    • videos of all DA games (sort of like how the NFL has ALL-22 game film)
    The last part is so the public can help critique and curate players. If I'm watching a relatively obscure kid and "see" something on film, I should be able to point it out and post my opinion to a blog or twitter account. The more everyone talks about high level, DA youth soccer, the more eyeballs will be on the players and the lesser the risk that kids go unnoticed. If that sounds crazy, this sort of thing already happens in AAU basketball on YouTube.

    The other stuff is so that Joe Dad volunteer coach can learn about the game, put together a meaningful practice session, and be able to tell Bob the striker to check out video modules 3.4-3.7 in order to work on his footwork and tell Tim the attacking MF to watch video modules 6.5-7.5 to work on techniques to check his shoulder and make appropriate support runs.

    Put a link to this page at the top right of every web page even remotely associated with US Soccer (you too, MLS!). Call it the "Upper 90 Project" or something else clever. Publicize it during national and MLS games.

    I don't see how this would be a cost-prohibitive or otherwise impossible thing to do.
     
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  9. HomokHarcos

    HomokHarcos Member+

    Jul 2, 2014
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    According to this video, an A license in Germany costs 600 dollars, compared to 4000 in the USA. As a result US Soccer makes twice the revenue of Germany from licensing despite only having a third the amount of coaches with an A license.
     
  10. The411

    The411 Member

    Oct 12, 2013
    Have to have a national identity and play style that comes down from USSF.

    Kids need to be playing on tiny fields until they are teenagers.

    Bigger focus on development and less on winning.

    The issue is getting to kids early and training good habits.
     
  11. firefan2001

    firefan2001 Member+

    Dec 27, 2000
    Oswego, Illinois
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Antonio Conte might be available. What do you think?
     
  12. HomokHarcos

    HomokHarcos Member+

    Jul 2, 2014
    Club:
    AS Roma
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    There's a lot that has to be done other than just hiring a suitable coach.
     
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  13. firefan2001

    firefan2001 Member+

    Dec 27, 2000
    Oswego, Illinois
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Yeah, but it would be a good start hiring Conte.
     
  14. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    why does pro/rel mean more competition and better quality players and what does that have to do with the usmnt?
     
  15. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    you can't have a 'go to' system..what if like now you don't have two quality DM? and you don't have two quality wings? then what? you hire a coach with and its his job to pick the best system/players. the TDs job is to help us soccer get as many skilled players at every position possible for the coach to chose from.
     
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  16. LouisianaViking07/09

    Aug 15, 2009
    we need a really good technical director. especially at youth levels
     
  17. VegasFulham

    VegasFulham Member

    Fulham
    United States
    Oct 23, 2017
    Las Vegas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    End pay for play and focus entirely on the inner cities where the working class kids are playing every day in parks, streets etc. I watch the kids play football on my street and there are eight year olds out here dribbling around five other kids and scoring. Legit skill moves too. I doubt any of them could cover the thousands it takes to play youth club football though.


    Also, call in players who arent established in the team yet and hire Marcelo Bielsa or Tata Martino as manager. Playing attractive football is the key to getting more attention on the team and more kida wanting to choose football as a career path. Bielsa and Martino both have attractive styles.
     
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  18. Master O

    Master O Member+

    Jul 7, 2006
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Where would anyone even begin with this sorry federation?
     
  19. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One of the issues with international soccer is how little time the players have to work together. I think it would benefit the US to have a system to fall back in when guys are struggling to be on the same page. And the 4-2-3-1 was merely a suggestion but if you look at the team we have historically had had strong box-to-box/d-mids and pacy wide men (would hesitate to call them wingers).

    Not saying we always play this formation it's just a default setting that we can always go back to that historically fits the US player pool.
     
  20. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    I understand what you are saying but the issue of little time to work together...is true everyplace and its part of what makes international soccer tough.

    If they have a 'fall back' formation that allows them to be no the same page...then they are ok and there is no problem. The issue with international football is you have a bunch of players who play in club teams with very different styles and its the coaches job to select players and a style that works, meaning you aren't always going to select the 23 most talented players.

    people need to move on from the past. this entire cycle they lacked pacy wingers who can score and box to box mids. you can't look back when deciding what to play in the future its different players.
     
  21. owian

    owian Member+

    Liverpool FC, San Diego Loyal
    May 17, 2002
    San Diego
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Ummm Not sure I agree with you here. Our best player was Pulisic who plays as a pacy wide player with his club team.

    And while Bradley did not have a great Hex, and Jones is no longer in real contention it's not like the player pool is full of creative number 10's who were being squeezed out by the formation.

    Basically not entirely sure what you are arguing? Are you saying we should create and adapt the formation to the form of the players on a match by match basis?
     
  22. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    now I am confused lol

    I said there was a lack of pacey talented wingers...

    you named pulisic whose best position is centrally with the us team...in case you didn't notice in the difference between the CR match and Panama....but then I noticed you didn't name anyone else....so either way....you are agreeing with the lack of talent on the wings.

    bradley didn't have a great hex...or a great fourth round...or GC..or really a great anything internationally in like 5 years so yeah its a blank stop.

    you then lament a lack of creative 10s....well you picked the formation which needs a creative 10 in it...so are you now not ok with a 4-2-3-1 no matter of what players are options? By the way the answer at everything attacking md position is pulisic and thats the problem.

    I am saying the coach/staff has a very complicated job. It can't be decided before they pick the players.

    The staff has to look at the player pool...pick each players best position...find a formation based on that best 11 that works.

    Meaning you find the strengths/weakness and pick a formation/strategy that plays to the strengths and hides the weaknesses. They also can't be a one size fits all, they need backups for each of those players/positions and need to be able to think ahead...if we go with this formation and we are down two goals early...what can I do to solidify the defense and get those two goals back..and the opposite is true if they are up to goals. they also need to consider the other teams and how they are going to play. There is no simple answer so the answer to ur orig comment is they absolutely can not pick a formation right now...they don't even have players to find out if they fit that formation.

    the only thing we can really ask right now is a)I hope they pick a good President/TD/Coach b)I hope that unlike BA in the last two matches that coach has more then one plan/lineup.
     
  23. Rob55

    Rob55 Member

    Nov 20, 2011
    As a nation we're improving in soccer culture, youth development, youth coaching etc. The men's national team failed due simply to USMNT politics and arrogance/lack of effort amongst the veteran players. Nothing more. Sad that we choked and won't make the WC in 2018, but perhaps its a blessing for accelerating our improvement as a national soccer team. We can't squander this opportunity by "staying the course/business as usual".

    Club soccer/pay to play needs reassessed as many have mentioned. Latino immigrants and upper middle class Americans are all we are pooling from and the majority of the middle class making up majority of youth soccer players in this country are getting tossed aside. Find the good ones in youth rec. and give them an outlet to the next level/better training without the high price tag families can't affort of club/pay to play travel teams.

    Use Pulisic as a model for development success and replicate. We should be able to find/finish many Pulisic technically/athletically equivalent level players in this country every couple years in reality just based on numbers.

    Just some ideas.
     
  24. a_new_fan

    a_new_fan Member+

    Jul 6, 2006
    pulisic is the
    pulisic is the rare one he can't be the model. He had two soccer playing parents took him all over europe to train with big clubs had the finances to pay for him to play anywhere.

    the pulisic types won't get missed. its the kid whose parents have to use their money to feed their family, can't afford to get their kid into big time travel teams that they need to help/find. There are kids out there with raw ability who right now are getting terrible coaching and have zero visibility because they can only afford to play on their cheapest local teams.

    you can't get rid of pay for play its unfortunate but its a fact.

    by the way don't listen to guys like Gary Kleiban who are all over twitter ranting an raving, they have motives to do what they are doing at it has a lot to do with their own pockets.
     
  25. metnostar

    metnostar Member

    Jun 28, 2001
    It wouldn't pay off for at least 10-15 years, but more important than any organized development program or leagues is getting American kids to play pickup soccer for fun from an early age. Great ball skills are self taught in hours and hours of playground and backyard games from age 5-6 on
     

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